time for a few general questions for a beginner

[Andy in NY]

okay, i have gotten into the grove of the forum, made a few posts and now im ready to dive in... i have a few general questions about my new/used 1973 MFG Gypsy 14 with a 50 hp 'rude.


1) the previous owner installed a fish/depth finder. where he attached it to the transom, he just screwed it in. should there be something there to stop water from getting into the boat through the screwholes? what should i use? how should it be applied?

2) next to the ignition key, there is a silver button. the wiring for it is tied into the ignition wires. what is this button?

3) battery/electrical... right now the boat has a regular car/automotive battery in it.
a)should there be a special marine battery? what about deep cycle?

b)there is currently a fish finder, lights and bilge running off the boats electrical. i want to add a stereo, an automotive horn, some "interior" lights for night boating and possibly a vhf radio. will a standard battery and the charging capacity of the 1973 50 hp rude handle all of this?

4) as of now, the motor needs work. the PO stated that the prop spins, but not enough to move the boat. the motor is strong.

a)he attempted to fix it himself, and got as far as trying to remove the lower unit from the power head, but looks like he BROKE 2 bolts. is this going to be a real big problem to remove the remainder of the 2 broken off bolts?

b) he gave me a parts motor, unknown condition, with it. after the rapairs are made, i would like to try to sell this motor. it is also a 73 rude 50hp. how much can i expect to fetch for an unknown condition motor?

5)there is a blackish spotting all over the boat, inside and out. the paint seems to be hand painted (can see brush marks), unknown type of paint. what can i use to try to remove the spotting? would regular bleach work?



a big thanks to everyone who can help me out with my questions. i will post a few pics of some of the problems when i have the chance.

 

[studlymandingo]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

The pics would be most helpful in identifying the black spots.

1. Some 3M 4200 would be good to put in the screw holes prior to re-installing them.

2. Hard to say without knowing which wires it is attached to, my guess is it is a starter button, probably to fix something that was wrong with the ignition switch. Could be a button for the horn though, tied in to a power wire going to the ignition.

3. You should have a marine starting battery; the auto batteries are not designed to handle all of the sloshing around a battery will get being in a boat.

b. maybe; an isolator and an additional battery (deep cycle) would be a prudent install. I replaced all my interior lighting with LED to reduce battery drain.

4. It is possible the prop hub is spinning and nothing with the lower unit.

a. It isn't going to be easy; you'll want some good quality penetrating oil like PB Blaster, drill bits, a few easy-outs (likely you're gonna break one or two which presents a new problem altogether), and an oxy-cetelene torch setup.

b. unknown condition = unknown price I would make sure I am not going to need it for the parts after trying to remove the broken bolts (see 4a.)

5. Bleach and water mixed with elbow grease.​

 

[QC]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Wow, the studly one has this nailed, going to be a short thread. However, I did see something he missed. You should consider a booster cushion or something, Andy. I am not sure you will be able to see over the bow . . .

Welcome to iboats!!

 

[Andy in NY]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

okay, a few follow up questions...


1. Some 3M 4200 would be good to put in the screw holes prior to re-installing them.

should i unscrew the mount for the (i dont know what its called) part that is attached to the transom, then fill the holes and reinstall?

2. Hard to say without knowing which wires it is attached to, my guess is it is a starter button, probably to fix something that was wrong with the ignition switch. Could be a button for the horn though, tied in to a power wire going to the ignition.

thats what i thought possibly as well, but the ignition has a "start" position, so im not sure. are there any other possibilities?


3. You should have a marine starting battery; the auto batteries are not designed to handle all of the sloshing around a battery will get being in a boat.
b. maybe; an isolator and an additional battery (deep cycle) would be a prudent install. I replaced all my interior lighting with LED to reduce battery drain.

so i am going to buy a marine deep cycle then. would it be a good idea to carry a second battery as a back up? how long should it hold a charge without being connected to anything?

4. It is possible the prop hub is spinning and nothing with the lower unit.

i dont understand...




b. unknown condition = unknown price I would make sure I am not going to need it for the parts after trying to remove the broken bolts (see 4a.)

what i was saying was to sell the motor AFTER i use any parts i may need.


i will post some pics of the "black spots" later today.

Wow, the studly one has this nailed, going to be a short thread. However, I did see something he missed. You should consider a booster cushion or something, Andy. I am not sure you will be able to see over the bow . . .

Welcome to iboats!!

 

[SeaKaye12]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Andy in NY:

RE: Prop Spin.... Props have a rubber bushing of sorts that is between the blade portion of the prop and the prop hub (the part that slides on the shaft)

The purpose of the rubber is to absorb some of the shock if the prop hits something while spinning. Sometimes the rubber deteriorates and allows the shaft to spin without turning the prop.

You can sometimes test this by scribing a mark on the prop hub and a matching mark on the blade portion. Run the boat and see if the alignment of the marks change.

The fix is to have the prop re-built or replace it.

I'll let others address your other questions.

Chuck

 

[Andy in NY]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Andy in NY:

RE: Prop Spin.... Props have a rubber bushing of sorts that is between the blade portion of the prop and the prop hub (the part that slides on the shaft)

The purpose of the rubber is to absorb some of the shock if the prop hits something while spinning. Sometimes the rubber deteriorates and allows the shaft to spin without turning the prop.

You can sometimes test this by scribing a mark on the prop hub and a matching mark on the blade portion. Run the boat and see if the alignment of the marks change.

The fix is to have the prop re-built or replace it.

I'll let others address your other questions.

Chuck

so what would be the best way to troubleshoot this? i would like to get it taken care of over the winter so i can have it in the water in the spring... how would i be able to tell if that was the problem? if i were to fix it, how could i tell if it was corrected without the boat being in the water?


should i ask this in the engines section?

 

[PondTunes]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Question #1: The item in question is known as a transducer.

Question #2: What color are the wires attached to said silver button? If they are going back in the engine harness My guess would be an electric choke.

Question #3: You need a marine cranking battery. Your outboard charging system will be able to handle your accessories & 1 cranking battery well enough but it will not support a dual battery setup.
If you are going to have long periods of sitting still with the radio/lights/accessories running It would be advisable to install a Deep Cycle marine battery and run your accessories off of it. You would need to charge this battery when you got back to shore as your outboard would have a real hard time trying to keep the deep cycle up. You could always add multiple deep cycle's in parallel for extended run time. Switching to LED lighting will also put much less drain on your batteries than traditional bulbs.

Question #4: He is asking if the center of the prop where the spline fits could possibly be spinning and the blades not spinning. You could probably shift the engine into gear (with it off) and try rotating the prop blades by hand, if they turn easily and the center spline/hub isn't moving the problem is in the prop and not the lower unit.

 

[External Combustion]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

On a '73 Gypsy, that button by the ignition switch is a choke button as has been stated.

As to the ability of your boat to handle the additional electrical needs, a few simple calculations will answer your questions.

Take the amp draw of current of each device that you wish to operate (found in the literature supplied with the devices or sometimes on the nameplate) multiply each amp draw times the hours that you expect to run them in any given day on the water and you will have your amp hour use.

Your engine's ability to recharge the batteries is the amp rating on the altenator times how many hours a day that it will be ran.

I think the 50 HP 'Rude has a 30 Amp alternator. (the real 'rude gurus will be gracious to correct me if I am wrong, thanks guys!) If you plan to run your engine for three hours a day, then you would have 3 hrs X 30 amps = 90 amphours of electricity to burn.

Running lights will consume around 70 watts or 5.8 amps, a booming stereo around 16 amps, fishfinder around 5 amps, single bilge pump around 5 amps, interior lights 3.5 amps. If you were to run each device 4 hours then your total load would be 141.2 amp hours.

This would leave you short 51.2 amp hours. There are two ways you can make up for this. 1) run your engine longer, 2) use a second battery that you shore charge.

If you go the second route (which is safer because you always want the engine to start when you are far from home) then a knowledgeable counterman at the local car parts store or marine supply can walk you through what you need to buy and how to install it. A simple way to tell if there is a chance that the counter man knowas what he is doing is to ask him how to hook up a dwell meter to set your points. If you get a blank stare, move on or make another post here.

The price you get for a parts motor is never as much as the part off of it that you will need in the next year. Of course the general peversity of inatimate objects says that if you keep the parts motor, you will never need a part off of it. Personally I think it would be cheap insurance just to clutter up a corner of the garage.

Work out your own figures and good luck!

Owner of a '71 Gypsy with an 85 horse 'Rude.

 

[pduquette]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Andy , did you get to try the boat/motor in the water before you bought it?
If you didn't , I'll suggest one to get a good base line of what your "going to fix" . Read the "awakening a sleeping outboard" post then give her a spin . I'd start by just backing the boat down a quiet boat ramp -still stapped to the trailer and run your motor (in the water) to test how well it runs . then place the motor in gear and see if the prop is slipping . if you get lots of thrust then take it out for a ride . watch your tach as you go to full throttle , if you get arround 5000/5500 rpm before full throttle your prop is slipping or the wrong size . If you don't get the rpm in that range-preferably higher end -you need a different prop.

 

[Andy in NY]

Re: time for a few general questions for a beginner

Andy , did you get to try the boat/motor in the water before you bought it?
If you didn't , I'll suggest one to get a good base line of what your "going to fix" . Read the "awakening a sleeping outboard" post then give her a spin . I'd start by just backing the boat down a quiet boat ramp -still stapped to the trailer and run your motor (in the water) to test how well it runs . then place the motor in gear and see if the prop is slipping . if you get lots of thrust then take it out for a ride . watch your tach as you go to full throttle , if you get arround 5000/5500 rpm before full throttle your prop is slipping or the wrong size . If you don't get the rpm in that range-preferably higher end -you need a different prop.

well, the only problem is that the PO started to take the lower unit off, and broke 2 bolts, so i would have to extract those and replace first... otherwise it sounds like a good idea. snow will be flying any day here, so i am going to see how soon i can get that taken care of.