NO SPARK....ignition coil???

ryan944

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Jan 30, 2010
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hi i have a 1985volvo penta aq125 b.i just replaced the ignition coil and it ran great for a few weeks, broke down on the water, no spark. got it in the garage put new rotor, plugs, wires, switch kit, and another coil....still nothing.i have good pos and neg to the coil but nothing out.i also tried testing the purple wire going into the capacitor on the side of the distributer and that has power when the key is on.this is were im not sure if what im doing is right, i took off the distributer cap and turned on the key so the power was going into the capacitor and put a test light on the other side of it to see if power would go through....nothing. would that be the right way to test the capacitor, or does anyone have any ideas of what this could be???
 

Don S

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

got it in the garage put new rotor, plugs, wires, switch kit, and another coil....

What is a switch kit? Is that the points ??????
 

havasuboatman

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

You have a good negitive to the coil? Do you mean a continuous negitive? Not supposed to have a continuous ground at the coil negitive terminal.
Did your tach quit working also? A fried tach will keep your coil from charging by continually grounding the negitive terminal of the coil.
 

airdvr1227

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

Had that problem last summer....loose ground wire maybe?
 

ryan944

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

so i did more research and found out that i have been puting on the wrong ignition coil i just got the same one that the previous owner must have put on witch was wrong. the aq125 b requires a coil with an internal resistor, witch means there is no external resistor?? is this right? the coil i have put on says it requires an external resistor, witch would explain why i had to replace the cap in the distributer and the points? too much power going through?if this is right than what other parts could i have damaged by putting on the wrong coil?


and yes its a steady ground to the coil but the tach is good thanks for any help
 

Don S

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

The ONLY purpose of that external resistor, or the internal resistor in the coil is to control the voltage to the points. And all that does is makes the points last longer.
In newer model electronic ignitions, the resistor is not needed.
Someone will probably bring up the Pertronix as using the resistors, but that is because they are replacements for points, not coils and resistors. So they made them usable for the voltage available with a points system just to keep things simple.
 

ryan944

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

so your saying that the new coil that i just put in (no internal resistor) is ok for this engine and the only downfall is that it will wear out the points quicker? do you think the last one i put in may have worn out any other parts that could be the cause to the problem im having now?


and being that the aq125b requires a coil with an internal resistor there is no external resistor hidden somewere that may need to be replaced? I noticed that on the distributer were the wire comes off the points and out the side of the distributer theres a little round electrical piece mounted to the side of the distributer inline between points and coil i cant figure out what it is does or how to test if its good. does any one know???
 

Alpheus

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

and yes its a steady ground to the coil but the tach is good thanks for any help

Did you confirm this with a Ohm-meter? It should not be a direct short to ground...
 

Don S

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

so your saying that the new coil that i just put in (no internal resistor) is ok for this engine and the only downfall is that it will wear out the points quicker?
Yeah, it burns them up and they stop working. Quickly.

do you think the last one i put in may have worn out any other parts that could be the cause to the problem im having now?

It's possible. If you answer these 3 questions, it will make troubleshooting a lot easier.

1. Do you have points?

2. I asked earlier what the switch kit was, no answer. is it the points? If no, then what is it?

3. Do you have an external resistor on your engine?
 

captmello

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

I noticed that on the distributer were the wire comes off the points and out the side of the distributer theres a little round electrical piece mounted to the side of the distributer inline between points and coil i cant figure out what it is does or how to test if its good. does any one know???

Are you refering to the condenser? I don't know how to test the condenser but if it goes bad, no spark. It's a normal tune up item.
 

ryan944

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

Yea i was talking about the points when i said switch kit(new points plugs wires coil and rotor) and i have no idea were to look for an external resister or if i even have one


Thanks for that diagram too, thats the exact part i was trying to describe.#5 the condenser, what does it do and does any one know how to test it?
 

Alpheus

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

You can check the condenser with a capacitance meter.

Here is a little light reading about what that little thing does...


The main purpose of the capacitor "condenser" in points and coil ignition system is to both slow the buildup and collapse of the field in the coil and to cause a "damped oscillation" to take place in the coil when the points open.

What happens is that when the points close (and short out the capacitor), a strong magnetic field very quickly builds-up in the primary circuit of the coil. Incidentally, a small and insignificant spark is produced when the points close, similar to the spark produced when they open when there is no capacitor in the circuit.

When the points open (and un-short the capacitor), the field in the coil collapses and the counter emf generated by the collapsing field charges the capacitor. The resistance to a changing voltage that is characteristic of a capacitor slows the collapse of the field and this slight slowing of the collapse contributes to a more effecient coupling of energy to the secondary (high voltage) winding of the coil.

The damped oscillation (otherwise known as a "ringing oscillation") is caused when the field pushes energy to the capacitor then, after the field has collapsed, the capacitor pushes energy back to the coil rebuilding the field somewhat. This happens several times until the energy dissipated by the high voltage sparks has used up all the primary energy that was dumped into the coil when the points were closed. Usually, about 4 or 5 cycles of charge/discharge occur before the energy poops-out and this all happens within about 1/1000th of a second so what you think is one nice hot spark is actually several less energetic sparks all occuring in a very short time.

Another way to describe a damped oscillation is to liken it to the striking of a bell. When struck, the bell vibrates at what is called it's "resonant frequency". This is the frequency at which the bell shape is happiest at vibrating at and, naturally, the bell rings much louder at this frequency than at any other. In the coil-capacitor circuit, the two components make an electrically resonant circuit so the coil "rings". When it rings, it does so very loudly, hence the big, fat spark when it's happily resonant.

So, when everything is working right, the capacitor does several things, (1): The capacitor slows the first field collapse and build-up after the points open, causing a better energy transfer and a hotter spark, (2): The damped oscillation gives several of these hotter sparks and, (3) because the voltage rise uopn the opening of the points is slowed by the capacitor, the points can open faster than the voltage rises, keeping arcing to a minimum.

As a note, points will arc even with a capacitor across them if they are opened very slowly. That's why the cam ramp for point-and-coil ignition on slow engines must be very steep if they are to run well at low speeds.
 

Bondo

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

Yea i was talking about the points when i said switch kit

Ayuh,... Did you Set them right,..?? Gap,..?? Dwell,..?? Is there Power at the Points,..??
 

ENSIGN

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Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

If you have the points set right disconnect the tach and see if it runs.If the engine won't start and run how can you say the tach is good.
 

havasuboatman

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904
Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

so i did more research and found out that i have been puting on the wrong ignition coil i just got the same one that the previous owner must have put on witch was wrong. the aq125 b requires a coil with an internal resistor, witch means there is no external resistor?? is this right? the coil i have put on says it requires an external resistor, witch would explain why i had to replace the cap in the distributer and the points? too much power going through?if this is right than what other parts could i have damaged by putting on the wrong coil?


and yes its a steady ground to the coil but the tach is good thanks for any help

YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO HAVE A STEADY GROUND TO THE NEGETIVE POST OF THE COIL!!!!
You only get a ground there when the coil is to discharge.
A STEADY GROUND AT THE COIL MEANS YOU GET NO SPARK!
 

zbnutcase

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Sep 19, 2009
Messages
2,055
Re: NO SPARK....ignition coil???

Some of the Bosch rotors have a resistor built into them that can go bad and drive you nuts. Check for continuity between the tip of the rotor and where the center carbon rides, if none, bad rotor, no spark.'nutcase
 
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