Bow lifitng way too high on 13ft SmokerCraft

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

Hey guys,

New to this forum and new to boating. Just picked up a 13ft SmokerCraft (2007) with a Yamaha 9.9 4-Stroke Motor (1999) I think!

It's just something to get us into boating, we only really want it for the WA lakes and fishing with the two little ones... Boat and Motor are in really good shape, guy who owned it never really used it. However, he didn't sell it with the motor he was using with it.

Here's my problem. I took it out a few days ago for the first time, after braving my nerves to use a boat ramp for the first time :lol::lol::lol: Motor started right up and seemed really quiet. Took off from the dock and all was well. Once I was out a little way I wanted to see what it could do... I mean it's a small fishing boat so I'm not expecting to get up on a plane ... As soon as I applied a little power the bow just started raising up, like way high and the motor just seemed to want to go deeper in the water and it slowed me way down. The water wasn't that far from coming in the boat! It felt dangerous and my wife said she was having a good laugh from the shore :facepalm:

I went home, did some research and realized that the motor was all the way out on the tilt (far from transom) so I moved it to the closest setting to the transom. I had high hopes that this would fix the issue and took it back out on the lake today... Same issue, I don't even think it's any better, maybe a little but not really noticable. Now, when I have my wife and the kids sit at the front it's much better as the bow is forced down, but even if my 2yo moves towards me (at the back) I can feel the weight change and power decrease.

I understand it's a small, light boat but I don't want to do anything silly in it and I wont always have my wife and kids to ballast the boat

Here is what I know... My transon is 20" and the Yamaha 9.9 Motor is 23"... The cavitation plate? is about 2-3 inches below the hull. Is the motor an inch or two too long? Would that make all that difference?

I have spent a long time Googling and reading issues regarding this but it seems to be mainly focused around power boats and speed, big motors etc... I'm talking about the bow lifting up at 2mph!!!! Please help with ideas and suggestions if possible... Want to be safe with the family on the water! Thank you!

 

[Sea Rider]

You have 4 issues :

-Way underpowered 9.9 HP OB
-Badly propped.
-Badly trimmed.
-Deck weight badly distributed.

Does OB sits at the "sweet transom height " ?

If waterf flow at speed passes above upper small water deflector plate, lower leg will produce water splashes outwards or over transom, extra drag that will definitely slow combo down. Post a pic of that 9.9 shot sideways exposing both horizontal plates.

Mean time, what need to do ;

Float boat alone, move trim pin to a hole for OB to sit at 90?, to test, sit at middle deck towards bow, will need to throtttle with extended arm or get a tiller extension .Go full throttle, bow should rise just a bit till boat planes out.

From there, install an induction tach, on a wot spin solo boating check max achieved wot revs, can go from there for a prop maximization to a less pitch prop to pull wot revs higher, will have better hole shot which is a must count with...

Happy Boating

 

[gm280]

First thing, :welcome: aboard. Nice to have you join us...

Getting use to a boat some times is a little intimidating. Most every boat will have a bow raise when starting off and getting up on a plane. And usually the closer the engine is to the transom helps it accomplish that quicker. So if you are alone, try and see if the bow will drop over and get on that plane. If so, it is going to go faster then you have ever gone in that boat yet. And the reason why is because the hull is up out of the water more and therefore reducing the drag on the hull from the water.. That is how boats work.

What jumps out to me is you stating that the cavitation plate is 2" to 3" below the bottom of the hull. That is way too low. It needs to be level with the bottom of the hull. That will change the handling of the boat a lot. So you need to remount the engine to accomplish that level and try it again.

And then one you get use to how it handles, you can try moving the tilt of the engine out some to see if that improves the handling better or not. Once you find the best tilt, leave it there and happy boating. JMHO

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

Sea Rider gm280 Thank you so much for replying. Nice to know there are people willing to spend time to help others!!!

I have done a little more research an the Motor I have is a 9.9HP 1992, Yamaha. It's an electric start, 4-stroke with model # T9.9EL HQ. I will include some pictures to better help explain and show my setup. The Prop has a 11 (small 3) then 4 x 9 1/4 - R stamped on it. From a little research I have found that corrolates to size, pitch etc. I think the 11/3 is the size? The 9 1/4 is ptich? Just not sure what the 4 or thr R stand for. Would a 4 blade prop help as I have read they help with stern lift? The boat is really light and I am about 175lbs. The gas is under the middle left seat / storage box and the motor on the back. Other than life jackets we have been going light.

gm280, thajnks for the advice. Are you suggesting that I should just power through the bow lifting and hope it flattens out on a plane? Is it even possible to plane that boat? My issue is, with very little power I move forward at low speed with a little bow up, as soon as I apply power to the motor it's like it goes even slower and wow that bow rises... I don't know what is "normal" and I just didn't seem to be getting anywhere :facepalm:

sea Rider, thanks for your adivce. I have taken some pics this morning that will hopefully give you a better idea. Let me know if there is anything I missed. I may well be under powered with the 9.9. I knew it wasn't gonna be any speed demon but I have never experienced a bow rising so much and not going anywhere. If the bow were to rise and I felt like I was moving forward that would be great, but this almost feels like the motor just want to eat more water at the back and seems to just slow me down and bring that bow up, I was actually worried the wind was gonna flip it lol.

Thank you so much for the input so far. I look forward to fixing the issues and at least having fun on the water this summer!!!

Update: I spent about 40 minutes taking and editing to size some pictures but upon trying to post it says I'm not authorized to add attachments. :blue:

 

[gm280]

Sea Rider gm280 Thank you so much for replying. Nice to know there are people willing to spend time to help others!!!

I have done a little more research an the Motor I have is a 9.9HP 1992, Yamaha. It's an electric start, 4-stroke with model # T9.9EL HQ. I will include some pictures to better help explain and show my setup. The Prop has a 11 (small 3) then 4 x 9 1/4 - R stamped on it. From a little research I have found that corrolates to size, pitch etc. I think the 11/3 is the size? The 9 1/4 is ptich? Just not sure what the 4 or thr R stand for. Would a 4 blade prop help as I have read they help with stern lift? The boat is really light and I am about 175lbs. The gas is under the middle left seat / storage box and the motor on the back. Other than life jackets we have been going light.

gm280, thajnks for the advice. Are you suggesting that I should just power through the bow lifting and hope it flattens out on a plane? Is it even possible to plane that boat? My issue is, with very little power I move forward at low speed with a little bow up, as soon as I apply power to the motor it's like it goes even slower and wow that bow rises... I don't know what is "normal" and I just didn't seem to be getting anywhere :facepalm:

sea Rider, thanks for your adivce. I have taken some pics this morning that will hopefully give you a better idea. Let me know if there is anything I missed. I may well be under powered with the 9.9. I knew it wasn't gonna be any speed demon but I have never experienced a bow rising so much and not going anywhere. If the bow were to rise and I felt like I was moving forward that would be great, but this almost feels like the motor just want to eat more water at the back and seems to just slow me down and bring that bow up, I was actually worried the wind was gonna flip it lol.

Thank you so much for the input so far. I look forward to fixing the issues and at least having fun on the water this summer!!!

Update: I spent about 40 minutes taking and editing to size some pictures but upon trying to post it says I'm not authorized to add attachments. :blue:

Yea you have to post at least three posting before it allows you to do pictures. So try again and see how it works. But you also have to keep the size under 700kb for still shots. I don't know about video.

I too would love to see the pictures and that will explain a lot of things. As far as being able t plane the hull. I honestly can't tell you yet. But I did own a 12 foot deep "V" hull with a 9.8 Mercury and it planed out. So we will see.

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

Yea you have to post at least three posting before it allows you to do pictures. So try again and see how it works. But you also have to keep the size under 700kb for still shots. I don't know about video.

I too would love to see the pictures and that will explain a lot of things. As far as being able t plane the hull. I honestly can't tell you yet. But I did own a 12 foot deep "V" hull with a 9.8 Mercury and it planed out. So we will see.

Great to know! This will be my 3rd post so I will try to upload the images after this!

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

​ ​ ​ ​

 

[gm280]

Sorry but pictures didn't come through.

 

[Sea Rider]

While pics are willing to be seen, just a short explanation :

A 9.9 HP is a very underpowered OB, worse if being a 4 strokes, see if technically can bump that OB to a 15 HP along a prop maximization.

This bow rise attitude described is normal to happen, hull wants to rise out of the water to plane but OB it's not doing it's homework right, to much hull drag to overcome fast, the more you throttle the more bow will rise.

Asume deck weight, passengers are evenly distributed, right ? meantime to have fun will need to throttle OB to a point that achieves combo to run parallel to water level, hull will have less water drag and slide much better at a reduced fast displacement speed.

Will combo plane with 1 up, say driver alone ? Sit on middle hull towards bow, with extended arm go full throttle, does combo planes ?

Happy Boating

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

Hey!

Thaks for the updates. I did load a few pictures and do see them in the thread above your last replies. Maybe I tried to upload too many. I did spend about 2 hours re-sizing them over again until they worked!!! :grumpy: I'll try again below.

​ ​

 

[flyingscott]

How long is the shaft of the motor. It looks like you have a longshaft motor when you need a shortshaft.

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

flyingscott Thanks for the message, you know that's kinda what I was thinking. I messured the transom and its about bang on 20", however when I messured the motor I think it's about 23"... Here is the motor code: T9.9 ELHQ. I think the "L" is for Long Shaft? I know there is an idustry standard but are these Yamaha's a little longer than the standard Long Shaft!? I guess if that is the issue I could either replace the motor or get a jack plate (jack plate being the easier option) There is really no way to raise it any higher on the transom as the bolts clamps that attached to the inside are already near the top of the transom edge. I maybe have half to one inch of room...

 

[flyingscott]

I would definitely raise it up

 

[ondarvr]

You can bolt a riser in place and move the motor up easily, not hard or expensive.

​A plate of aluminum on the inside and outside will sandwich a piece of the correct thickness plywood, through bolt this in place and mount the motor.

 

[Sea Rider]

Is OB tiller driven, or has a center console ?

That combo has too many issues :
-OB seems is a XL shaft, middle body is way long ?
-Being long, lower leg is producing extra water drag in terms of rear transom water splashes which slows combo down.
-Definitely needs a transom mount to raise OB much higher, how much tall will mount need to be, isn't known yet.

Ideal OB/transom height is when water flow at plane skims right under the protruding edge of yellow line, only checkable when combo is at plane by visual inspection (pulling head out of transom side) the issue right now is.



-Definitely needs a transom mount (upper left side of pic) to raise OB much higher, how tall will mount need to be, isn't known yet till combo planes and visually check at which lower leg is water flow passing at speed, then will know how tall mount needs to be for flow to skim right under yellow line. Worse scenario, don't go even close to red X line, prop will aerate badly on choppy, windy water cond and at tight close turns at speed. Better escenario, green line height, but yellow is much preferred.

Raise OB fully to a point it doesn't fall off transom LOL!! test if combo wants to plane while lightly loaded. Check Yam spare props availability in less pitch as current one, OB needs a prop maximization..

Happy Boating

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

Thanks you so much everyone. Sea Rider, appricate the effort you have gone to. It all makes sense now! The motor does look really long for the boat.

Here is a alternate solution... I spoke to a local ourboard repair / trade store earlier today (ironically it's where my 9.9 Yam came from). The guy said I am way under power and he is currently working on a Evenrude? 25HP that he thinks maybe ready in the next week or two. He said he'd be happy to do a exchange on my motor. Should I just do that and then when I have the 25HP see if A) Issue persists B) Maybe it will solve issue by maybe being a "L" not "XL" and also havng the power to plane easier??

 

[Fed]

With the external keel you might find raising it an inch is about the limit.
Most boats run nicely with the AV plate level with the bottom of the hull but external keels & it appears RIBs like Sea Rider's like to run a little deeper.
Wouldn't surprise me if Yamaha made their motors a little longer to accommodate these 'special' boats.

 

[fishrdan]

What does the boat's capacity plate say the Max HP is for your boat? Your outboard should be at least 2/3 of that rating, or you'll have performance issues.

Raising the OB will help, but if the boat is under powered.....

Many people balk at hydrofoils, and they can hurt performance, but I really like the Stingray Jr I have on my jon boat, pops the boat on plane quickly and keeps the bow down. After hearing everyone say they are bad I removed the one on my outboard, it immediately went back on when I got home. Night and day performance with the foil off, for the worst. Even if they are a performance band-aid, I'll run it with the band-aid.

Do you know the MPH and RPM at wide open throttle? Also, are you operating at high altitude?

 

[alohaPAPARAZZI]

What does the boat's capacity plate say the Max HP is for your boat? Your outboard should be at least 2/3 of that rating, or you'll have performance issues.

Raising the OB will help, but if the boat is under powered.....

Many people balk at hydrofoils, and they can hurt performance, but I really like the Stingray Jr I have on my jon boat, pops the boat on plane quickly and keeps the bow down. After hearing everyone say they are bad I removed the one on my outboard, it immediately went back on when I got home. Night and day performance with the foil off, for the worst. Even if they are a performance band-aid, I'll run it with the band-aid.

Do you know the MPH and RPM at wide open throttle? Also, are you operating at high altitude?

I have read about the hydrfoils and saw some YouTube Videos, it looks like it does make a huge difference. It amazes me that people actually need to modify a boat with plastc before they perform correct! LOL.

The rating for the boat is 25HP, so when the guy at the shop said he had a 25HP I figured that would be the best bet? He hasn't even looked into it yet, told me to call back next week.

Honestly, I have no idea at the MPH and RPM is. I've only taken it out a few times and without my wife and kids ballasting it I can't even take it out on my own.

 

[fishrdan]

9.9HP on a 25HP hull, that's a huge issue.

Find out more about the Evinrude: year, controls included if needed, compression, work done to it, how much to swap things. I wouldn't want to be get rid of a low hour excellent running 9.9 for an old beat up repaired 25HP...