86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

imported_Warren

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It was raining the other day and when I went to take off, I grabbed the tiller and it shocked me pretty good. I noticed that the wire to the kill switch had a nick in it. I need to replace it...Has anyone tried this before? It looks pretty tight in there. Is this something that I can do or should I take it in????
 

Xcusme

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Warren,<br />As you may have figured out by now, it's manual time. The disassembly of the handle is really no big deal. It's best to effect the wire repair using solder and shrink wrap. What you felt was the charge cap voltage from the powerpack, about 180-200 Volts.This the same voltage that supplies voltage to the primary sides of the coils. The kill button shorts out the powerpacks charge capacitor under normal conditions, unless , in your case, you became the low impedance source to ground. It sure can get your attention! :eek:
 

Hooty

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

It'll light ya right up won't it Warren.<br /><br />c/6<br />Hooty
 

backdraft

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

I don't think it's wired that way. Hmmm nevjb
 

Xcusme

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Nevjb,<br /><br />Please explain.....<br />I'm working off a '79 15HP manual.
 

backdraft

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Xcusme, The grounding wire to the switch is just that.A grounding wire. There should be no shock from that wire at all. It grounds out the power pack on the later motors and the coils on motors like yours. The manuals I checked show a disparity as to when it changed the locating point of that switch ground. If it is one that uses the power pack , that unit has a short in it. I would suspect that one of the coil wires in touching or very close to the metal housing and with the wet weather was shorting out to the frame of the motor. If your motor was the norm, there would be a lot of guys dead in the water from leaning on the motor and taking a leak. nevjb
 

imported_Warren

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

I'm going to work on it today. I hear ya about the kill switch just being a switched grounded momentary wire but last year I had it happen and the motor wouldn't start until I took a dry shirt and wrapped it around the wire that was open and it started. Is the kill switch wire hot or ground???? I almost went for a swim the other day when I got "Zapped". It was a shocking experience that I would rather not happen again. Also am I going to find tabs to solder on or am I going to have to cut wires and splice in??????....Warren
 

backdraft

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Warren, last year the bare wire was probably grounding out the ignition. That's why it would'nt start. The wire to the rubber covered button is a ground, whereupon you complete the circuit by pushing it and complete the circuit. There is a very miniscule current upon pushing the button, but even if you had the bare wire in your hand ,you should not get a poke. It's rubber covered to prevent the situation you had last year. A large jolt is indicative of a high tension leak . There are allways exceptions to all cases. nevjb
 

Xcusme

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

OK, ...If you look at the schematic for the ignition system very closely, you'll notice a couple of conventional terms. Most folks think that ground is zero volts, but in this case, that's not so. They refer to the 'ground' symbol , not so much as electrical ground ,but as a 'point of connection'. The powerhead, mounting bracket, lower unit etc. are all at 180VDC voltage potential because they are connected. The metal boat that the motor is mounted to is also at this voltage. You might ask, "Why don't I get a shock"?? You don't get shocked because there is no exposed electrical path back to true electrical 'ground'. This 'electrical ground' is inside of the sealed powerpack and is the negative side of the charge capacitor. There is only one path to this 'ground' outside of the powerpack, and that's the 'kill' wire'. <br /><br />You can test this using a volt meter. <br /><br />TEST #1:<br />Put the BLACK lead on the powerhead (which most people think of as ground) and the RED lead to the kill wire that goes TO the powerpack. Start the motor, you'll read MINUS (-)180 volts.<br /><br />TEST #2:<br />Reverse the test leads, place the RED test probe anywhere on the powerhead, connect the BLACK test probe to the kill wire that goes TO the powerpack. Start the motor, you should read PLUS(+)180 Volts of the powerpacks charge capacitor. <br /><br />This clearly shows that the powerhead is PLUS voltage and the kill wire as NEGATIVE, and is the reverse of what most people think.<br /><br />Test #2 above can be performed on a running motor to test that the charge coil under the flywheel is working and that the powerpacks full wave bridge and charge capacitor are OK, at least with this motor and model powerpack.<br /><br />What OMC is doing is using the powerhead as a conductor. The small black wire coming out of the powerpack that has a spade lug is connected to a powerpack mounting bolt. This wire is the 180 volt output of the charge capacitor. That's why it's important to have the small wire of the externally mounted coils securely mounted under a coil mounting bolt, this is where the coils are getting their primary coil voltage from, from across the powerhead itself.<br /><br />You then might ask, 'How is it possible for the coils HIGH voltage (spark plug wire) to jump the plug gap to a ground that you claim isn't really a ground at all"??<br /><br />It's simple, and I'll use an analogy.<br /><br />Say you were a passenger in a small plane wearing a parachute. You are flying at 30,000 feet and you jump out of the plane. You are supposed to pull your chute before you get to the ground, right?? RIGHT!!<br />But what if , before you pull your chute you hit the top of a building that's 180 feet high. You're as dead as Julius Caesar. For all intents and purposes, you hit 'ground'. In this analogy, you are the high voltage, starting out at 30,000 volts and trying to reach the 'ground'.<br /><br />This is the same reason why the high voltage secondary (30,000 volts) can jump to the 180 volt powerhead, it's not zero voltage, but it's close enough to a ground potential that the spark jumps.<br /><br />I can assure you that the charge capacitor does have enough capacity to knock you're socks off if you touch the powerhead, mounting bracket, or metal boat AND touch the kill wire. The stored voltage capacity of the capacitor will discharge through you. <br /><br />Now unless they changed the wiring and functional theory as outlined in my manual for my '79 15hp or my '86 6hp, yours should be about the same. <br /><br />I'll take a guess that when you grabbed the tiller handle, you didn't grab the rubber twist part of the grip. You're fingers grabbed the underside opening on the tiller handle (where the 2 kill wires are). There was a bare wire (the one going to the powerpack), and your hand was wet. Your fingers and hand bridged the bare wire and the metal tiller handle. You then became part of the 'kill circuit' and got shocked. <br />As long as the flywheel is spinning, the charge coil under the flywheel is charging the ignition capacitor. Since your hand and fingers are not a perfect conductor, it probably didn't kill the motor, but I'll bet the motor stumbled a bit, when YOU got bit.
 

backdraft

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Xcusme, You could be right, or I could be. I'm afraid I'll will have to bow to a Factory Rep type on this one. I'm not sure at this point as you raise some possible questions. I disagree with on some of your findings but will graciously bow to a higher authority. Amiably yours, nevjb
 

backdraft

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Warren and Xcusme, This is nevjb. Xcusme was right.The voltage was 240 volts to the kill switch. The amperage was low enough not to kill but after taking readings with my DVA meter , I duplicated your problem and it certainly does get your attention. This was done in the rain on a rubber mat. My apologies for any bad information I gave. Xcusme is well informed on this subject. Yours humbly, nevjb
 

imported_Warren

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Jb, thanks for that. It is quite a shocking experience isn't it..lol.. I ended up taping it back up. Its a pretty tight area in there. I don't know where the wires end. Do I have to remove the powerhead to get in there? I would like to re-wire them all with new marine grade wire and solder all the points but don't know where they end up???? I can't even see in there to see where they go. I'm takin it out tomorrow to get myself shocked a couple more times before I take it in and have them check it out.....Thanks guys for being so Hardcore, wish you lived closer so I could pick your brains........Warren
 

Hooty

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

That's an excelent explanation Xcusme. I knew the "whats" but not the "whys". Now I do. Good job,sir.<br /><br />c/6<br />Hooty
 

Xcusme

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Re: 86 Evinrude 15 Tiller handle shocked me?

Nevjb,<br /><br />Thanks for verifying my finding. I'm glad to hear you took the precaution of using a rubber mat....and in the rain no less!!! My hats off to you. <br /><br />Warren,<br /><br />Nope, you shouldn't have to yank the whole powerhead to get to the kill wires. You know now that one of them goes to a bolt on the powerhead, the other should go to a pull apart connector going TO the powerpack. You didn't mention if the 'break' or exposed part of the insulation was caused by a rubbing of the wire itself against the tiller handle or perhaps near or at a metal strain relief OR if the insulation was just old and cracked off. If the wire is old and the insulation broke off, then plan on a re-wire as the fix. If the insulation on the wire otherwise looks good, cut it at the bare spot, slip a piece of shrink tubing over one of the cut ends and slide it down the wire. Re-solder the 2 ends back together. Finally, slide the shrink tubing over the soldered repair and apply heat to seal the shrink wrap.<br /><br />Don't feel bad about not living closer, you're not far away, you're as close as your keyboard and a post. Feel free to pick our brains, there are some very informed folks around here to help. Keep us posted on your progress. <br /><br />Hooty,<br /><br />I kind of figured that one day someone would ask that question about the true 'grounding' issue with these ignition systems. My hope was that I could convey the info in an informative way so as not to confuse but to enlighten. Thanks for the kudos.
 
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