1966 Johnson Seahorse 40HP - surging after carb rebuild

Tin_Bubbles

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Jun 15, 2017
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Welp. First post, here goes nothing.

The engine is a 1966 Johnson Super SeaHorse 40HP *RDS-28B* (If anyone can tell me what the B is for I'll give you a high-five).

I recently acquired this engine, after it had been sitting for quite some time. I did the usual things, spark plugs (gapped correctly), impeller, resealed lower unit,fuel lines blah blah blah. This engine was in remarkably good shape for having sat for awhile. Whoever owned it before me really took care of it and put it away correctly.

But this past week I really went to town rebuilding the carb. Everything came apart, everything got an ultra-sonic bath, everything got sprayed and aired out. And of course I installed a carb rebuild kit from this site. Woohoo!

So. It idles great at low speed, it purrs, and is quite responsive. Now when I give it some juice, we start running into issues. It will rev high and hold steady for a bit, but over the course of maybe 30-45 seconds, it will slowly start revving down. By slowly I mean that while I'm holding the throttle steady at high RPM, you can hear the engine slowly starting to lose power. It won't stall, but slowly lose power.

Then other times I will quickly decrease throttle and it will "surge", or just hold it's RPMs for awhile until it decides it wants to come back down.

I cleaned out every office of this thing, and form my research here some people talk about adjusting the high speed needle. However, on this carb, it's the kind where the jet is buried under/past the drain plug on the bottom of the bowl. I tightened it snug, didn't over-do it. Everything seems tight/air-tight. I do notice a few air bubbles in the fuel line, not many at all, and they don't seem to increase or decrease with the RPMs. They are about the size of a copper BB from a BB gun. Itty bitty.

I should mention all this testing is done in a barrel, with the engine in neutral.

Should the high speed jet still be adjusted even thought i would have to access it through the bowl drain? HALP!
 

JDusza

Ensign
Joined
Apr 21, 2009
Messages
987
I don't think there's a high speed adjustment on this carburetor...
That said, your carburetor may have a sticky inlet valve seat / needle. Runs fine at slow speed, bowl fills, higher speed higher demand, fill rate can't keep up, engine starts to die; run at slow speed. bowls refills, throttle up okay for a while, dies, repeat.....
Take the carb off and drain it. Holding the carburetor upright, the float and valve needle should be dropped and you should be able to blow into the carb fuel inlet and sense the air moving through. Turn the carb upside down, float and needle drop to closed position, and blow and you should feel great resistance as the valve should be closed.
J
 

Tin_Bubbles

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Jun 15, 2017
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Thanks for your reply J!

One thing I DID notice was that the float needle would occasionally stick. Not every time. So I figured that a new needle would take care of that. To my suprise, it still stuck, maybe one out of every 10 times that I flipped the carb back and forth. I sprayed some oil in there but obviously that's not going to last.

So with a brand new needle and valve, is there something i can do to allow it to NOT stick? The seat that the valve and needle seat into is squeaky clean. I'm not sure what else I can possibly do besides try a new needle and valve.
 

jbuote

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Aug 17, 2016
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1,001
More curiosity than offering any advice here as I'm fairly new to outboards, but...
​You said new needle and valve.. Did you use a carb rebuild kit or just use a new needle with the old seat?
​Just wondering if the seat is the old one, if it isn't the cause of the sticking...
​When I got my first outboard last August (71' Johnson 50 hp), I rebuilt both carbs using rebuild kits and they had new needle and seat for it, so replaced them even though the old ones looked good.
​Not sure if a rebuild kit for a 66 comes with a seat though..
​Just thinking out loud here..
 

Tin_Bubbles

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Jun 15, 2017
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Hey jbuote!

New needle and seat! Brand spanking new in the kit. I could be wrong but I've always had this hunch that the rubber tips on these needles contribute to the sticking. Pure speculation though.
 

jbuote

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Hmm.. Good thought.. I'm not sure if the rubber tips would contribute to sticking.. I'll have to remember that when/if I have fuel flow issues...
​Oh well, Back to my lurking corner and letting the real pro's here advise.. LOL
​Thanks for indulging me for a moment! LOL :D
 

Tin_Bubbles

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Jun 15, 2017
Messages
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Hmm.. Good thought.. I'm not sure if the rubber tips would contribute to sticking.. I'll have to remember that when/if I have fuel flow issues...
​Oh well, Back to my lurking corner and letting the real pro's here advise.. LOL
​Thanks for indulging me for a moment! LOL :D


Back to the shadows with you!
 

jbuote

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Aug 17, 2016
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1,001
LOL!!
​Well, One last question before I go back to my shadows... haha!
​The new needle and seat... It came with a clip for the needle to attach to the float hinge flange right?
​I'm sure you did, but was that clip installed too? That usually would help unseat the needle from the seat when the float moves... If it wasn't there, then I guess the needle could stick sometimes...
​Ok.. Really the last thought, and I'm off to my shadows... LOL!! :cool:
 
Last edited:

oldboat1

Fleet Admiral
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Apr 3, 2002
Messages
9,612
The high speed nozzle running vertically in the center could be blocked, or missing the gasket.

If the new needle is the style with the neoprene tip, you need the clip that slips over the float arm. Otherwise, go back to the old needle.

The float goes in with the adjustment tab facing toward the carb top (i.e., facing down when assembling the float in the inverted top).

Switch the choke to manual, in case that's an issue.

Your fuel pump could be the problem -- test by using the primer bulb when the motor is acting up, but can't safely run above a high idle either in a barrel or on muffs. Need to be on the lake.

When quickly throttling down out there, the vacuum cut out switch is there to prevent a runaway engine. You shouldn't be close to that running in a barrel. (But on the positive side, can get the idle adjustment pretty close in a barrel -- can't do that on muffs because there is no back pressure.)
 

Tin_Bubbles

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Jun 15, 2017
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14
Welp. I feel like a fool. This morning I looked everywhere for the needle clip. Lo and behold, it was still in the "empty" (so I thought) bag of rebuild parts.

Thanks everyone for pointing that out and for the great advice. I'm going to install that clip and update as soon as I get another cup of coffee in me. I suppose taking the starter and carb off again serves as good practice. Haha
 
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