1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

[Cuskmaster]

I have a 93 70 that ran fine until i brought it to a yammy dealer to have a t/t problem fixed.it needed a new t/t solenoid. they also noticed a nearly broken shift cable and replaced it. The motor now moves up and down like it should, but runs terrible! I brought it back, and for 3 months they "tried everything, and I could buy the $1200 worth of non returnable electrical parts that they tried" The #3 plug gets wet but not dirty, and fires intermittantly. (I learned from another post not to disconnect any wires and run it, I won't do it again!) the #2 plug is VERY dirty and the #1 seems normal. These were new,gapped plugs. Is there a way to check the CDI with a multitester? I have the tech repair manual from Yamaha, but the test uses the "yamaha ignition tester" which nobody around here has. The spark coil resistances seem O.K., too. I did find some bad reads on the reg/rec, but that shouldn't affect spark should it? By the way, fuel system is fine, carbs were cleaned and O.K., according to the aforementioned "factory certified dealer". Does anyone have any advice? The next nearest dealer according to the Yammy website, is nearly 4 hours away, and they were reluctant to help me over the phone.......Any help is appreciated, thanks in advance. This a wonderful site. You guys are doing the boating world a great service.

 

[Ray Neudecker]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Are the new parts on the engine now? What are they? Yes the rectifier could be a problem , Did you disconnect all wiring before testing. I have seen some CDI failures on that model causing lack of fire on one cylinder. Ohm the stator, then the reg/rec. Use a hot battery and test that those electrics are working properly before the CDI is condemmed. Check voltage at battery while running and before running. Should be over 13 volts dead engine and over 14 shortly after starting. Any mechanic will demur on any guesses or prices before seeing and testing the motor. Many times everything is not exactly, sometimes not close to what the customer thinks or has been told by someone who was unable to repair. Good Luck and let us hear further.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

also check the fuel pump . if its leaking it will cause plug fouling.<br /> other than that its a simple matter of placing it in the water with a test wheel and using a cd-77 meter to eliminate ign problems.<br /> good luck and keep posting

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

I checked battery voltage before and after- only about .1V change when started. (fron 12.7 to 12.8). The rec/reg was off the motor when I tested it, Ray- no continuity across any leads.When you say to ohm the stator what do you mean? I checked resistances of the pulser coil, charge coil, lighting coil, and crank position sensor- all were fine. Is the stator comprised of these? Should I start by replacing the rectifier? The shop didn't tell me which parts they swapped in, only that nothing helped, so they replaced nothing. They did say that they had no "1-Y ignition tester", so they could not properly test the CDI. Rodbolt, the fuel system -new gas,new filt/sep, lines and pump good. I'm not familiar with a cd-77 meter, I just have an old Simpson 260 multi! Thanks alot for your responses-I'm learning. Ron

 

[fmenezes]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Yes, check the fuel pump. I had a similar problem with my 1988 70 HP. The fix was to replace the diaphragm in the fuel pump. It was torn and leaked fuel into the crankcase, flooding the #3 cylinder. Good luck!!!

 

[fmenezes]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Cuskmaster,<br /><br />Test the fuel pump by unbolting it from the block, exposing the diaphragm, but leaving the fuel lines connected. Then squeeze the primer bulb in the fuel line and check to see if any fuel passes through the diaphragm. If it does, then replace the diaphragm and that should solve your problem.

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Hey fmenezes- I'll try that later and post back tonite, I hope. "workus interuptus" Thanks alot for the reply, that would be a relatively cheap fix, but I still think I have a rec/reg problem!

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Hello again, all- I unbolted the fuel pump from the engine, but did not disassemble it. there is a hole between the two mounting holes, and gas came out freely when I pumped the primer bulb. Is this normal? Do I have to take the pump apart to do the test? Is anyone familiar with this? Thanks again!! Ron

 

[jim dozier]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

No, that is the problem. You have a hole in the diaphragm inside. Your pump has been injecting unmetered fuel directly into the cylinder its attached to. Rebuild the fuel pump. Easy and inexpensive job.<br /><br />When this is fixed find a new dealer.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

dude what can I say.the charging system has no relation to the ignition system on your outboard. it will run just fine without the regulator or the battery. usually your problem is due to a bad pump. buy a pump and be done with it.<br />good luck and keep posting

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

To all you people who have helped- thanks tons! I'll order the pump-or rebuild kit- tomorrow and give it a try. give me a week or so to get it then I'll post and let you know. Also, would this gas just flood the cylinder, or the base as well? thanks again.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

its easier and quicker to just buy a pump. that raw fuel on an oil injected engine will toast a piston. glad ya caught it. price the parts against the pump. that is why I say every 3 years or so just replace it and you will never need a pump. I hope that is the only prob you have. you need to follow the tech manual carefully when testing the regulator.<br /> good luck and keep posting

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Thanks Rodbolt- I'm gonna just get a pump shipped to me and if that cures my "runability problems", then I'll keep an eye on my battery. It's new, so if there IS a rectifier problem it should show up fairly soon! I'm pretty sure I followed the manual though..... got no continuity on any wire with my tester's pos. probe while the neg. was on black. If the rect. is only for the charging loop and doesn't affect the ignition, I'm goin' with the pump......man, to think I may have wasted the last few months ,let alone the $ and patience chasin' down an ignition problem......Oh well,live and learn. life is still good! I'll let you know how things turn out. Your help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

hello<br /> what kind of tester are you using? iff all the tests fail while using the red and black as positive then your meter may be of the wrong polarity. retest with the red to black leads and the black on the green wires.<br /> all your doing is testing a diode. you may have a meter incompatibility issue and not a reg/rectifier one.<br /> good luck and keep posting<br /> PS that is why my meter has a diode check function

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Hello again- my tester is an old, OLD Simpson 260. I had to get the manual from them online. Alas, it has no diode test function. Another lesson learned, perhaps? The test with leads reversed still showed nothin'. The tester is lookin' at me kinda funny though, so........

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

wow I have not used a simpson 260 in many years. the navy is full of them though. you really need a digital meter to test a diode. radioshack has some really nice ones for less than 50 dollars. and they have auto scale ranging auto is my buddy. some analog meters dont have enough voltage to properly forward bias the diode for testing.<br /> good luck and keep posting

 

[Ray Neudecker]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

If the battery is good, the 2k scale on the Simpson 260 should test a diode fine. Memory is a little vague on the scale since when the first digital came out 20 years or so ago, I gave up my Simpson. Got tired of blowing it up or dropping and the repair bills that went with it. I will never forget the demo of the new (then) Fluke where the salesman threw it across the room and hit the wall with it. He then picked it up and it worked fine. I still have in working order the one I bought right then. Like all electronics they are much better and cheaper than then. Good Luck and keep us posted.

 

[Cuskmaster]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Hello again. I found a new fuel pump-in Thomaston (ME). The wife and I drove 7 1/2 hours round trip to get it. She wouldn't wait to order one. In 10 minutes my months-old "spark problem" was solved! The guys at my NEW dealer told me they also change pumps as a matter of course whenever they do the carbs, and were surprised and disappointed with the service I got at the last place. The best service I've gotten was right here in this forum. Thank you very much. The brookies, togue, and salmon around here are very nervous again!! Take care all!!

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

hahaha dude<br /> Ray is old<br /> real old<br /> I am glad I am not so familiar with the old bakalite cased simpson 260. but it just not suited for modern diodes.<br /> I love auto<br /> auto is my buddy anymore.<br /> auto remebers to change scales even when I forget.<br /> the only thing I ever saw bad about a fluke is they cannot swim. dang things drown quick.<br /> good luck and glad to see ya got it solved. goes back to most my posts. every 3 years just do it. change that pump its cheap.

 

[Ray Neudecker]

Re: 1993 70TLRR -dealer gave up trying to fix

Never tried to teach one to swim always had doubts about it's ability to do so. Glad you are back going again. Hate you ran into such a dealer sevice situation. As rodbolt keeps saying, basic maintence is the key to a long happy life with your Yamaha.