1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

stackz

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Changed spark plugs. One had a weird mark on its electrode, but all appeared to be firing.

I would have focused on this as an original problem. what was the mark? did any of the plugs have a scoring mark down the side of the porcelain? thats a hallmark for a bad coil or plug wire causing arc-ing down the side of the plug. which will cause that cylinder to miss something fierce.

anywho, you did a compression test but you didnt do a leakdown test? as said, these engines have super long timing chains (cant remember if they are interferance or not though). you get enough slack and you can slightly bend a valve. you might even have a burnt valve.

I always do a compression and leak down test on an unknown engine before I proceed with anything else. If the long block is in decent shape then you know its something else lol. even with #4 @ 190, thats only about 12% loss which isnt bad compared to the others, but the leakdown would help narrow that to whether you might have a valve or ring problem in that cylinder.

you said later on there was a map sensor code and earlier that there was one in the glove box....obviously you checking the map sensor is a good thing but I've never really checked one with the engine running? this is how I do it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8EVhFc5Yqw

also, you should definitely have more than 6"hg @ idle...and dont these engines idle @ 900rpm, not 600? here's a nifty engine vacuum diagnosis tool regardless:
http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,3020.0.html
 

TilliamWe

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Thanks guys. Re-ran comp test yesterday, and the #4 cylinder was better. Over 200 this time. So I apparently didn't crank it long enough, or otherwise did something different. (The motor was cold the last time, it was a little warm this time)

As far as vacuum leaks, I have tried to identify all the hoses and they look okay. I can't hear anything else, either.

And boy does that timing chain replace sound like a complete pain!!! Work above & below the car, remove a motor mount, getting the tensioner & guides out? YIKES! I am good, but I ain't that good! A pro would get that job. And, I totally think that's why the guy sold it to me, his "client" didn't want to pay him to replace the chain.

in regards to the spark plugs, the one had a perfectly round mark on the ground strap, on the surface facing the electrode. I tried to test spark yesterday, but my in-line tester pulled apart on the last cylinder. Besides, I was supposed to hook up all 4 plugs to ground, but I didn't have time. It did appear that #1 & #4 had weak spark. Makes sense because both plugs were wet with gas! And one coil alledgedly controls those two cylinders. So this engine might have a couple of issues. (Including the guy working on it!) It is running on two cylinders, though. I can't believe it runs at all, let alone accelerates! Once I fix it, I am going to be really impressed!

I read the Haynes manual on how to test the coils and the ingnition module, and I think I'll give that a try on Sat.
 

dolluper

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

No PCV system on that motor. quote

Yes there is on the right side....would be a first if there wasn't!!
Tensioner issues were bigger than chains did 2 of them that flew apart There is a couple of grounds down by the trannie you should check while checking
 

stackz

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

so they were wet with gas from not firing? or from the injectors possibly being stuck open and just gushing fuel in?

I'll lean to not firing.

if you have two coils and not a lot of time....just swap them. then see if #2 and #3 end up with wet plugs and #1 and #4 end up firing ok. that will give you a better idea if the coil is suspect or the module or something else is screwy.
 

TilliamWe

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Stackz, not firing is my guess. And I think I'll try to swap the coils, that's not too hard. I am getting good at removing and installing that spark control module cover thing!! ;)


dolluper, it has no PCV valve. it has a tube that leads from an "oil separator unit" to the intake manifold. If i can reach the bottom end of the hose, I'll remove it and see what if anything spews out of the oil separator unit.
 

dolluper

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Your right no valve it is a PCV system excuse my french ....right under the fuel rail { fuel regulator} runs to timming cover and vents there
 

Sixmark

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

No PCV system on that motor. quote

Yes there is on the right side....would be a first if there wasn't!!
Tensioner issues were bigger than chains did 2 of them that flew apart There is a couple of grounds down by the trannie you should check while checking

:facepalm:Last time I checked, the tensioner is part of a timing chain job, if it's bad then it gets replaced. Talk about splitting hairs ......:facepalm:
 

TilliamWe

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

:facepalm:Last time I checked, the tensioner is part of a timing chain job, if it's bad then it gets replaced. Talk about splitting hairs ......:facepalm:

;) hahaha
 

dolluper

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Doing the job might show you the difference 4sure....experience prevailes......is is it fixed yet hahaha
 

TilliamWe

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Re: 1999 Grand Am 2.4l Twin Cam engine issues.. Updated

Nope, it isn't fixed. Had to replace the ignition control module, to get #1 & #4 cylinders to fire again. Still low on vacuum, but compression is 210-225 across all four. Trying to find the time to check vacuum lines for leaks, but in the meantime it's driveable, and it doesn't stall out of anything. Not even with the (working!) A/C on.
 
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