1999 vp 5.0gl

[Augoose]

All,
I'm getting back around to dealing with what I believe is an electrical issue with my 1999 Chris Craft 200BR with VP 5.0 GL.
Last fall we were on the boat and the engine shut off instantly while under way at about 20 kph. No stuttering or stumble - just died instantly. Of course that resulted in the boat coming to an abrupt stop and a wave of water hitting the back of the boat and water working its way into a few of the cylinders. Long story short, I was towed to shore, drained the water, cycled through several iterations of fresh oil and ultimately got all of the moisture out. I ran the boat two times for the season after that - one test ride where it ran for about 45 minutes with no issues. Because that went well, we went out the following weekend with the family and it again died while pulling my son on skis. The boat recovered quickly enough this time that I took on no water - we went straight to the dock and put it on the trailer. So here we are a few months later and I'm trying to get ready for spring.

I've ordered a new dizzy cap, new rotor, new plugs, new plug wires, a coil, a carb rebuild kit (I last rebuilt the carb in 2012), a fuel pump relay and a new alternator. The total of all these parts is less than one tow back to shore in the event of another breakdown, so I don't mind throwing some parts at the problem. I've also cleaned the reluctor wheel and the ignition module but did not order a replacement as I they don't seem to make one for my application anymore.

My question is what else should I be looking at? The symptoms really make my feel like it is a loss of spark vs a loss of fuel delivery since the engine quits instantly with no prior warning. I don't think it is a loss of fuel because I experience no sputtering or coughing as I'd expect to see as I drain the fuel bowl dry had the fuel pump stopped.

The battery connections visually appear clean and all connections were tight. Maybe a weak battery would not support a strong and consistent spark?

Thanks for your feedback

 

[Lou C]

I would get a wiring schematic for your model (there are some floating around the 'net) and check:
the big 9 way cannon connector that links the engine harness to the boat's wiring harness
all the connections on your ignition switch
connections at the coil etc, go over the entire ignition system because when an engine cuts out like that abruptly it sounds more like an electrical issue, that is causing a loss of power to the ignition system.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Check the ignition switch and the MOB switch

 

[Augoose]

Thanks guys. Great suggestions. I had checked out the man over board switch last year but not the ignition switch.
I read some past posts regarding the neutral safety switch only affecting the starting circuit - is that the case or could a problem in the neutral safety kill spark while under way? I had replaced that switch year before last.

 

[bruceb58]

Neutral safety switch only prevents the starter from working.

 

[Scott Danforth]

as Bruce pointed out, Neutral Safety switch only interupts the starter signal unless its in neutral

the ignition switch and the MOB switch are the two items to look at if everything else stayed powered and the motor instantly died

if everything died, look at the large breaker supplying power to the motor and everything else, then follow the harness

 

[Augoose]

Thanks to both for the clarification!
We'll see what today turns up.

 

[Lou C]

On the back of your ig switch you will have 3 or 4 terminals depending on whether it has an accessory position as some newer switches do.
B is battery voltage
I is for the ignition system and should show battery voltage when you turn the key to ig on...
S is start and should get battery voltage when you turn the key to start. With the engine running try wiggling the wires for the switch to see if you can get it to cut out. Could be a terminal or the switch itself. Check connections on the coil too. Finally the large 9 way connector can get loose and cause an intermittent problem, I put a hose clamp on mine to keep the 2 halved tightly joined.

 

[bruceb58]

Next time you have your engine running, tilt your drive slightly and see if the engine stumbles or RPM lowers during that process. If it does, you may have a resistive connection somewhere. On my Volvo, I had a situation like yours and it was the terminal at the starter that was slightly loose. The heavy gauge wire that feeds everything besides the starter had a poor/intermittent connection.

 

[Augoose]

Thanks Gentlemen for the suggestions.
I will test the ignition switch as suggested as well as the lower unit test.
I unfortunately had to replace the starter at the end of last season because it met it's demise when I took on water (unknowingly) into the cylinders. When the boat died I tried to re-start it and compressed nothing but water.The starter has already been replaced and connections have been cleaned and are now solid.
Today I replaced the distributor cap, rotor, coil and alternator. I noticed some significant corrosion and rust at the connections on the coil and a few of the connections at the alternator were loose and the studs just spun as I tried to back off the connecting nuts. I also noticed that the two screw mounts which secure the distributor were stripped. They were somewhat snug but wouldn't tighten all the way down. I added a nut on each side from below and snugged the new dizzy down.
Tomorrow I plan to replace the relay at the top of the fuel pump, replace all spark plugs, pull the carb and clean it, and install a new starter battery. I'm also going to pump out the fuel that was left in the tank from last august.
I'm throwing a lot of parts at the problem, maybe unnecessarily, but I do all my own service and all of this is cheaper than getting towed in this spring.
Thanks again for all the help.

 

[Scott Danforth]

I suggest towing insurance as well

 

[Augoose]

I suggest towing insurance as well

Good point. I inappropriately assumed it was very costly but after checking with Progressive, it doesn't seem to be that bad.
Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Scott Danforth]

I use boat US which is $151/ year unlimited. my first tow would have been $1200 had I not had the towing insurance.

 

[Faztbullet]

Check you connections at gauges also. I chased a problem like this and found the purple wire left key and then to gauges and purple wire was loose on tach. It would loose connection when boat was jarred in rough water or hard turns to pick up fallen skier.

 

[Augoose]

Check you connections at gauges also. I chased a problem like this and found the purple wire left key and then to gauges and purple wire was loose on tach. It would loose connection when boat was jarred in rough water or hard turns to pick up fallen skier.

Interesting. Thanks for the suggestion! Faztbullet - so you found that your boat would die while underway due to a loose connection on the purple lead? I was pulling my son on skis the last time it occurred and it was indeed choppy.

Thanks to Scott as well for the followup on the insurance.

 

[Scott Danforth]

the purple wire is ignition.

 

[Augoose]

Thanks, I wasn't picking up on the significance of the purple wire- my wife would tell you that she too has to spell things out for me sometimes.

I feel like I'm making headway. Looking forward to spring.
Thanks all

 

[Augoose]

As a follow up to this thread.....

In total, I replaced the coil, rebuilt the carb, cleaned the pickup sensor on the ignition module, replaced all the spark plugs, replaced the distributor cap and rotor, new water fuel separator, pumped out all the old fuel, installed a new alternator, and replaced the fuel pump relay. I also checked all the connections behind the dash and did find some somewhat loose ones.

The connections at the coil were all rusted as well and several of the posts on the old alternator just spun when I tried to remove connections. I also checked the connections at the ignition key and MOB switch and did find that I could tighten each just a bit, especially the purple wire.

Here was the old fuel relay.


I put about 15 gallons in the boat and started it up in the yard. It ran very well and needed just a quarter turn on each fuel screw to about 1 full turn out. Revved up nicely w/out load of course. Tomorrow I plan to water test it at the dock for a bit and then maybe wander around the cover without getting too far out to test things. The original problem was that the boat would just die completely while under way. No cough, no sputter, just stopped. Didn't seem to ever happen at lower rpms or at idle that I can recall.

Hopefully one of the steps above resolved it.
Thanks all for the assistance.

 

[Lou C]

That relay certainly could be a culprit I can't believe that V/P didn't even use weather proof relays (like I have on my off road lighting harnesses for our Jeeps) for a critical part like that. For shame. If you buy a wiring harness from Painless Wiring for auxiliary lights you get relays with weatherproof design. I put a relay harness in my '98 Jeep in 2002, and only recently had to replace one relay but not because of corrosion.

 

[Augoose]

Water test went extremely well today. The boat never skipped a beat and the hole shot I'd say was a 25% improvement over anything last year before symptoms. It always had a bit of a gurgle when first giving it full throttle but today it just accelerated up through the power band nicely.
Thanks for all the suggestions and assistance.