2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

[cddetelich]

I have read countless articles about 2 cycle and 4 cycle outboards. It looks like it is time I repowered my boat-it currently has a 175 Johnson 2 cycle with carbs.
I have read about 4 cycle being cleaner, more efficient, quieter, heavier, more expensive.
I have also looked at the new Evinrude E-Tecs-quiet, efficient, lighter.
Are 4 cycles that much better? Are there more maintenance costs? I have heard about belts, valve adjustments, etc associated with higher maintenance costs on 4 cycles. I have also read about potential problems with Suzuki corrosion.
I usually use my boat for fishing-I steam out about 4-5 miles then troll for 2-3 hours then steam in. I am currently burning 10-15 gallons per trip,
So, what would all of you recommend? 2 cycle, 4 cycle, Evinrude, Yamaha, Honda, Suznull

uki, Mercury?
Thanks for your help and advice.

 

[MikeV4]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

Are you trolling on your outboard, or on a trolling motor?

It all depend on your personal needs and favors to choose between a 2 or 4 stroke. I know quite some people who run on Honda and they are all happy about them and feel no difference in mx costs.
You have read all the pro's and con's, make your choice.

 

[croSSed]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

Two-stroke all the way. Buy and Evinrude e-Tec. Here's my prejudice: Part of the definition of an outboard is that it is a two-stroke motor. A four stroke is a car engine in outboard clothing. Plus, the Evinrude burns cleaner, and burns less fuel than any 4-stroke "outboard" I know about. And, your horsepower to weight ratio is much better with the Evinrude than with any 4-stroke, effectively giving you more power for the same rated h.p.

TG

 

[MikeV4]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

Two-stroke all the way. Buy and Evinrude e-Tec. Here's my prejudice: Part of the definition of an outboard is that it is a two-stroke motor. A four stroke is a car engine in outboard clothing. Plus, the Evinrude burns cleaner, and burns less fuel than any 4-stroke "outboard" I know about. And, your horsepower to weight ratio is much better with the Evinrude than with any 4-stroke, effectively giving you more power for the same rated h.p.

TG

Times change. A couple of years ago Moto GP swored to 2 stroke, now all champions are running on 4 strokes. I am not favouring any engine, but just going by a manufacturers advertisement is a bit of a weak argument. Choosing the wright type of engine for your personal needs have different aspects. I can imagine that a waterskier currently will opt for a two stroke, but may be a fisherman prefers to run a four stroke.

BTW, looking at your signature you seem to have fun with the evinrude 8)

 

[steelespike]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

2 stroke all the way. Most 4 strokes are fine motors but
there are just too many moving parts.
Just count them.The 4 stroke service intervals are more frequent and more expensive.The Etec is much much cleaner than any other out board in production.
I think their reliability has been exceptional especially for such an all new and inovative design.
Running a 4 stroke outboard at WOT is like running your car uphill in 2nd gear at 5,500 rpm.
If you can't afford an Etec get the best 2 stroke you can afford.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

i personally am a 2 stroke man, but i was impressed the other day when a yamaha launched, docked, and left, and i never heard it.

 

[bassboy1]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

I was impressed the other day at scout camp when I didn't hear the Yam start or run. Then I realized we were drifting.8)

 

[cobra 3.0]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

Evinrude 2 stroke. I like Honda's too for their great looks and their reputation. Honda has been making 4 strokes for longer than everybody else too.

In all fairness though, they're all great engines.

 

[JB]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

1. The ETEC is NOT significantly lighter or cheaper than comparable EFI 4 strokes.

2. The differences between the EFI 4 strokes and DFI 2 strokes in fuel efficiency, noise and performance are trivial and only show when examined microscopically.

3. Four stroke outboards are not auto engines in disguise anymore than 2 stroke engines are chainsaws in disguise, and running one at WOT for extended periods is not like driving a car uphill in 2nd. It is more like cruising the Interstate at 80. These myths were created for people who do not understand how engines are "tuned" for particular applications.

4. Four strokes have more parts. . .MANY more parts. . .than equivalent 2 strokes (that is only if you don't count the hundreds of needle bearings in the 2 stroke). Microprocessors have thousands of times more parts than a transistorized or CDI ignition, yet they last longer. Parts count is irrelevant; MTBF (mean time between failures) matters. There is no evidence that MTBF in 2 strokes outboards is any longer than in 4 stroke outboards, only anecdotal claims by those with an axe to grind.

Two strokes fire their plugs and whack their pistons TWICE as often as 4 strokes (they have to to make as much power) and they burn oil (the amount of oil burned by an ETEC is minute compared to most 2 strokes) that leaves residue (carbon).

4. Routine maintenance schedules for most 4 strokes are more frequent than most 2 strokes, especially the ETEC. You can change the oil or burn it. They both use it. You can check valve clearance or you can decarb about as often. Maks nix. I, like most iboaters, fiddle with whatever engine I have as often as I can find an excuse to do so.

I haven't owned an ETEC, but I have owned a couple of 4 strokes (one carbed, one EFI) and about a bazillion carbed 2 strokes. While I dearly loved all the carbed, 2 stroke JohnnyRudes I had, they were not in the same universe as my Suzi DF70 for user friendliness, quiet operation or fuel efficiency. Only the little ones (under 9.9) could match it trolling, and they couldn't match the 9.9 Johnny 4 stroke at that.

The ETEC might be just as lovable for a fisherman as an EFI 4 stroke. I don't know, but all the pseudo-technical claims that one is "better" than the others are just a bunch of marketeering mythology as far as I am concerned.

Now, when 4 stroke outboards go to DFI and stratified charge operation we may have another leap forward.

 

[BillP]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

I've been running a 4 stroke about 10 yrs now and 2 strokes a lot longer.

4 strokes were much hyped up when they hit the market big about 10yrs ago...I bought into the hype like a lot of people did. 4 strokes kicked butt on the old tech carbed engines back THEN. Things have changed and Etecs are now doing the kicking. The tide is definitely changing as experienced 4 stroke users like me are changing back to 2 strokes. I'm not signing up for crankcase oil changes and valve adjustments the next time I buy. My advice is to buy 2 stroke now.

Also, look around and see how many people have problems with 4 strokes "making water" from "trolling too much". I haven't had that problem with mine but a lot of 4 stroke owners have. This is a throw the dice deal and if it happens to your 4 stroke learn to live with it because mfgs are doing little to help. Their sidestep response is it's ok to have a little water in the crankcase oil or tell you not to troll so much. Yeah, right!

B.

 

[steelespike]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

I have to agree with JB on some of his points but will take exception to WOT with a 4 stroke outboard is the same as cruising the interstate at 80.Even my little high
reving Subaru only turns about 3,000 rpm at 80.And turns 2,800 at 75.Roughly 1/2 of its redline.I drive pretty consertively and I would bet that in my subaru has less than 1 min. at 5,500 rpm in about 3 years of driving.Anytime you run any engine at 5,000 + rpm you are close to its design limits.Sure you can run it at higher rpm something around 12,000 rpm in race cars but I believe overhaul interval is something like 3 hours and some even with surgical like assembly procedures only make it a few minutes before catastrofic
failure.
As far as power impacts on the piston I think we have a wash.4 stroke impacts half as much at twice the force
of a 2 stroke.2 stroke twice as much at 1/2 the force of a 4 stroke.
You can't really count needle bearings with the reciprocating parts like vlalves,keepers,valve springs,and possibly cam followers (lifters).Sure needle bearings are parts but they reduce wear and tear not multiply it.

 

[Scaaty]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

On the Motorcycle issue, Its because 2 stroke road bikes just simply aint MADE anymore.....race on Sunday, sell on Monday. And ya can't sell something that AINT for sale. Simple
You will NEVER beat a same size 2 stroke motor with a 4stroke
I ride Harley's because they SOUND good, they thump, vibrate, make me feel good. Always have. My two stroke dirtbikes are fun, but sound like crap.
Boat motors? I'll never forget my old Merc XS 150 screaming at 6000+, me grinning ear to ear.
4 Stroke outboards sound like they have half the plugs fouled.........get the E-Tec. Want efficiency? Get a long 4x4 and a couple sheets........

 

[Scaaty]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

I, like most iboaters, fiddle with whatever engine I have as often as I can find an excuse to do so.


Amen......

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: 2 cycle vs. 4 cycle

i love my carbed 2 stroke 200hp 1994 merc v6 because i can do almost any repair or maint item with very very very simple tools and limited knowledge.( including changing my head gaskets, try that on a 4 stroke) no chaniging of oil is a big plus for me. a nother big plus is a lack or drivetrain parts or timing belts. plus my whole get-up weighs in at 394 pounds.

im sure the 4 stroke owners love their four strokes. as they should. for what they are touted as, yes, they do what they claim. quiet and smoke free. as for fuel mile-age, the newer 2 stroke direct injections are getting as good or better fuel mile-age than the 4 strokes, all with less emissions and less weight.

1 is not better than the other . its up to you and what you want and how you plan to deal with it when that time comes.

you can tell where my opinion lies, and its just that, an opinion. i do all my own work and i love simplicity!