2004 Sea Ray 260 Sundancer sudden leak

[tabletop]

Hello, about 6 months ago I bought a 260 Sundancer. It was in the marina when I bought it and I had it hauled out and had the bellows and zincs replaced by a boatyard and did general maintenance (bottom paint, etc.). I also pulled the drain plug, cleaned the hole, and put new heavy duty teflon tape and permeated thread sealer goop on the plug (it's a screw in type of plug).

About 4 months ago I put it into my slip. I've been doing light maintenance (rewiring, new sound system, fluids, all that good stuff) and getting it ready to fish so haven't taken it out yet. In that time, I've run it in my slip for 10-30 minutes at a time, maybe once a week. Boat has not left my slip yet. For the first 3 months, the bilge was bone dry. About a week ago, I suddenly had about 2 inches of water in the bilge. I thought, that's weird, but I had been refilling the water system earlier and figured I spilled some or whatever. So I turned the pump off and came back the next day to more water. I figured maybe it was water that had been up in the bow or something trickling down to the bilge and mopped it up and left. Came back today and there was another 2-3 inches in there.

Took it all out and finally took a light to figure out what was going on. I can see a VERY light trickle of water coming from the transom area. It's light but it's definitely there... when I clear all the water, I can see the trickle re-start and I get a few cm of water after an hour or so. However, I can't tell where it's coming from, exactly. It's so dirty and dark back there, and cramped, and the engine is exactly in the way wherever I want to look. I have no idea where it's leaking but it's definitely leaking from the middle of the bottom of where the transom meets the bilge. The leak might start way higher, I'm not sure, or it might be leaking from the very bottom. All I know is that at some point it hits the middle.

I'm kind of lost. How in the world could a leak just suddenly start after 3 months of no leak and not running, especially with a new plug and new bellows?

Here's what I'm trying to find out from the good experts of iboats:

1) What is the most likely culprit here? Drain plug? Belllows? Something else?

2) Any tips for tracking down the source of the leak in a dirty, damp, messy, cramped transom? I'm totally game for any suggestions on how to figure out what's up so I can fix it before my boat ends up in the bottom of the marina. I just can't really actually see anything back there. By the time the water hits the bilge it's a light but clear stream, but I can't see a clear point of origin.

Will take any and all advice!

Thank you everyone

 

[kd4pbs]

1. Yes.
2. Endoscopic camera. They are dirt cheap now.

 

[Scott Danforth]

"D" all of the above are potential leak points

Bright flashlight and a selfie stick or a mirror on a stick. Easier to guide than one of the endoscope cameras

 

[DeepCMark58A]

Knew a guy that had a muskrat chew thru his bellows.

 

[Scott Danforth]

Knew a guy that had a muskrat chew thru his bellows.

that was common on the old OMC stringers.

 

[airshot]

As much as I hate to say this.....is there wood in the transom that has deteriorated to cause a leak around the out drive ? Very common in glass boats over 20 years old. When the wood fails, it compresses and allows the gaskets to leak. Hope you find better news....

 

[cyclops222]

Shift cable bellows leaking ? Finally ?

 

[tabletop]

As much as I hate to say this.....is there wood in the transom that has deteriorated to cause a leak around the out drive ? Very common in glass boats over 20 years old. When the wood fails, it compresses and allows the gaskets to leak. Hope you find better news....

I guess this is possible, but does it fit the sudden leak? Just trying to picture this, I feel like it would start much slower. For what it's worth, I had that boat on a trailer for 2 months working on the bellows and the mechanics and I both spent a lot of time bouncing on the outdrive (me mostly to get in and out of the boat) and the outdrive was solid. Zero flex. The mechanics spent a lot of time just around the transom as well and seemed to think it all looked good. If there was a major problem like this, I would hope that at least one of them would have noticed and said something, and/or I would think that there would be some flex. Or am I crazy for thinking this? Like I thought bouncing on the drive was a good test for transom rot.

But in the worst case scenario... how do I confirm this? And what am I looking at for a repair?

Thanks

 

[tabletop]

Shift cable bellows leaking ? Finally ?

Not sure what you mean by finally but... maybe? Like I said they're brand new and professionally installed. And they haven't leaked for months, why would they start leaking all of a sudden when they're not being shifted?

But, if this is the issue... how do I confirm this to be the issue?

Thanks

 

[tpenfield]

If you can get your phone positioned near where you see water coming in, you could take some pics and video to share for further input.

Sources of a leak include:
Bellows (drive shaft & shift cable) (as mentioned)
Transom deterioration
Transom assembly deterioration
Y-pipe gasket deterioration

 

[Horigan]

Or get an endoscope camera, with light, for your phone on Amazon.

 

[airshot]

I guess this is possible, but does it fit the sudden leak? Just trying to picture this, I feel like it would start much slower. For what it's worth, I had that boat on a trailer for 2 months working on the bellows and the mechanics and I both spent a lot of time bouncing on the outdrive (me mostly to get in and out of the boat) and the outdrive was solid. Zero flex. The mechanics spent a lot of time just around the transom as well and seemed to think it all looked good. If there was a major problem like this, I would hope that at least one of them would have noticed and said something, and/or I would think that there would be some flex. Or am I crazy for thinking this? Like I thought bouncing on the drive was a good test for transom rot.

But in the worst case scenario... how do I confirm this? And what am I looking at for a repair?

Thanks

If it were soft wood in the transom, it could come on quickly as the surrounding materials also fail. I have saw a few rotted transmission never leak a drop but gave way while under power...material failures can have minds of their own. Glass boats are designed to have a 25 year life expectancy with good care, that drops down to 15 year average with less care. Most find a place under the floor where a hole can be drilled into the wood structure to test the wood chips. If nice and dry, tour giod, but if wet and soft....you have a big problem. Well worth testing for your own safety.
Bouncing on the outdrive can work as a test event n though not real precise, climb upon and use your weight to jump up and down, have someone watch the transom for any sign of flexing. Should be no flex at all. Drilling is the most accurate testing, drill in several places, but not all the way thru of course. Holes can be easily patched with epoxy putty and won't be noticed.

 

[cyclops222]

Have you checked every sparkplug for water ? While all are out. Spin the motor for 2 seconds to see if water spray comes out. I am trying to isolate it to the transom area. Besides the drive unit going thru the transom. Are there any other things bolted to the transom ? Swim deck with bolts thru it. A swim ladder bolted thru it. Transducers ? Trim tabs bolts ? Separate speedometer pickup?

 

[tabletop]

I think I have it narrowed down, at least mostly? The water seems to be pooling right under the drive shaft. It's really hard to see what's going on but I don't see any leaking/seeping above the drive shaft, and the main trickle is coming from a little ledge where the water is pooling directly below the drive shaft.

Does this suggest anything?

 

[cyclops222]

STOP using the stern drive as a step ladder !!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mr 88]

Sounds to me like a bellows failure , yes I know its a few months old , doesn't matter . Water will seep along the bottom of the drive shaft when water is present on the other side of the gimbal bearing . That's the only source for water to be dripping from the shaft , no water hoses in that immediate area .

 

[airshot]

Easy enough to pull the out drive and check inside the bellows for water.

 

[StewartL]

The most likely culprit is the new bellows weren't installed perfectly. A shift in the engine or a piece of debris can cause a new leak to start. The drain plug is a possibility, but less likely since you just resealed it.

To find the source, the best method is to thoroughly dry the entire bilge with a towel. Then dust the area heavily with baby powder or flour. The trickle of water will leave a clear trail through the powder right back to its source. Check around the bellows and yoke first. This will pinpoint the exact leak location.

 

[tabletop]

So... last time I checked it was on Friday. I think I said in my post that I was experiencing a pattern of finding actual inches of water in the bilge, cleaning it up, and then finding more water. I was able to see a bona fide trickle of water coming down from the transom area. Last time I checked was on Friday, and I still had water trickling and sometimes dripping down from around the drive shaft area. I had mopped it up, turned on my bilge pump, and left for the weekend.

Came back to check it today after letting it sit all weekend and... the bilge was bone dry.
I mean, there was still some moisture because it's a bilge and I wasn't able to mop up ALL the water, but I would have expected several inches of water after a weekend as that's what's been happening for a few weeks. My bilge pump still leaves like a half inch of water in the bilge, so it's not the case that the bilge pump was just getting it all. I even turned my pump off and clunked around the boat pretending to fix stuff for a few hours waiting for the leak to fill up the bilge a little (would normally take about 30 mins to get 1/8 inch of water or something, which is not a ton but is very noticeable) and after 3 hours I didn't see any additional water at all.

It's like the leak just... stopped.

Of course, this is WAY more concerning to me than having a leak. If there's a leak, at least I can fix it and know that it's fixed. Instead, I feel like I have a mystery leak just hanging over my head that could come back, possibly bigger, at some weird time.

So my question.... given that this leak just kind of stopped apparently... is there anything that this rules out? Like I can't imagine that a poorly fit bellows would magically stop leaking... or a rotted transom... but I'm completely stuck as to what could possibly spring a leak that just goes away after days/weeks.

Appreciate any insights—thanks!

 

[Fj40fiji]

Maybe put the trim and steering in different positions for a little while to see if bellows open up in some position?