2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

[bccsrc]

Hello,

I have a 2005 Reinell 191 LSE that the gauges stopped working on after our last trip out. It was pretty choppy and the boat slammed down pretty hard once and after that the gauges stopped working. I've been told to look for a loose ground wire.

Does that sound correct?

Does Reinell have a wiring diagram for this boat?

Thanks,

Brandon

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

Welcome to iboats.

A 4 year old electrical system is due for maintenance.

Probably the best thing you can do is spend some time (with the battery disconnected) and remove every connection one at a time and lightly sand them with 400 grit to a shine and re-install/re-tighten each one.

Same thing goes for the fuses.... sand off the contacts.

Yes since you lost everything I would check the ground first. Feel your wires and they should feel good and solid not like they have sand in them.... which means corrosion.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

Do not start disconnecting and cleaning wires at this point. There are only two connections that are potentials in this case. Gauges are powered by the "A" (accessory) terminal on the ignition switch. The very first check is to turn the key to RUN (not start) and then using a voltmeter or test light, check for +12 volts on the "I" (ignition terminal) on any one of the gauges except the speedometer or water pressure gauge (those are not electrical gauges). If +12 volts is present, THEN ground is the issue. If you don't have +12 volts at ANY gauge, then the +12 volt feed from the switch is either disconnected or broken. Each gauge has the "I" terminals daisy chained from one gauge to the next. Same for the ground wires. Using an ohm meter, (ignition off). Measure from the ground terminal on any gauge and ground at the fuse panel or the negative terminal of the battery. Open circuit means the ground wire from the firt gauge in the string is disconnected. There is a 99% chance the sudden shock dislodged either the ground wire or the +12 volt feed to the gauges.

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

Do not start disconnecting and cleaning wires at this point. There are only two connections that are potentials in this case. Gauges are powered by the "A" (accessory) terminal on the ignition switch. The very first check is to turn the key to RUN (not start) and then using a voltmeter or test light, check for +12 volts on the "I" (ignition terminal) on any one of the gauges except the speedometer or water pressure gauge (those are not electrical gauges). If +12 volts is present, THEN ground is the issue. If you don't have +12 volts at ANY gauge, then the +12 volt feed from the switch is either disconnected or broken. Each gauge has the "I" terminals daisy chained from one gauge to the next. Same for the ground wires. Using an ohm meter, (ignition off). Measure from the ground terminal on any gauge and ground at the fuse panel or the negative terminal of the battery. Open circuit means the ground wire from the firt gauge in the string is disconnected. There is a 99% chance the sudden shock dislodged either the ground wire or the +12 volt feed to the gauges.

Thank you for the information. Tomorrow I will go out and check it out. The wiring does look brand new so I don't think sanding would be required at this point. Does the ground go all the way back to the engine compartment or batteries? I will start off with what you have mentioned and see what I come up with.

Not to sound dumb but..... I have a +12 Volt (Red) and a - lead (Black). Is there another cable that would be a ground or would it actually be the negative cable that is a ground? :redface:

Thank you,

Brandon

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

Ground is wherever you find it but ultimately it ends up at the negative terminal on the battery. Looking at the battery, you should see the large cables going to the engine. There should also be two smaller cables (about #10 gauge) going up front. Those cables feed +12 volts and ground to the fuse panel and the ground bus. A ground bus is nothing more than a place where all grounds are connected. One big wire then completes the circuit back to the battery. This eliminates the need to run all of the wires back to the battery. Just find the "I" terminal on any gauge. That's the +12 volt line you are interested in. You are looking for the first gauge in the string. Look at the "Generic Boat Wiring Diagram" sticky at the very top of this forum. It shows how your gauges are wired.

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

One thing I forgot to mention was the horn and radio don't work either.

Checking the positive and negative on the Fuse Panel:
Key off - 12.75
Accessory - 10.00-11.50
Run position - 7.50 (what?)

There is this really annoying alarm that is red and has a positive feed and negative feed on it. Well I thought I would disconnect it because I was getting annoyed, specially in the run postion.

I hooked that negative lead to the negative clip on my meter and checked the postive lead on the fuse panel:

Key off - 12.60
Accessory - 12.60
Run position - 12.50

I hooked that negative lead up to the fuse panel and everything works. I tried chasing the normal negative cable back to the engine compartment but get lost considering I can't see because everything is so tight. Any idea where the negative cable should go?

There is this device that the postive lead goes to and has a Red 50 button on it. What the heck is that?

If you need pictures I can take them.

What should I do next?

Brandon

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

The thing with the red button is a circuit breaker. Negative lead from the battery should connect to the ground buss at the fuese panel. The ground buss is where all of the ground wires from the various devices gets connected. It eliiminates having to run ground wires all the way back to the battery. The ground buss in the picture below is the area with the spade connectors in the lower right corner of the panel. The other terminals are the output or load side of each fuse position which is were the positive leads to those devices connects. Gauges will not be connected to this panel but the ground wire might be. +12 volts to the gauges comes from the "A" terminal on the switch.

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

The thing with the red button is a circuit breaker. Negative lead from the battery should connect to the ground buss at the fuese panel. The ground buss is where all of the ground wires from the various devices gets connected. It eliiminates having to run ground wires all the way back to the battery. The ground buss in the picture below is the area with the spade connectors in the lower right corner of the panel. The other terminals are the output or load side of each fuse position which is were the positive leads to those devices connects. Gauges will not be connected to this panel but the ground wire might be. +12 volts to the gauges comes from the "A" terminal on the switch.

I am having trouble tracking down the negative cable coming from the fuse panel back to the engine compartment. Tonight I will have to find a mirror to see where it goes. I don't know if it is loose or what.

Can I run a new negative cable to the battery from the fuse panel if I can't find the issue with the current one?

Thanks,

Brandon

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

One thing I forgot to mention was the horn and radio don't work either.

Checking the positive and negative on the Fuse Panel:
Key off - 12.75
Accessory - 10.00-11.50
Run position - 7.50 (what?)

There is this really annoying alarm that is red and has a positive feed and negative feed on it. Well I thought I would disconnect it because I was getting annoyed, specially in the run postion.

I hooked that negative lead to the negative clip on my meter and checked the postive lead on the fuse panel:

Key off - 12.60
Accessory - 12.60
Run position - 12.50

I hooked that negative lead up to the fuse panel and everything works. I tried chasing the normal negative cable back to the engine compartment but get lost considering I can't see because everything is so tight. Any idea where the negative cable should go?

There is this device that the postive lead goes to and has a Red 50 button on it. What the heck is that?

If you need pictures I can take them.

What should I do next?

Brandon

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

What can't you find -- the fuse panel end or the battery end? The smaller (10 or 8 gauge) red and black wires on the battery are the +12 volt and ground wires that run up front to the fuse panel.

 

[flargin]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

Checking the positive and negative on the Fuse Panel:
Key off - 12.75
Accessory - 10.00-11.50
Run position - 7.50 (what?)

If your voltage at the battery is staying at 12.75v, then you have a problem with your connections. likely loose or dirty.

There is this really annoying alarm that is red and has a positive feed and negative feed on it. Well I thought I would disconnect it because I was getting annoyed, specially in the run postion.

I hooked that negative lead to the negative clip on my meter and checked the postive lead on the fuse panel:

Key off - 12.60
Accessory - 12.60
Run position - 12.50

I hooked that negative lead up to the fuse panel and everything works. I tried chasing the normal negative cable back to the engine compartment but get lost considering I can't see because everything is so tight. Any idea where the negative cable should go?

That is probably your alarm, and if it is like my unit (which they may have changed design from 89 to 05) it is not normally grounded, normally when one of the sensors fail, they short to ground and the positive goes through the alarm and makes the really annoying sound. I would suggest:

1. find what sensor is shorted to ground. if you have not been running your engine, it is likely the Oil Pressure sensor, which is always grounded when the motor is not running. Other sensors: Temp Sensor (overheat), Trim sensor.

2. Fix your original ground, and re-connect it to your fuse box. You can run a brand new ground if needed, but it is best to find and fix the original ground. Notice the different voltages with a good ground and bad ground. you may want to check the boat to engine connection, sometimes they get a little flakey. If you do not replace your original ground, nothing will work when your motor is running properly.

3. If your "run position" was with the motor running, you also have a problem with your charging system. If it was without the motor running, that is fine.

There is this device that the positive lead goes to and has a Red 50 button on it. What the heck is that?

The thing with the red button is a circuit breaker.

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

I don't know why it double posted.

I am looking for the negative cable in the engine compartment that is coming from the fuse panel. (Lots of fun)

I will check it out tonight.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

How many wires are currently connected to the negative and positive terminals of the battery? The cable you are looking for should be in the area of the battery and is probably already connected. You need to understand that there are two electrical systems in a boat. The one for the engine (the large battery cables which connect to the starter solenoid and the engine block, and then there are two smaller wires also connected to the battery. Those two smaller wires are the "boat" electrical system. They feed the fuse panel. Are they or are they not present and connected?

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

How many wires are currently connected to the negative and positive terminals of the battery? The cable you are looking for should be in the area of the battery and is probably already connected. You need to understand that there are two electrical systems in a boat. The one for the engine (the large battery cables which connect to the starter solenoid and the engine block, and then there are two smaller wires also connected to the battery. Those two smaller wires are the "boat" electrical system. They feed the fuse panel. Are they or are they not present and connected?

With a mirror I can barely see them connected. There is a negative from the battery and 1-3 other negative cables bolted to the engine block in the same place. It looks and feels pretty snug to me.

I have decided that I will run a new negative cable from the battery to the fuse panel, leaving any other grounds that are already connected in place.

I don't see any harm in this. Is this ok?

Thanks,

Brandon

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

I wish you would really concentrate on what is being asked. I asked how many cables/wires you saw connected AT THE BATTERY -- not the engine. There are lots of engine related circuits that get connected to the engien block, none of which are related to your problem. there is nothing inherently wrong with running another ground wire. But where are you running it from (up front) and where are you running it to (back end).

 

[bccsrc]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

I wish you would really concentrate on what is being asked. I asked how many cables/wires you saw connected AT THE BATTERY -- not the engine. There are lots of engine related circuits that get connected to the engien block, none of which are related to your problem. there is nothing inherently wrong with running another ground wire. But where are you running it from (up front) and where are you running it to (back end).

easy.....

There are no negative cables going to the batteries, except the main negative cable coming from the battery to the engine block.

I will run the new negative cable from the fuse panel to the battery.

 

[flargin]

Re: 2005 Reinell 191 LSE - Gauges not working

With a mirror I can barely see them connected. There is a negative from the battery and 1-3 other negative cables bolted to the engine block in the same place. It looks and feels pretty snug to me.

I have decided that I will run a new negative cable from the battery to the fuse panel, leaving any other grounds that are already connected in place.

I don't see any harm in this. Is this ok?

Thanks,

Brandon

Brandon,

it's fine to run a new house ground back to the battery. But I have to wonder what happened to the original house ground. You may want to look around your battery area, just to confirm there is not another "house ground" did not get pulled back into the hull. This would be the best situation. If it is one of the 3 wires attached to the block, then you are experiencing "grounding" problems. your gauges may be the first indication.

If you are having grounding problems, the next thing to likely happen is some other component may become erratic - EFI, ignition coil, starter. these are the stuck in middle of lake type issues.

If the starter has grounding problems it will take a LOT more energy to run, this can cause overheating of starter, or sparks. this can be worse...


I would suggest you may want to pull the 3 wires off the back, and clean and sand and re-connect. It is tough to get to, but not impossible, and well worth the lack of future issues.