Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

[jay_merrill]

On Sunday morning, in St. Bernard Parish (equivalent of a County in other states), two men were killed in a boat collision. Witnesses at a nearby marina/landing stated that two men from a boat "with the bow all beat up" came in to the dock and asked that someone call the police because "they had just killed two guys." They further stated that they were out in their boat, for the first time in any boat, and had misjudged a turn in the bayou that they were in when the crash occurred.

The two dead men turned out to be a father and son, ages 66 and 41. One man was found dead in his boat and the other was found dead in the water, after being ejected from the boat. It is not known at this time whether the person who was ejected died of injuries suffered in the crash, or if he drowned. There were apparently four persons total in the boat that hit them but they were not seriously injured.

This story brings a number of thoughts to mind. First, people do need to take advantage of boating safety courses if they have not been well taught by someone else - especially when they are new to boating. They also need to be careful of speed in various environments. With the advent of "stock" boats that can commonly achieve speeds of 45 mph and more, this has become more and more important. I don't have any information now to suggest that excessive speed played a role in this crash but, it is quite common where I am from. Finally, I think it points out the need for life jackets when under way. I always wear mine at anything above trolling speed and if I am out in open water and there are some seas, I wear it then as well. I also will not wear one of the inflatable life vests - if you are thrown out of a boat and knocked out, they do no good.

Best wishes to all for safe boating and please do all you can to prevent this from happening to you!

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

jay, i do wear a Stearns automatic inflatable jacket and love it.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Maybe I am a little old-fashioned - what makes it inflate?

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Jay, don't know about TD's but mine will auto inflate when you hit the water or you can manually inflate it.
Wear mine all the time I'm on the water.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

I guess I need to look at them more closely. To the extent that they might get people to wear a PFD more consistently, they are probably a good thing if they have been shown to be extremely reliable. I see the Wildlife & Fisheries guys here wearing them all the time and I once looked at one at a sporting goods store. For some reason (maybe the one I looked at?), I was under the impression that you had to release an air cartridge manually.

South Louisiana has what I would consider to be a large per capita level of boat ownership. It is a fishing and water recreation "haven" where you can boat 12 months per year. We also have a unique situation in that we have what is very literally a maze of canals that covers the bottom of the state from Mississippi to Texas. They were dug by the oil & gas industry to drill and service wells and, while they create access to some great fishing spots, are very dangerous. Boat collisions at intersections are very common here - so much so that it is not unusual to see crosses placed at the site of fatal accidents just like we all see on the highways.

With these things in mind, one would hope that we would be a little more aware of the need for wearing PFDs but it doesn't seem that we are. I seldom see people wearing them while underway. The end result is that we find ourselves reading about drownings on an all too frequent basis. Some of you who are football fans may remember an LSU/NFL player by the name of Marquis Hill. He drowned earlier this year after hitting something in the water on his jetski. He was not wearing a PFD and neither was his passenger, who survived. This is just a case in point.

Anyway, these forums are great. I have been boating for my entire life and thought I knew most of what there is to know about it. None-the-less, here I am learning something about a type of PFD that I was unaware of. I will now look at them more closely because they would certainly be more comfortable in our summer heat!

 

[45Auto]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Not sure how much hitting something in the water on his jet ski had to do with the Marquis Hill drowning. It was the reason he was originally in the lake, but he drowned when he jumped back in (a boat had already picked him up) to look for the girl.

From the New Orleans Times Picayune:

The accident was reported about 9 p.m. Sunday after a man and woman were reported falling into the water from a recreational craft. They apparently were heading to the Seabrook boat launch. The Orleans Levee Board Police said that a passing boat had briefly picked up the man, but he jumped back in the water to look for the woman.

The woman, who was rescued after a passerby heard someone calling for help, had apparently grabbed onto a piling or other structure in the lake.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Yea Jay, take a close look at them.
Very comfortable to wear and it's there when and if you need it.
The wife and I do not leave the launch without our's on.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Yea 45, I had heard that also.
He made it out the first time, but not the 2nd.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

they are not cheap but worth it : http://www.iboats.com/Automatic_Inf....258591--view_id.258591--search_type.category

and reusable: http://www.iboats.com/Rearming_Kits....258593--view_id.258593--search_type.category

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Yea I think I paid about $160 a piece for mine(Stearn), but yea, worth every penny.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

I would say that it has everything to do with him drowning, even if he was initially picked up. If he and the woman had been wearing PFDs, neither would have been in the level of danger that they were without them. He might not have felt a need to jump back in, rather than to stay in the boat to help look for her. Had he decided to jump back in, but put a PFD on before he doing so, he most likely would not have drowned. This is especially true in the area where he was, where there can be very heavy tidal flow to/from the Industrial Canal.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Good point.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Thanks for the link, TD. Now I understand why I was mistaken about these vests - there are manually inflated versions and I think that is what I saw. I would say that they should be considered to be pretty worthless. The automatically inflated ones look great and I will check them out.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Update:

I just looked at some historical tidal flow information for May 27, 2007. It looks to me like the tide would have been running at or near peak flow at the Industrial Canal entrance at about 9pm that night, which is when the accident happened. From the description that I have read of the accident, Marquis Hill and his passenger were returning to the Seabrook launch, which is right next to the opening of the canal. The woman was picked up from a piling to which she was clinging. The only pilings that I can remember in that immediate area are at or very close to the canal opening. Additional, Hill's body was recovered only a few hundred yards away, the day after the accident. While wearing a PFD is always important, this is a place where that is especially true.

 

[45Auto]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

I would say that it has everything to do with him drowning, even if he was initially picked up. If he and the woman had been wearing PFDs, neither would have been in the level of danger that they were without them. He might not have felt a need to jump back in, rather than to stay in the boat to help look for her. Had he decided to jump back in, but put a PFD on before he doing so, he most likely would not have drowned. This is especially true in the area where he was, where there can be very heavy tidal flow to/from the Industrial Canal.

We can make up "if" 's all day. If they called her name from the boat and she had answered he probably wouldn't have jumped back in. If they were both wearing PFD's and he still couldn't see or hear anything from her after he was in the boat, he would have probably taken his off and dived in looking for her, assuming that she had slipped out of hers and was under water (kind of hard to dive for someone if you're wearing a PFD).​

Not arguing that they should have been wearing PFD's (they shouldn't have been out after sunset either, per state law). I wear mine anytime I'm in a situation where it's likely that I'll be thrown into the water at any kind of speed, such as a jet-ski, running fast in rough water, etc.
Quote:​

Finally, I think it points out the need for life jackets when under way.

With these things in mind, one would hope that we would be a little more aware of the need for wearing PFDs but it doesn't seem that we are. I seldom see people wearing them while underway.

The tone of your post seemed to be that we should all wear PFD's anytime we are underway (except at trolling speeds - from your earlier post). I just don't agree with that kind of blanket statement. I do agree that this would undoubtedly be safer than not wearing them. It would be even safer not to go out on the boat.​

I generally don't wear a PFD when underway nor require my adult passengers to. I see it as a risk vs reward tradeoff and I am willing to accept the risk of not wearing one under normal conditions.​

It's been my experience that when people start pointing out the "need" for things it leads to them trying to pass laws to protect me from myself. I prefer to have the freedom to accept responsibility for my actions.

The operator of the boat has direct control over the top 7 factors in fatal boating accidents. I think that making sure none of those factors apply to me will make me safer than mandatory PFD's.

(from the 2006 Coast Gaurd Boating Report - http://www.uscgboating.org/statistics/Boating_Statistics_2006.pdf)​

TOP TEN CONTRIBUTING FACTORS
Accidents Fatalities​

1 OPERATOR INATTENTION 611 51
2 CARELESS/RECKLESS OPERATION 517 28
3 EXCESSIVE SPEED 464 39
4 PASSENGER/SKIER BEHAVIOR 390 32
5 NO PROPER LOOKOUT 368 20
6 OPERATOR INEXPERIENCE 356 44
7 ALCOHOL USE 351 133
8 HAZARDOUS WATERS 294 63
9 MACHINERY SYSTEM FAILURE 272 18
10 EQUIPMENT SYSTEM FAILURE 141 9​

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

To each his own, I guess.

Just one question though. In your profile photo, you are in the boat with a small child, presumably your child, who has a PFD on but you do not. Why?

 

[m&m252]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

down here in the fla.keys we have fishing boat captains that will track you down if you are reckless on the water . its a big area to cover for the officers of law that are assign to the keys but belive me screw up on the water down here and sooner or later you will be caught...i have had boats bump into my boat in the atlantic ocean...i have be thrown off a flats boat by some 40+ foot rocket on the water that was just a blur .. and jet skis trying to catch my wake very close calls... safe boating are and should be a must as learning how to drive a car...and yes i wear a water activated life vest when on the water ....

 

[45Auto]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

I prefer to make my lifestyle choices based on data rather than "feel good" measures. As I stated earlier, I believe that it is MUCH more effective to eliminate the contributing factors to accidents rather than try to compensate for them.

Child has a PFD on because she doesn't have the skills, maturity or foresight to compensate or react appropriately if required - IE, falling out of the boat. She is much more likely to cause it to be needed than an adult passenger.

The adult doesn't have his PFD on for the same reason he doesn't have his meteor protection armor over his head - he has evaluated the chances of needing it under the current conditions and concluded that the risk of needing it is minimal. Would he be safer with it on? - probably so. However, if he is on the kneeboard or tube or wakeboard he is wearing his PFD because the chances are much higher that he would need it.

From the 2006 US Coast Gaurd Report:

Historically, one indicator of safety in recreational boating is the fatality rate, e.g., the number of reported fatalities as compared to the number of registered recreational boats. The registered boat population is based on the annual Report of Certificates of Number Issued to Boats, which each State and jurisdiction forwards to the Coast Guard.

According to the 2006 US Coast Gaurd Report (http://www.uscgboating.org/statistics/Boating_Statistics_2006.pdf) there were 710 fatalities and 12,746,126 boats registered in the US in 2006 for a fatality rate of 5.6 per 100,000 boats (page 8 of the report).

There were 247,421,120 motor vehicles registered in the US in 2006 and 38,588 deaths. That's a fatality rate of 15.6 per 100,000 cars.

If you use the Coast Gaurd methodology, he is 3 times more likely to die in his car than he is on the boat.

I am approximately 1/3 as worried about him needing the PFD (assuming 100% of the boating deaths were drownings, which they were not) as I am about him getting killed every time he goes to work or goes home or goes to the store.

Would it be horrible if something happened and he drowned because he wasn't wearing his PFD? Yes, it would. In my experience it would be equally as horrible if he died for any other reason also. But if I tried to eliminate every chance of injury equal to or greater than needing his PFD in the avatar picture I would have to wrap him in 6 feet of foam rubber and lock him in an underground concrete bunker. There are no garantees in life and each person needs to make his choices as he sees appropriate.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

We have some of the same problems here, M&M. Too many boats running around with engines that are way over the boat's rating and too many people who do not understand that there is a difference between having a good time and running fast in the right place v. doing the same thing in a narrow and often blind, waterway.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Boating Safety - Louisiana Deaths

Those are all very nice facts but they ignore one thing - he would be no more able to help himself if he ended up unconcious in the water, than the child would be. And, if he drowned as a result of that, she would grow up without a Daddy. Why would not this man protect himself in every reasonable and simple way to do so? Why would he not protect his daughter's heart by protecting himself?