Chrysler 65hp wiring

[las]

Could someone point me in the right direction regarding finding a wiring diagram for the prestolite conversion done on my engine.

I would like to hook up a tachometer and find the wiring for shutting the engine off.
I just counted the coils under the flywheel and found 15! I thought these engine all used 20.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Should be 20??
Pics of the system?

 

[las]

No Title

I count 15 poles and then there is 5 without windings? Seems odd to me.

 

[jerryjerry05]

5 and 15 =20?
​Pics of the whole system.
​Packs and the strip where the cable connects to the motor.

 

[las]

No Title

The blue is not used and I have moved the purple due to a bad screw.

You can see under the flywheel on the other side is filled with coils....

 

[Nordin]

The retro fit kit that Chrysler offered to the 55-65 Hp twin carb engine was very very similar to the Prestolite system that was fitted to the 50Hp from 1987 and up.
Check and cross referens the colors of the wires for the 50Hp 1987 and up.

 

[las]

Nordin I think you are on to something! Found picture of a Force 50 hp stator model 507Y7C with 15 windings on the stator and 5 empty ones.....

But I'm having a hard time finding a diagram that can be read and it also makes me wonder how to attach a tach to this motor with this being a 15 pole stator? or is it using some of the poles to drive the ignition, making it a 12 pole?

I have to dig a little deeper and see what I can find.

 

[Nordin]

Late 55Hp Chrysler also used the Prestolite ignition system.
Look at maxrules, tech spec, wiring diagram, Chrysler 55Hp CD 1982-84.

 

[las]

That looks about right! From what I can see the blue wire is grounded and must be connected to the white to stop the engine.

Glad you were able to help out, it's a tough job getting all the information together for these old motors.

The tachometer still puzzles me though! Could it be 5 poles driving the cdi and 10 for charging? I looked at a photo I found from the web and there are 4 wires from the stator. But the way they are placed is stil odd....

 

[Nordin]

Yes the white is the stopcircuit, it grounds out the CD box through the keyswitch when turning the key at OFF position. The two M terminals closes (shortcut) to each other and the blue wire is grounded at terminalstrip.

About the tacho I see when watching close to the pic with terminalstrip the purple/violet wire seams to be grounded out . There is a metal jumper at the terminalstrip where the wire is connected.
Am I right?

 

[las]

Holy ...... That's my mistake, I didn't see the terminalstrip and like I said earlier I moved the purple due to a bad screw. Removed it asap and hope i didn't do damage to the rectifier.

 

[las]

Hi again, tried to hook up my faria tach today set at 12 poles, but gauge says 25-2800 rpm at high idle. 10 pole setting was of course worse!
I do have one of these photo/laser rpm readers but the sun made it hard to use. I think I nailed it around 14-1500 rpm at one time, but it have to remain a qualified ques.

Like I mentioned earlier the stator has 15 poles, very weird. I remember reading in some other thread about 3 poles being used to fire the CDI and rest for charging. But that doesn't seem to be the case.......
Two green/yellow wires enter the rectifier, purple (tach) connects to one of them, and then one red and a black.

Had a thought.
If the motor turn at 1500 rpm with 20 poles you would have 30000 pulses! Divided with 12 at the tach to convert back to rpm it gives 2500 rpm...... But I'm only counting 15 poles, it's frustrating.

 

[las]

Sun is going down and after adjusting the timing and idle I got a more solid 1-1100 rpm at idle on the laser rpm device, the 12 pole tach said 1800 rpm.....
Did the math again and it must be a 20 pole stator, ques nobody told it it only have 15 poles!

But then I had an idea, sadly not one I'm smart enough to figure out, but wouldn't it be possible to convert/invert the 20 poles AC signal by a factor of 1,66 thus giving you a 12 pole signal. Or a factor of 2 if that's easier? Making for a 10 pole signal.

Wouldn't it be fantastic for all us Chrysler people to finally be able to use a marine tach of newer date!

 

[las]

Finally figured it out!

Stator could have 1 pole, 15 or 20! It would still need a 20 pole tach.

It's all in the flywheel fellows! Did you know? I didn't.

Googled this stuff for hours, days, until i stumbled upon a site where they were talking magnets and the dime fell or what you say.
With a flashlight I could just see the parting lines on the magnets under the flywheel and counted 20.

One pole on the stator would still deliver 20 pulses for one revolution from the 20 magnets.

The reason for this stator to have 15 smaller poles instead of enlarging them to gain more current is that the flywheel wouldn't work and that would have to be changed too.
The size of the poles must match that of the magnets in order for the system to work.

 

[las]

Well to finish this thread of, I think I have a working 10 pole Faria tachometer on my boat now!
I will confirm once my cheap ebay tachometer from China shows up, it's the kind you wrap around one of the spark plugs and should be fairly accurate I think. But it's not a gauge you would consider building a new dashboard around, I wouldn't!

Last time I went out I had it switched to the 12 pole setting thinking I could do a rough estimate up to around 4100 rpm on the go, but something was way of and there might still be a gremlin in the system after all! Pulling out the harbor the tachometer almost maxed out and I thought it best to take it off.
I then figured my rectifier was dead and ordered a new one, I didn't even bother to measure it. Well now I have and it seems OK. For now that's unsolved.

At the same time I had ordered a frequency divider from Germany and it showed up today, it's a 2 to 1 divider making the tach see only 10 pulses per revolution.
I just finished mounting it, Running ear muffs it actually seems to work! Despite the gremlin still showing sometimes I saw what i believe was a fair reading for the first time, tach set at 10 pole.
With the gear disconnected it reved up to 2000-3000 rpm, before it would have spun the needle in the tach There was moments when it would fall of slightly or behave a little erratic, but that could be a bad connection at one end of the wiring harness.

I have to say it took some hard work to piece all the information together and I hope this is it and that others can benefit from this information as well.

Information on the frequency divider: This module splits a frequency scale by a certain factor. The divider is available with split factors 2-10
When ordering please specify the desired division factor.

techn. dates:
Power Voltage: 9 - 15 volt or max 30 volt f?r trucks
Division at the output signal: selectable
Output Voltage: Square wave signal at the level of the input voltage

I hope this works and will let you know once I hit the water........

 

[las]

I have now had a chance to take it to the water, and as far as I can see it works perfect! Although I haven't received my china tach. to verify with.

Running a 10x13 prop at wot and going 34mph, gearing 1.6:1, the figures are not bad and seems to back the tach up with slip a bit on the high side as expected...

So I'm glad to report that my wiring issues are all solved, and thanks for all the help! If Nordin hadn't spotted my stupid mistake I think the stator would have been long gone by now.....

Case closed.