copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

[vergil]

what would this coating be, i started a thread on removing paint from pontoons but i have run into something i didnt expect, while lightly brushing the old powder coating off, i really hope the guy from benington can fill me in on this,(even though mine is a riveria cruiser) and is it ok to remove this

 

[ONERCBOATER]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

is it actually a painted coating?
my idea if not is kind of out there
aluminum oxide is most often whitish, however other oxides of aluminum come in a myriad of colors both ruby and saphire are aluminum oxides and come in other colors besides red and blue.

water will sometimes deposite calcium and manganese giving a copper brown color....

perhaps it was just a primer for the powder coating..... or maybe they were painted at one time.
i have never seen that particular color for a primer.

hopefully someone will have a definitive answer.

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

i was at a loss as well when i seen it, the toons are in perfect shape, (even for there age 1968) not a dent 1 but there is a ton of overspray from the grey primer the person before me had it and was going to restore it and never did, this is defintly some sort of undercoat or paint, though the entire toons do not have it just towards the top, and in the middle.
also has anyone have any expiernce with that liquid alum paint?

 

[5150abf]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

It has to be some kind of primer, cna't imagine what it woudl cost to bronze a tube.

You just want to be carefull not remove alot of aluminum like with sand paper but I am at a loss as to what that could be, maybe one of the older guys will know, I was only 5 in '68.

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

i am using a wire brush, (do you think that will remove to much alum.) thank you for your reply, though i hate to hear you are at a loss as well, that is underneth a layer of overspray primer, and that powder coat

can i use a wire brush on the 4inch grinder?

 

[rickdb1boat]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Could be Zinc Chromate primer. Was used pretty extensively some years back..

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Could be Zinc Chromate primer. Was used pretty extensively some years back..

would it have been used to primer a powder coat over alum.?

 

[5150abf]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

The wires in the brush are steel which is harder than aluminum so I would say you are taking a bit of aluminum, way better than sand paper and you are probably okay as long as you don't get carried away.

Taking off 3 layers of paint you kind of don't have a choice.

All the tubes I deal with are bright and shiny, dealers add any kind of coating and such.

 

[fisherguy123]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

This appears to be a chemical treatment called "Alodine" which is used mostly in the aircraft industry to prevent aluminum corrossion and increase paint adhesion. Not normally used in the boat industry unless requested. It is great stuff ...here is a link to one manufacturer....http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/product.php?productid=364

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

The wires in the brush are steel which is harder than aluminum so I would say you are taking a bit of aluminum, way better than sand paper and you are probably okay as long as you don't get carried away.

Taking off 3 layers of paint you kind of don't have a choice.

All the tubes I deal with are bright and shiny, dealers add any kind of coating and such.

yea i thought my options were kinda thin there,

This appears to be a chemical treatment called "Alodine" which is used mostly in the aircraft industry to prevent aluminum corrossion and increase paint adhesion. Not normally used in the boat industry unless requested. It is great stuff ...here is a link to one manufacturer....http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/product.php?productid=364

like how good a stuff? so good my life will be hell trying to get it off? or will a heat gun help? or should i very lightly wet sand and just paint the toons with liquid alum.?

 

[fisherguy123]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

In my experience with alodine on aircraft, it performs a chemical reaction on the aluminum and minutely penetrates the aluminum. It never came off with an amonia based paint remover which would lift off the epoxy paint and primer. If you want to remove it, it will have to be done by a mechanical method such as the wire wheel. I wouldn`t remove such a good anti-corrosive coating myself and would just scuffsand and repaint. Here is some info on it`s properties http://altechcustomcoaters.com/alodine.php

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

The wires in the brush are steel which is harder than aluminum so I would say you are taking a bit of aluminum, way better than sand paper and you are probably okay as long as you don't get carried away.

Taking off 3 layers of paint you kind of don't have a choice.

All the tubes I deal with are bright and shiny, dealers add any kind of coating and such.

This appears to be a chemical treatment called "Alodine" which is used mostly in the aircraft industry to prevent aluminum corrossion and increase paint adhesion. Not normally used in the boat industry unless requested. It is great stuff ...here is a link to one manufacturer....http://www.chemical-supermarket.com/product.php?productid=364

the only thing i have a problem with it is, why didnt the cover the whole toons with it?

 

[5150abf]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Hey Virgil what do you want as your end result here, that may help with what you should do.

If you want nice shiny toons I am pretty sure that isn't going to happen without a crazy amount of work and you may be better off just repainting them with a good bottom paint.

 

[fisherguy123]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

if you bought this used maybe it was an area that was refinished and the part without treatment is original paint ....have you got a picture taken futher back...is it above or below waterline?

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

I believe fisherguy is right on with the alodine, after further review it apears to have had a a 2 tone toons, the underside was nice shiney, etc and the top was a set of pin strips, i am just gonna rough sand that area of where the factory paint was a redue the 2 tone theme the toon was born with( remember she was a hippie from the 60"s)(i want to keep that charm of the older boat)

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Hey Virgil what do you want as your end result here, that may help with what you should do.

If you want nice shiny toons I am pretty sure that isn't going to happen without a crazy amount of work and you may be better off just repainting them with a good bottom paint.

I believe your right (once again, thats why i seak your advice)
the end result on the toons doesnt need to be shiney, but on the other hand it will reflect the restore job, so they do need to be presentable,
whats your thoughts on liquid alumunium paint? i think that may give me a nice coat of protective paint, that is alum. in color but not crazy shiney (i dont think it was crazy shiney new)

 

[fisherguy123]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

If the old paint is good you should be alright if sanded and cleaned well but if it is chipped or peeled you need at least a good wash primer to achieve a lasting result. Don`t just wack the paint on bare aluminum and expect it to stay on for long. Check with your marine paint store or industrial paint supplier what is recommended. Most of the primerless liquid aluminum paint is for steel storage tanks and such which are not immersed and moving through water.
I hope you post some pics of your project as it comes along !!!!!!

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

If the old paint is good you should be alright if sanded and cleaned well but if it is chipped or peeled you need at least a good wash primer to achieve a lasting result. Don`t just wack the paint on bare aluminum and expect it to stay on for long. Check with your marine paint store or industrial paint supplier what is recommended. Most of the primerless liquid aluminum paint is for steel storage tanks and such which are not immersed and moving through water.
I hope you post some pics of your project as it comes along !!!!!!

hey fisher guy just came in from tryin a wire brush on the toons, and it will shine them puppys right up, (no need for liquid alum. paint) as for the top part of the toons a quick wet sanding to smooth things out, and it does look like it will be very paintable, as far as the paint, I went with an industrial marine paint, from sherwin williams, and painted some with it last year, seems like good stuff(but it wasnt cheap neither)
The only ? i guess i have left is i got a 4" non braided wire wheel, and it seems kinda stiff, but would an 8" wire wheel for a grinder be a little much?
(it would speed the toons up pretty quick)

here are some pics for you, i may start a before and after thread as well
the first pic is right when we bought her, and the next one is how she sits right now, (it took forever to get the handrails etc off as the hardware wasnt stainless and was froze up pretty bad (had to drill or grind all but 2 bolts)

 

[fisherguy123]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Id probably use one of these flap wheels, they really take off material and leave a nice swirlly finish on aluminum. They are used in commercial applications a lot. check them out.....http://www.schaffnermfg.com/Flap-Wheels.html

 

[vergil]

Re: copper or bronze coating on pontoons,

Id probably use one of these flap wheels, they really take off material and leave a nice swirlly finish on aluminum. They are used in commercial applications a lot. check them out.....http://www.schaffnermfg.com/Flap-Wheels.html

i bought a 4 inch wire wheeel just for the handrails, and for the tight spots on the toons, but was gonna get something a bit bigger for the toon, that looks like it would be a lot less harsh then the wire wheel, can you get them at lowes?