F90 cold start after 1 week no use

[rocky123]

My 2003 Yamaha Four Stroke is a sob to start if the boat sits for a week or more with out use .<br />( Yesterday took over 20 minutes to start )<br /><br />If I use it every fews days it starts like a dream and there are no idle or any other problems . If it sits a week or so I spend an embarrasing 20 - 30 minutes cranking it at the public access.<br /><br />When cold starting I pump the primer bulb until hard then turn key for 5 seconds , if it does not start I hold in on the key and crank for five seconds . Then I try raising the throttle lever and keep trying various things until it does start .<br /><br />I think it is not getting gas for the following reasons :<br /><br />While cranking it does not fire for a long time.<br /><br />When it fires one time it will usualy start and run very slow until it seems to get enough fuel to keep going. The throttle lever is unresponsive until the engine idles boggy for awhile . You dare not touch the throttle or push in on the key to choke it or it will bog out and die.<br /><br />When it starts it does not smell flooded or smoke .<br /><br />I am sure I just need to learn how to start it properly when cold. I am looking for any tips .<br /><br />I asked my local Yamaha Mechanic and he said he has the same motor and his does the same thing !<br />He said try pumping the throttle up then down five times and then starting it . They just start hard when cold.<br /><br />Please Reply !<br />Thanks

 

[marinegrh]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

by you saying choke, is this engine efi or carbed, if carbed, it the enrichment or choke working, if efi, are you getting enough fuel pressure to the rails, give some more info on th engine and well shoot more suggestions at ya, that engine should not take 20-3- minutes to start even if is sat a month<br /><br />keep us infoed

 

[jim dozier]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

If its EFI it doesn't need to be choked. If its carbed with a choke (not a primer), check the operation/postion of the choke butterflies in each carb throat. You may have choke linkages out of whack. The choke butterflies when "on" should seal the throat completely with no gaps. Also bearing in mind your history, I would apply the choke at the first attempt at cold start not after 5 seconds. If your carb has a "primer" enrichment system check to see it is priming properly. Your description sounds like an engine with an inadequate cold start enrichment system (read too lean).

 

[rocky123]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

First off THANK YOU very much for your reply.<br /><br />The Motor is a 2003 F90 and is not fuel injected.<br /><br />Here is a snapshot from Yamaha :<br /><br />"The new F75/F90 has the Yamaha Prime Start System as a standard feature. This auto choke feature makes starting the engine quick,<br />easy, and reliable in hot or cold conditions. Simply turn the key and go!"<br /><br />From what I have found there is not a manual choke, pushing the key in while cranking used to active the choke on my old evinrude , not the case on the Yamaha . The Yamaha is strictly automatic with no override.<br /><br />The dealer says all you can do is pump the primer bulb hard turn the key and pray .<br />Keep cranking until the gas gets to the plugs and she fires.<br /><br />I can't help but wonder if all this cranking will take its toll on the starter ?<br />20 - 30 minutes is too long for any starter.<br /><br />They then told me I may have bad gas. <br /><br />Hmmmmmmmmmm.

 

[jim dozier]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

All that cranking is hard on the starter and the battery. Don't crank for more than 4 or 5 seconds without a rest.<br /><br />If the gas was bad it probably wouldn't start well when it was warm.<br /><br />I am not intimately familiar with the Yamaha primer. I'm sure someone here is. If you haven't already, get a manual. It will usually describe the particulars of such things. Generally, I believe primer systems consist of some sort of electrically activated "squirter" which enrichens the fuel mixture for cold startup. A true choke cuts off the air supply, increasing the vacuum, which sucks more fuel into the engine for cold starts. It is entirely possible that your electric "squirter" is either not working at all or not working well. You should be able to see it do its stuff in the carb when its actuated. I would get a manual and check this out. <br /><br />Try squirting (with a spray bottle) some premix into the carb throat. If it fires right up you know its the primer system.

 

[rocky123]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

The owners manual says to crank 5 seconds give it a rest then repeat until it starts and that is the way I start it. Even at that rate the starter must still heat up after twenty minutes or so.<br /><br />I will probably get a service manual but I am hoping someone reads this post that has the same motor and has a work around.<br /><br />Again two local Yamaha shops have told me that cold starts are a issue with this model. <br /><br />That is no fix no solution and not comforting !

 

[pine island fred]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

thought i was the only one with this problem. got an 02 f-80 but have only been able to us it 20 or so. could not find a choke on mine. went to the yamaha manual. looks like two ELECTROTHERMAL VALVES are used for enrichment. located on the port side of the engine. controlled by ENGINE TEMP SENSOR on starboard side. temp sensor wire colors are black/yellow and black. enrichment valve wires are green/white and black ( black is ground) manual says valve check is to apply 12 volts across the valve and see if the plunger pushes out. wires that connect to plug on the valves are blue and black. also try disconnecting the plug at the temp. sensor and maby the cdi unit will think the engine is cold and energize the valves. stay in touch. its 2 in the morning(just got home from work ) beers are getting to me. talk to you later. regards fred.

 

[rocky123]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

Mmmmmm Beer .<br /><br />I checked with a third Yamaha dealer and they were willing to discuss the problem. <br /><br />It sounds like cold starts are a common problem with Yamaha engines using the "Prime Start" tm feature. I didn't even have to pry it out of him!<br /><br />This dealer said that they directed all of the customers who had the problem to start using Mercury Quickleen and also raise and lower the throttle lever 3 times to the upper and lower limits B4 starting. The mechanic claimed that no of the complainers returned.<br /><br />I presently use Yamaha Ring Free and now need to find out if I should be using both Ring Free and Quickleen together.<br /><br />Also if Quickleen performs the same functions as Seafoam I will probably use Seafoam because I am cheap.<br /><br />It is twenty six degrees out today and I doubt if I will get the boat out too many more times this year to test the problem. <br /><br />Keep me posted . Advice on additives appreciated ,there are plenty of posts to read thru when I get time .

 

[jhnboat]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

I've got a 2001 F100 with carbs which I think<br />is nearly the same engine as the new F90. Mine<br />has had worsening starting problems over the last<br />six months (lots of cranking, runs real rough, <br />then would "blow it out" and run fine) only if I<br />let it sit for more than 5 or 6 days. Turned out<br />to be carb floats/needle valves stuck in the <br />closed position. Removing float bowl plug and <br />pumping primer bulb showed no gas flowing in 2 out<br />of 4 carbs. I cheated and sprayed carb cleaner <br />into the float bowls (using rags to soak up the<br />cleaner) until primer bulb caused fuel to flow.<br />Also sprayed carb cleaner down throat of carbs<br />into all holes/venturi holes I could see (again<br />using rags and motor slightly tilted up to keep<br />carb cleaner out of engine). Guess what? Fixed<br />the problem. Real solution is probably a carb<br />cleaning/rebuild. Had been using PRI-G stabilizer<br />religiously. Going to try straight fuel for<br />a while now. I have heard of carb problems from<br />others, maybe the cranking and shaking jars the<br />needle valve loose eventually and lets the gas<br />into the carbs.

 

[jhnboat]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

yamacold, just thought of something else. Your mechanic's idea of working the throttle lever<br />all the way up and back down 3 times makes sense<br />since these motors have an accelerator pump. So<br />working the lever would pump gas into the carbs <br />and then cranking with the throttle lever back<br />down would kind of act like a choke (lots of gas,<br />restricted airflow). I'm keeping that in mind.

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

I would try priming with key pushed in for 5- 10 seconds, then with key pushed in, turn to start, leave the throttle in neutral for this. If that doesn't work try the teqnique of pumping the fast idle lever a couple of times, leave the fast idle lever half way up, prime with key and turn to start. Just some ideas, hope one works for you. I would be pissed if I had a 2003 motor that didn't start well, I'd be making alot of trips back to the dealer, if you know what I mean. Good Luck.

 

[gtl]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

I have a 2003 Yamaha 150 with the same cold start problem. It is very hard to start when cold, but runs fine when it does start. Has anyone found a solution that works.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

find a real mocainic<br /> yours is full of it<br /> your motor is broke<br /> get it fixed<br /> pumping the throttle does nothing on that system<br /> trying to start it with the warm up lever up disables the prime start system. but your motor is broke. time to fix it.

 

[FHARVELL]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

rodbolt is right about this. 2003? I'll bet it's had an opportunity to sit around long enough for the gas to sour. In as little a four months, gas turns to Varnish, VERY sticky and gummy. Disassembly and a thorough cleaning of the carbs is the only cure. Turn the key to the on position without starting and listen very closely to the engine, you should here the primer pump doing it's thing. I'm not sure but I'd think the reed valves would eliminate a need to have a choke butterfly. Carbs on an outboard are more like a carb on your lawnmower, moving the throttle does absolutely nothing but cycle the throttle valve. The fuel primer is an electric motor and is seperate from the carbs. Gum is much less plyable at lower temps.

 

[bigbrownbuku]

Re: F90 cold start after 1 week no use

it may just be the bad gas. several prime start yamahas this year came to me with cold start problems. hooked up my tank and bam! i always take a sample to see for myself and i am seeing a lot of "cloudy" gas thats causing this problem.<br />try connecting a tank with fresh gas and drain the carbs and filter, reprime, then try and start the engine with no throttle at all.<br /><br />in the beginning i would pull the carbs expecting to see gum or crud in the prime start\idle circuit areas, well after 1 or 2 of not seeing anything that might be an issue i used my day tank first.