Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

jtexas

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Some say a metal boat is more dangerous than fiberglass in a thunderstorm, but I don't see how a glass boat helps at all - fiberglass might be an insulator for practical purposes, but can it really stop a lightening strike? And, once struck, what difference could there be?<br /><br />This is purely a theoretical question since I'll never be caught out in a thunderstorm - but are there any electricity or meteorology gurus out there with the facts or at least a good working theory?<br /><br />thanks,
 

Drowned Rat

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

The only thing that would make a difference would be the height of an antenna or mast on the boat. The actual boat material has little or nothing to do with it. A boat without any antennas, mast, etc.. would actually deter a lightning strike due to their shape. Electricity will seek the closest strongest ground, in this case the water.
 

Fly Rod

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

Drownedrat pretty much said it all. An enclosed fiber glass boat would give you a little more protection.It's the antennas and stuff that you have to worry about the lightening hitting. Seen a fella that had an enclosed lobsta boat lightening hit the antenna and followed the wire down thru the roof when it came thru the roof it like exploded and the fella looked like he was hit with buck shot on the side of his head ,neck and shoulder. After some medical treatment he is o k.<br />In an open boat you could carry a length of copper, aluminum etc. pipe. When a lightening storm is comeing rig it like a mast on the side of your boat letting the bottom of pipe hang beneath the boat a foot or so and it will act as a lightening rod. In my 20+ years on the water I've never seen it used.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

The old "safe in a car 'cause of the tires" response:<br />It came down a mile through a very good insulator (air); do you think 1/4" of rubber is gonna stop it! :) <br /><br />If you didn't have a lightning rod set up, you'd probably be safer in the aluminum boat. Where the arc goes through the fiberglass, a large hole will be blown (ie, the bottom). The aluminum boat has a good chance of surviving the hit without major heating/melting. I think this is an issue with the use of composite materials in airplanes, since airplanes get hit pretty often.
 

Bondo

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

An Aluminum Boat, with a full Aluminum Cabin is the Safest Place to be, If you have to be On the Water..........<br /><br />The Reason for this is the Faraday Cage Effect....<br /><br />Read down thru this thread to the links about 1/2 way down..... It's All Explained There......<br /><br /> http://www.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=006356 <br /><br />Check it Out.....
 

MajBach

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

I agree with Bondo's response the most. While it's true the antennae do attract lightning strikes, overall your chances of getting hit by lightning increase in a tin boat. On the other hand, your chances of surviving a hit are also better in a tin boat. <br />Two fundamentals about lightning that are good to remember when trying to understand it:<br />1.It is not a bullet fired from the sky with intertia that make slight course changes while it travels; the path it travels is somewhat planned out before the strike actually occurrs.<br />2. Air is as much an insulator or deterrent of lightning as a fiberglass boat or many other insulators for that matter. The phrase or idea that a bit of glass or rubber is not going to stop a lightning bolt is somehwhat misleading - it kind of suggests that lightning does have intertia or travels from point A to B carving a path along the way. This is not the case. Media undergoes a physical change in properties to accomodate the passing of electricity. Sometimes a hole is blown clear through it from the heat and other times the media is ionized so as to conduct electrity. Either way, the lightning requires extra energy in order to accomplish travelling through an insulator. If you think of how much voltage is required for electricity to arc say an inch or so (from a finger to a doorknob or even from one side of a recepticle to the other - I think 3 feet requires something like 30,000 volts), you can appreciate just how much energy you are saving a lightning bolt by offering it a conductive path through say an antennae over air.<br />Make sure you are lower than the highest conductive point but also be careful that you do not attract lightning more than necessary by offering a conductive path. You also must be careful that any materials around you are capable of taking the full load of a strike and that you will not share in it. <br />Hypothetical: If you are in a glass boat in a storm with no shelter is it better to stand a large graphite fishing pole at the front of the boat to attract the lighting away from you but at the same time increasing the chances of the boat getting hit or to just lie in the boat an do nothing? What if it is a metal boat?<br />Answer = I don't know. <br />But I do have a homeade lightning rod for my aluminum boat that I use when I am sleeping onboard and a storm wakes me in the middle of the night. I am confident that using it is benefitial as I asked a professor at the University of Florida (world reknown prof on lightning) on the precautions I should take and how to construct the lightning rod.<br />'Course, best policy is to stay off the water.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

My phrase isn't inteded to be accurate, but convincing. :) Absolutely don't think of lightning as ballistic.<br /><br />I guess the predominant phase change you see when fiberglass boats are hit is water trapped in it going to steam, causing an explosive rupture!<br />Regular conductors will also vaporize explosively, so make sure you use a heavy guage wire if you set up a lightning rod, or you might be much worse off. I think the USCG minimum is #8.<br /><br />Air (dry) breaks down at around 80v per 0.001", so 3' would require almost 3 million V to arc across! With lightning I'm sure there's more to it though. <br /><br />I've often wondered if the dielectric effect from a fiberglass boat wouldn't make them almost as attractive as metal boats, and how many people have been lured into a false sense of saftey by what they think are insulators.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

To give the willies to anyone who puts there faith in lightning rods alone:<br />
shuttlestrike.jpg
<br />The white thing on the top of the tower is the fiberglass pole which supports the lightning rod. Mind you it gets hit a lot more often.
 

MajBach

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

Paul: Cool pic. Know where I can get the full res one?<br />BTW, my reference to the 'ain't gonna stop it' phrase wasn't directed at you; I had to re-read the posts to make sense of your above response as I hadn't even realized you wrote it. The phrase is used so often that it is taken literally and out of context.<br /><br />3 million volts for three feet? That sounds high; must have been out by a couple of zeros. I was recalling the guidelines for spaces to the insulators for high-tention wires when I came up with those numbers.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: Fiberglass vs aluminum in a thunderstorm

Here's the largest one I could find. It's STS-8 if you want to hunt some more. I guess they changed the lightning rod after that to include some wires from the top of the mast to the ground, radiating out.<br /><br />I sure hope I didn't come across as POed! I'm (and was) surely not!<br />Hmm, now that you mention it, 3MV does seem high. I checked around and the number seems to be right. Rise time on the voltage has a huge effect on that number (ie, it's easy to get a high frequency arc), but I guess you wouldn't be looking at anything like that on high tension lines. Air pressure is the next greatest thing...
 
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