force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

[wideopen98]

97 tracker party barge with 97 force 120 and first time out gears were grinding on the ramp when trying to go in reverse so got it home and adjusted cable, prop "locks" in forward and reverse and spins in neutral while motor off and will even change gears on muffs but as soon as i put in the water she will grind away but not lock into reverse, i have it trimmed the same and motor in same position so why is it doing this? Please help, just bough this thing this winter and trying to take her out, motor runs great goes in forward fine.

 

[foodfisher]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

It has resistance in the water. Needs finer adjustment or dog ears have rounded off. Grinding is not good, should thunk into gear.

 

[tater76]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

When your out on the water pull the cowl, and release the little adjustment barell, notate where it is before you make any turns. Begin turning a few rotations in one direction, reinstall, test. If need be go the opposite direction, test, etc... If you have worn gears this may help for a while, but I cannot imagine a 97 with a worn clutch dog? Maybe to much partying on that barge

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Cables could be bad.Or need adjusting.
Cover off,Shifter in neutral,Unhook the connectors on the block.
Shifter,shift again while unhooked.Find neutral.
Then shift the motor while turning the prop.
Shift to forward and reverse,then find neutral.
Adjust the connectors to match the base on the motor.

 

[wideopen98]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Cables could be bad.Or need adjusting.
Cover off,Shifter in neutral,Unhook the connectors on the block.
Shifter,shift again while unhooked.Find neutral.
Then shift the motor while turning the prop.
Shift to forward and reverse,then find neutral.
Adjust the connectors to match the base on the motor.

ok, i feel i got burned because i disconnected the cable from the motor connection thing and pulled it forward and it clicked into forward by me pulling just fine and it will go into neutral but me pulling it back fine BUT when i try to push it into reverse i can push as hard as i can and it will not click into reverse, it just wants to go back to the neutral position as if there isnt a reverse at all..help!

 

[tater76]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Was the motor running in the lake or out of the water? You need to have two people, one to turn the prop or flywheel while you shift when out of the water (easier that way). Make sure the motor is in the same down position as when you are underway. I have seen a "few" motors that have linkage issues when trimmed/tilted up to much?? I'm just looking at fixes besides tearing your lower apart Oh, have you recently dropped your lower unit? maybe to change the impeller?

 

[foodfisher]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Since reverse isn't used as much as forward (concerning gear wear) I'm leaning toward the adjustment. Got a manual??

 

[wideopen98]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Was the motor running in the lake or out of the water? You need to have two people, one to turn the prop or flywheel while you shift when out of the water (easier that way). Make sure the motor is in the same down position as when you are underway. I have seen a "few" motors that have linkage issues when trimmed/tilted up to much?? I'm just looking at fixes besides tearing your lower apart Oh, have you recently dropped your lower unit? maybe to change the impeller?

the motor would go into reverse out of water and with it turned off it will make the motor turn over when you spin the prop, and when i turn it on on the muffs it will spin in reverese, but in the water it just grinds, like i said i disconnected the cable from the little linkage thing and could pull it into forward and it made that distinct click and it would go into revers too but never did i feel that pop or ease once it go past a certain point when i tried to put it in reverse, it would just want to push back to neutral, its like the cable is keeping enough tension to keep it barely in reverse until its under a load.

 

[wideopen98]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Since reverse isn't used as much as forward (concerning gear wear) I'm leaning toward the adjustment. Got a manual??

no manual but something is fishy, like i said wont even slide into reverse when i push the linkage going into the lower unit myself, no distint click almost as if it never goes out of neutral yet out of water it is in reverse enough to turn the motor when you spin the prop...im lost

 

[carholme]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

This gearbox has the Mercury type cam shift arrangement if indeed it is a 1997. What is the s/n of the engine?

I suggest that you drop the LU and confirm gear selection of the gearcase. Then with the LU and the boat both in Fwd, install the gearcase. If there is a question about the gearshifting with the LU removed, it is a simple matter to pull the propshaft and check the clutch dogs and Fwd and Rev gears.

Gerry

 

[bentle]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Just another idea. Pull the lower off and then,
First you will slide gear shifter into forward gear.
Next on the lower unit you will shift it by hand into forward gear while turning prop clockwise
until you hear the clutch dogs make a ratchet sound.
Then reinstall lower making sure the shift pin splines line up with upper.
works best with two people because lining up the drive shaft splines with crank splines can be a bugger.
My thinking is someone may have removed the lower for some reason and couldn't get the shift right back in the right order.
1995 and up have the shift rod splines instead of the older shift rod pin style.
The directions I gave are right out of the book.

 

[wideopen98]

Re: force 120 wont go in reverse in water but will on muffs

Just another idea. Pull the lower off and then,
First you will slide gear shifter into forward gear.
Next on the lower unit you will shift it by hand into forward gear while turning prop clockwise
until you hear the clutch dogs make a ratchet sound.
Then reinstall lower making sure the shift pin splines line up with upper.
works best with two people because lining up the drive shaft splines with crank splines can be a bugger.
My thinking is someone may have removed the lower for some reason and couldn't get the shift right back in the right order.
1995 and up have the shift rod splines instead of the older shift rod pin style.
The directions I gave are right out of the book.

thank you all for the help, i have talked to a couple mechanics locally and one wants to rebuild the lower unit and one wants to replace the whole thing which is way too much, the one that wants to rebuild is saying that if the lower unit reverse is gone then all needs to be replaced...if it shifts to forward and neutral fine then why would i have to replace everything instead of just reverse. he said that if the gear dog is bad then everyything it touches with is bad....i dont want to get the run around