I am stumped, please help!

The-Machinist

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:(My 77 merc 402 is not hitting on the bottom cyl. I replaced the switch box, put in new plugs, new plug wires, Both coils are firing hot, and both plugs fire hot. Comp- 148 top- 149 bottom, When I pull the bottom plug wire nothing changes, pull the top, she dies. Bottom plug is wet, top is fine. Is this thing out of time? or am i missing something? Please help, I'm at the end of my rope!:(
 

JB

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Have you inspected the reeds and the bypass cover gasket? Could be it isn't scavenging.
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

I havent checked the reeds yet, and I dont know where the bypass cover is , i dont have the manual yet. The motor has a new powerhead, but not sure on the reeds. Is it possible for this motor to be out of time? The guy that had it before me had the flywheel off, could he have put it on wrong?
 

emckelvy

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Any signs of water on the bottom plug?

"Transfer Port" cover refers to the cover over the intake ports.

Leaking fuel pump diaphragm can flood out one cylinder. Check the back of the pump (where it sees vacuum) for fuel wetting. That's if the pump is integrally mounted to the motor, if it's separately-mounted and connected with vacuum lines, check the line to the block. If it's wet, fuel is being sucked into the crankcase and flooding the cylinder.

Given the powerhead is "new" you'd assume that the lower crank seals are good, however if you run up against the 'brick wall' and can't find any other solution, you may have to pull the powerhead and check the seals out. At least it'll come off easily enough!

Last thought, are you sure it's firing the lower cylinder? Have you checked the spark on #2 with the engine running, either with a 'firing indicator' or by hooking up a timing lite? The spark may be blowing out under pressure. If it's firing with the plug installed you know it's not an ign problem.

Anyway, Most Interesting problem, keep us posted!..........ed

P.S., given that the top cyl's running strong, it's not likely that there's anything wrong with the flywheel installation.
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Thanks for the ideas, I will check the fuel pump first thing in the morning. I am sure #2 is firing while the motor is running, its just not making any power:confused:
 

USAFitz

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Apr 27, 2007
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Re: I am stumped, please help!

hey dude, I'm kinda new to this as well but I will throw this out there. When I took my flywheel off, I didn't mark anything and put it back on wrong. Because of this, the timing was way off and it sounded horrible. I have a 4 cyl '71 65hp. So I read the manual and asked questions on here and finally figured out how to put it back on. You suspected your timing so I suggest you make sure it's good to go. On mine, I lined up the timing tick marks with an arrow that was on the pulley that the timing belt connected to. I'm not suggesting that this will solve the problem, I'm just throwing it out there that it fixed mine. Good luck.
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

I pulled the fuel pump and found some fuel on the wrong side of the rubber and it was rebuilt.Same problem. If the lower crank seal is bad I would have a water intrusion problem wouldnt I? I guess I am going to take the powerhead off tommorow and check the reeds and seals:(
 

j_martin

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

I AM STUMPED, BY THE MASTER OF MACHINES. very interesting.

You have fire in the hole on #1, and the plug is wet on #2. You seem to have spark on both.

What is the compression in each cylinder? If #2 is low, it's a major mechanical problem.

The plug is wet. Did you dry it out or change it out and try the first few turns with a dry plug? Wet plug, provided it isn't lake water wet, usually means you're getting enough fuel.

Have you actually gap tested the spark? Under compression it takes a lot more voltage to fire a plug than in the open air, usually a 1/2 inch or so worth of spark. Just because you have a nice looking spark across a plug not in a cylinder doesn't mean you have enough spark to fire the cylinder.

Is this a 2 carb engine? If so, is the suction about the same on both carbs at cranking?

If all else seems good, mark off the timing for #2 and check it. A cracked magnet could fire it so far off time it doesn't seem to be firing.

hope it helps
John
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Well, I have replaced the lower crank seal, the stator, the bypass cover, and gasket, both sets of reeds,and the trigger assy. I still have no combustion in the bottom cyl. my spark will now jump 5/8" (and make my brother pee down both legs:D) but it will not set off the fuel that is so painfully obvious in no. 2 cyl. My timing is spot on, what in the world is going on?
I may have to change my name over this one.
 

Harker

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Sep 21, 2003
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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Try a different sparkplug??? I had a new one that was bad somehow..it would show spark when out but wouldn't spark when tightened down. Is the plug wire touching something when installed and shorting out?When it gets to this point...it's usually some stupid little thing that makes you go DOH!
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

2 different sets of new plugs, and new plug wires. Im very close to taking the .45 caliber wrench to it:mad:
 

jebeebe

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Nov 26, 2006
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Re: I am stumped, please help!

just a thought. On my 6 0 someone crossed two wires on the switch box that went to the coils and two coils were fireing at the wrong time. The colors are embossed on the switchbox and a quick check found two of them switched. Had good fire but at the wrong time.
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

thanks for the idea, but i tried switching the wires around from the switch box. It wont even start that way. Im beginning to think that it might "accidentally" end up falling off the back of the boat:mad:
with the money Ive put into this thing, I could have bought a real nice motor.
 

Clams Canino

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Jan 10, 2004
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2,179
Re: I am stumped, please help!

What I've read here sounds impossible.

Except that a GREAT Merc spark will jump almost a full inch. Compare MAX jump top to bottom.

-W
 

j_martin

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Too much fuel won't fire either.

2 cycle engines ain't that complicated. When you find it, you'll probably feel pretty aaahhhh dum. Good luck.
 

The-Machinist

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

Hot damn, I finally figured it out. There was a very small hole in the casting next to the bottom reeds. I took off the bypass cover and poured the crankcase full of diesel fuel and it came trickling out. Some jb weld and she runs like a merc again. Thank you to every one who had suggestions for me, if it wasent for you guys I may have never got it going. Thanks very sincerly,
Shawn.
 

diaric

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Re: I am stumped, please help!

good for you, you get to keep the name. lmao
 
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