knob and tube wiring

[stl]

Finally I am back on the board. I had some log in issues after the change over. I need your guys opinions fast. We are looking at a new house. I had the inspection on Saturday. Turns up there is still a little bit of knob and tube wiring in this house. From what I have read K and T wiring can be perfectly functional if left in its original form. My problem is you don't know what previous homeowners have done as far as do it yourself work. As a matter of fact there was a roll of romex sitting on the guys work bench. We found three circuits (I think). The panel is an upgraded 100 amp circuit breaker system. It looks like the house has some romex, and I don't know what you call the other, but it is a hot and neutral encased in a silver colered insulation. Let me know the name of this type if you guys know what I am talking about. My inspector says to ask the home owners to replace it with modern wiring. Easier said than done. This is an old two story house with plaster walls. If the K and T wiring is going to the second level this is a costly repair. If it is going to light fixtures forget about it. Maybe I don't know enough about this type of wiring, but I believe it is potentionally dangerous to my family. I certainly don't want it to be a problem on my hands when I try to sell the place in the future. I need you guys opinions fast. Thanks stl

 

[Xcusme]

Re: knob and tube wiring

Are you referring to BX cable?? Look here http://www.seatekco.com/bx.htm

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: knob and tube wiring

I live in a house that was built in the 1850's. It has had transitions through most heating sources and electrical up-grades.

I eliminated the K & T by creating a runway to the attic for new wires and circuits and came down with the wires.

Many of my walls I have updated to sheetrock and gave myself room for new wire. In most older homes they used to run the wires along the base of the wall behind a piece of baseboard and install sockets there.

There is no easy way around the plaster walls.

I had ceramic light switches too. It was a pain however I had full control off where sockets went.

The tubes do a great job to hone knife blades. I doubt any insurance company will cover you until that system is gone.

 

[Mark42]

Re: knob and tube wiring

The home insurance company may have a problem with the K&T wiring job. Better check with them.

At any rate, I would plan on that being an expense. Get an estimate for new 150 or 200 amp service and see if you can negotiate to split the cost with the seller.

BTW, how is the plumbing? Septic? Water lines? Any lead pipe? Gas pipes? Old houses are full of surprises, but generally not full of insulation.....

 

[Kenneth Brown]

Re: knob and tube wiring

It does sound like BX cable. If it was me I would do a 50/50 with the current owners on the electrical replacement and upgrade to 200 amp service.

 

[CalicoKid]

Re: knob and tube wiring

Any knob and tube wiring is so old and brittle by now that it should all be considered a liability. Around here it is illegal to alter knob and tube other than remove it. If an electrician crosses knob and tube while working he is to remove it or contact the local inspector for consultation.

The other cable, is it a silver fabric sheathing? That was used after the knob and tube era and before NM type PVC sheathed cables. That stuff is very old also and will surely have very brittle crumbly insulation at light fixture and switch boxes. It is jointed with solder and tape. It is ungrounded.

Most houses old enough to have these types of wiring also have a mishmash of 'improvements' made to the electrical system. Beware the handyman! A 100 amp service is quite adequate unless you have electric heat/hot water or other high amp loads. If it's just routine lights outlets and appliances you're OK with 100 amps. Homeowners insurance companies discourage anything less than 100 amps and fuse boxes.

Also, home inspectors' knowledge of electrical is shallow, get your local electrical inspector in there to have a look.

 

[--GQ--]

Re: knob and tube wiring

On the contrary, upgrading your service panel without redoing the internal wiring defeats the very purpose.

Older homes with knob and rube wiring are no more than 3-4 circuits max. This can be verified inside the panel.

To be continue....

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: knob and tube wiring

Personally, I would have the existing owners get the house up to code. Those inspectors can be a pain, but they can find things that the normal person wouldn't see.

I was contracted once to update the wiring in an old Quaker house. NEVER AGAIN! It ruined the relationship with the friend that had me do it. His problem was he would have me move things that I just put in the previous weekend. Took forever to get the house done.

I agree with GQ on the precursor to romex with the fabric sheathed stuff. My house was built in 56 and that is what was used. It all has been replaced now with romex with a ground.

In your case, get them to drop the price to offset the repairs, or have the homeowner be responsible.

 

[CalicoKid]

Re: knob and tube wiring

Oh I didn't mean to imply that the 100 amp service makes everything else OK, just that the service amperage is OK. It is quite common for people to upgrade services without upgrading the rest of the electrical system, not OK but very common.

 

[roscoe]

Re: knob and tube wiring