Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

[BruinSG17]

Living my whole life on Cape Cod I've always been in/on the water but have never owned a boat. I've been searching but finding the right boat is tough, especially with a majority of listings saying "call for details" instead of giving a price. This is what I'm looking for:

1 - Outboard, this seems to be the better bet for the ocean.

2 - 18-22', I want something big enough that can get me from Cape Cod to Martha's Vineyard but small enough that I can easily tow around town or to New Hampshire. 21' is probably my ideal.

3 - Bowrider, Deck Boat, Dual Console or anything similar. It will be used for relaxing 75%, tubing 20% and casual fishing 5%. Up to 7 people likely. Heard deck boats get knocked around quite a bit on the ocean so bowrider is likely ideal. Has to have some sort of shade to keep the young kids out of the sun when necessary.

4 - 5 years old at most, would prefer something newer.

5 - $30k most for new, $25k most for used if a high quality. Used boats scare me since you don't know why the previous owner got rid of it. Afraid to buy a headache.


Right now I'm liking the 2011 Bayliner 180 OB but think it may get knocked around a liitle bit in the ocean.

Can anyone lead me to the right boat for me?

 

[Fireman431]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

If the ocean is going to be your primary venue, and the fact that you're considering up to 7 people, my suggestion is that you steer awat from the 18' boat and get back to the 20-22' models. 18' is going to get cramped very quickly and when attacking random seas, a 21' boat is not only longer, but wider, more stable, and heavier. It will handle better. With 18', I think you're going to wind up with "two-foot-itis" sooner than you think.

Deck boaks are a very stable ride and there is plenty of room for moving about. Whay about looking at something with a small cuddy. such as a walk-around model? Is there going to be an issue with weather, sun, or little kids (and women) who require a porta-potti? Than a small cuddy is nice. There are plenty of models to help you determine what's right for you. Go to a showroom and start standing in the boats with your family and see how much room you need. Get the salesman in there also and see how much room gets taken up quickly. An outboard will free up a bit more interior space. Once you determine what style of boat you need, then go find it.

Once you're ready to purchase, have a survey done. Check the floors/transom/stringers for rot. Have a mechanic go through the running gear and give it the annual tune up, impellers, fluid changes, etc.

If you haven't had one, or had one in a long time, take a boating safety course and make sure all of your required equipment is present and working. Don't forget electronics. VHF, GPS, and even possibly a EPIRB anr going to make your trips more enjoyable and safer.

Best of luck!!

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

Thanks, a lot of good info there.

I'm on the fence for the Cuddy. They get hot and take away from the outdoor space on the boat. Don't want to stick a couple people on there for the day if that's all the space we have. Looked as the Bayliner 192 Discovery. Liked it but no outboard.

Do you have experience with deckboats? I have read on here that they are a bumpy ride in the ocean.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

If I was you, for your boating scenario.......it'd be dual console all the way.

 

[Bamaman1]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

Like #2 said, go around to boat dealerships to figure out what boats serve your needs. Then, research comparable boat brands and specific models that will work for you.

Then, get into the internet to research what's available in your retail market area. I use BoatTrader.com and EBayMotors.com mainly filtering for acceptable distances, brands, types of boats, etc. You can also look in big city newspapers and Craigslist.com for your area for used boats. BoatTrader also has printed magazines available at drive in markets and book stores. There are many places to look for used boats.

Once you go through the available advertisements, you'll probably be better educated to the retail boat market and comparable prices.

Be sure to keep your feelings out of it, and make your purchase a business decision. Be open to different brands of boats and motors--there are just so many different good combinations. When you're really serious, get an in water demonstration.

Good luck in your search!

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

A bow rider is the last thing you want. You need something seaworthy.

Focus first on the hull design (outside, not interior)--deep V and a decent flare. Look on line or in person at the Sea Hunt Triton series, 21', as an example; it is a very typical hull. Second choice for seaworthy, but not as smooth, is the cathedral hulls like Whaler ($$$) of Carolina Skiff ($), Look at that 25' Carolina; it will get you and the whole church choir out there, dry.

I agree with you about not having a cabin. Others will point out that your boating area gets cold and they are good to have, which is true. You just trade off a few passengers for a cabin, in my view.

I believe that the Sea Hunt and Key West puts its dual console interior in the same hull as the centers, so you get that essential flare. Grady probably does, too. The Sea Hunt Ultra is well outfitted with seating, too, and again, the seaworthy hull.

As for capacity, keep this in mind: A boat that is rated for 7 is seldom comfortable for 7, especially on a long trip. And they have to be under 150# each, or match up the 200# guy with a 100# guy. A bow rider or boat with a lot of built-in cushions, padding, curvy consoles, dash boards, have even less room per foot of length than an open design, and get crowded real fast, and are worthless for fishing.
Further, most people riding in open water prefer to stand. No one likes to sit in the seats in the back so disregard them for seating while moving. And in open water, there is a wet side and a dry side, so it's good to have options to move around, rather than having each passenger stuffed in his or her hole for the entire ride. A good center console with bow seating gives yuor passengers lots of options and room to move around. (This is why you look at them all at the dealer's, first. Take the family with you, and sit down in one, with a couple of salesmen.)
Walk around the marinas, talk to the experienced boaters and see what they have. Find people who make that run (try local fishing forums). Talk to them about which hulls are wet or not. See what they say about running a cathedral hull (usually called tri-hull but technically not). After all, Whaler's first name is Boston. You won't see many bow riders--for a reason.

I wouldn't be afraid of a used boat; there are substantial savings there. Even new ones have problems, and every new one will be old after a year. You can get about 25% bigger boat by buying used. Just my opinion; we've all heard the other side.

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

I don't know if I like the seating set up on that sea hunt triton. I like the seating set up on the bowriders/deck boats because it's more of the hanging out with friends for the day set up. The center consoles seem to get away from that feel. I could be wrong, I've only been on a couple.

Is there any boats out there with the bowrider seating set up and a deep hull and OB. I can't find anything in my price range.

Do I need to create a new style boat?

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

I think I may have found something that meets my needs:

http://www.thebaitshopinc.com/m_vehicledetail.asp?pov=2084854&ps=6

2011 Key West 211 DC

I would probably look for an older model or an end of the season leftover to get the price down.

Can someone tell me the pros and cons for this boat?

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

Is there any boats out there with the bowrider seating set up and a deep hull and OB.

Yes, "dual consoles". However, they are a somewhat recent "invention" so there aren't going to be as many older ones around.

 

[silveraire]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

A bow rider is the last thing you want. You need something seaworthy.

Focus first on the hull design (outside, not interior)--deep V and a decent flare. Look on line or in person at the Sea Hunt Triton series, 21', as an example; it is a very typical hull. Second choice for seaworthy, but not as smooth, is the cathedral hulls like Whaler ($$$) of Carolina Skiff ($), Look at that 25' Carolina; it will get you and the whole church choir out there, dry.

I agree with you about not having a cabin. Others will point out that your boating area gets cold and they are good to have, which is true. You just trade off a few passengers for a cabin, in my view.

I believe that the Sea Hunt and Key West puts its dual console interior in the same hull as the centers, so you get that essential flare. Grady probably does, too. The Sea Hunt Ultra is well outfitted with seating, too, and again, the seaworthy hull.

As for capacity, keep this in mind: A boat that is rated for 7 is seldom comfortable for 7, especially on a long trip. And they have to be under 150# each, or match up the 200# guy with a 100# guy. A bow rider or boat with a lot of built-in cushions, padding, curvy consoles, dash boards, have even less room per foot of length than an open design, and get crowded real fast, and are worthless for fishing.
Further, most people riding in open water prefer to stand. No one likes to sit in the seats in the back so disregard them for seating while moving. And in open water, there is a wet side and a dry side, so it's good to have options to move around, rather than having each passenger stuffed in his or her hole for the entire ride. A good center console with bow seating gives yuor passengers lots of options and room to move around. (This is why you look at them all at the dealer's, first. Take the family with you, and sit down in one, with a couple of salesmen.)
Walk around the marinas, talk to the experienced boaters and see what they have. Find people who make that run (try local fishing forums). Talk to them about which hulls are wet or not. See what they say about running a cathedral hull (usually called tri-hull but technically not). After all, Whaler's first name is Boston. You won't see many bow riders--for a reason.

I wouldn't be afraid of a used boat; there are substantial savings there. Even new ones have problems, and every new one will be old after a year. You can get about 25% bigger boat by buying used. Just my opinion; we've all heard the other side.

very good advice right there. A used duel console would prob be your ticket. At the price you are looking, make shure you get a good long sea trial, have a mechanic check it out, and get a survey. Well worth the money on a used hull. Only other thing to keep in mind is that I have seen alot of duel consoles that are underpowered. I'm assuming that since it was a new trend, they did it to keep the prices down and get them moving. While an underpowered boat will be cheaper, it can open itself up to a whole set of new problems in the right conditions.

chad

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

that's a good set-up and consistent with my advice--you start with a seaworthy hull design first. That same hull design is on thier CC's, I believe, and they are regarded as good mid-level boats. I still have the 1988 my dad bought new for the family (different hull, though).
Look at Sea Chaser, too. Did you look at Sea Hunt Ultra? it has more seating (banch seat in the stern) than the triton. Escape is the DC set-up.
I'm looking out the window at my next door neighbor's SH Escape (DC), next dock down from my Triton (CC). It's a nice looking boat with a good hull.

http://seahuntboats.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=93&Itemid=119

I find from experience that the bow seating in most CC's are good, perhaps better, for "hanging out" because they are roomier. But it's not that big a difference and any passenger who whines about seating is chum. You will enjoy that Key West or something similar.

I think I may have found something that meets my needs:

http://www.thebaitshopinc.com/m_vehicledetail.asp?pov=2084854&ps=6

2011 Key West 211 DC

I would probably look for an older model or an end of the season leftover to get the price down.

Can someone tell me the pros and cons for this boat?

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

What do you think about the motor on it?

 

[silveraire]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

No prob with it being an etec, but I would like to see more than a 150hp on that hull. I would say a 200 or a 225 would be nice on that boat. That is just my personal pref, but with added deadrise and weight of a duel console over a bowrider of that size, it will take more snot to get up and keep it on plane. I would go bigger, especially if you will be doing watersports with it.

chad

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

150 is a stock engine on a 21' V hull, I have one, it will be fine.
But.
The reason it's the stock engine is because it's cheaper and therefore keeps the price down. (some low-end boats intentionally underpower them for this reason--the ones with color ads in the Sunday paper). So you can't go smaller and you may be happier with something bigger--for example, if speed is important b/c you make long runs on flat water to a frequent destination (on rough water you won't be going that fast to matter). or if you frequently carry a lot of people (4-6). Or if you may get caught and have to beat in against adverse weather.
So for me, 150 is fine. Better gas "mileage" too. But for you, you might want another 25 horses. OTOH you may never know the difference.

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

How accurate is nada pricing?

http://www.nadaguides.com/Boats/2010/Key-West-Boats/211-DUAL-CONSOLE-21/Standard-Equipment

 

[NYBo]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

How accurate is nada pricing?

http://www.nadaguides.com/Boats/2010/Key-West-Boats/211-DUAL-CONSOLE-21/Standard-Equipment

Not very, but it can give you a very rough idea of where to start.

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

So this boat is listed for sale just under $33k...

http://www.thebaitshopinc.com/m_vehicledetail.asp?pov=2084854&ps=6

Nada listed the 2010 msrp price at around $26k. Did the MSRP go up $7k in 2011?

I'm having a really difficult time finding accurate prices online. It seems like dealers have a lot of potential for easy mark up as there is no convenient way to get MSRPs or invoice pricing for boats.

I have cleaned up on my last two car purchases by doing a lot of online research, mostly on message boards, not finding the info I need for the boat.

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

I think I found the model of boat I want. The only thing it doesn't have is an outboard. I priced out some of the dual consoles such as the key west and they are nearly $20k more.

2011 Starcraft 2119

Problem is there are no Starcraft dealers within 100 miles of me. They are going to be at local boat shows in the fall/winter. Will they sell direct at the boat show? They say this is their number 1 seller so I'm assuming they will definitely have one there.

MSRP is $25-30k so is a target of $20-25k realistic?

http://m.boatbuys.com/view_test.php?id=715

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

better to get one from a near-by dealer. you will have problems and you need to be close by.

 

[BruinSG17]

Re: Please Help me find my FIRST BOAT!

There are no nearby dealers...does this make it a no go?

Does anyone else have any opinions on the Starcraft, seems like a good boat and seems to meet most of my needs.