Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

[biglurr54]

Im building a list for my party boat rebuild and have an idea on the battery/ stereo area. I am going to use a 300/4 channel amp for the power which will run off my cell phone. This will drive 4 6.5's in home made PVC tubes up on the bimini. I have a very similar set up in my bow rider and it pulls about 5 amps max. I dont blast the speakers. Just enough that you can enjoy music on the boat or in the water. I have been left with a dead battery while on the lake. Lucky my motor is tuned well and I have always been able to pull start it with a rope. Not an easy task as its a 120 hp looper. I have it setup for 2 batteries with an isolater but the cost of buying two new batteries ever two years was adding up. I went with one battery this year and had some issues with it. I began to buy starting batteries from walmart for $100 with three year warrenty. The party boat will have a higher electrical demand than the bow rider because it wont turn high rpms while running and it will do alot more drifting while the musics on.

My thought was to buy one walmart starting battery for $100. Then buy a 100 watt solar panel and 10 amp solar charger for the panel.
The panels can be had for $120 and the charger is $25. If that saves me from having to only buy one battery every three years instead of two batteries it pays for it self pretty quickly. If the stereo is pulling 5 amps while in use the solar panel will put about that much out. This should mean the battery will always be at 100% unless its cloudy which we wouldnt be out or if were out at night. If either of those situations were the case i would have a battery at 100% to start with which should suffice those two circumstances.

Anyone see a problem with this?

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Where are you planning on mounting a 4' x 2' solar panel?

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

On the bimin top. I have enough room up there for a lot of panels.

 

[gm280]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Not wanting to burst your bubble, but let's run some numbers. You stated that your stereo will be a 300 watt 4 channel setup. That is probably the RMS wattage and not the Peak To Peak totals. But let's use that number anyway. 300 watts will draw a little over 23 amps driven to that 300 watt level at 13 volts. Since you are installing one 100 watt solar panel, I don't see it keeping your battery charged.

First of all 100 watt solar panel is the absolute best that panel can output with perfect conditions. Assuming those perfect condition will not happen very often it will not be outputting near that wattage either. Then you stated that you have a battery charger to use that solar output to charge your battery. Anytime you make changes to the supply, you loose efficiency. So again, I just don't see it all working as you predicted... Maybe two or three 100 watt solar panels could keep up, but only IF you don't drive the volume up very high.

Even at average listening levels, bass take an amazing amount of wattage to reproduce those tones. Say you are drawing a mere 10 watts and there are some serious bass passages, that number can quickly quadruple to ten times or more instantly. And lastly figure about only 50% of stated output on average for solar panels. Anything more is gravy, and remember solar panels start decreasing their abilities the moment you start using them. They don't last forever. Numbers just don't lie! JMHO!

 

[midcarolina]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

IMO.......... I think it would be much less work if you take the money the solar panel would cost and buy a good jump pack.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Then you stated that you have a battery charger to use that solar output to charge your battery. Anytime you make changes to the supply, you loose efficiency.

He's using a solar charger. They are made to connect to solar panels so that they don't overcharge batteries.

I don't think the panel will keep up either because it will be flat and not angled properly to the sun. Panels are rated at 17V or so so the actual current output is watts divided by this large number so the current is much lower than one would think.

If the stereo is not loud, 5A average draw is a very reasonable estimate.

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

5amps is an average of what the system actually uses. Measure with a multimeter on the actual system. Your 300 watt estimate is if the amplifier was putting out 100 percent power constantly. This would be ear poppingly loud and it would not be music at all. Just one tone. Amps pull random power as needed. The same amp will pull a lot less amps for country music compared to rock music. Then when its turned down ot makes a huge difference as well. 5 amps is my average. I belive the solar charger would keep up. Remember I would be at 100 percent at the start of the day. Then park and listen for 5 hours max. All the while slowly harvesting power from the sun. If I'm at 80 percent battery after 5 hours then I drive back to the dock and the battery will be back to 100 percent. I know it may not be enough to power the stereo solely at the time of use, hence the battery as a buffer. I would get 12 hours of some rate of charge for 5 hours of radio use. My father have a 7 kW system on his house. Heating water and doing 100 percent of his electrical. His array is big but considering what it does its not that big. He has thegrid as a battery. thanks for clearing up the charge debate Bruce.

 

[Star]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

All of you solar dreamers must work in D.C. !! IT WILL NOT WORK!! The cost is prohibitive as actual applications prove.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

All of you solar dreamers must work in D.C. !! IT WILL NOT WORK!! The cost is prohibitive as actual applications prove.

You can get a 100W solar panel for $150 and a charge controller is pretty minimal. If all he wants to get is 20A hours a day, that's actually very doable. If he has room for a 4' x 2' panel then he is fine.

Maybe you can explain why you think it it will not work! I had a similar solar panel on top of a horse trailer and it worked great. My parent's had solar panels on the top of their 5th wheel and they dry camped all the time.

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Solar panels have their uses, I have been using a 15 watt to keep my battery topped off between boat trips.

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

I guess all the guys who sail blue water have two panels hanging off the back of their boat for looks.?.? What I do know is i have seen that 30 panels will power an entire 4 bedroom 3000sqft house and work shop with everything but heat running off them. Its grid tied but there is excess energy sold back to the power company each year. If 30 panels can power an entire house/shop with losses due to converting to ac, i got to imagine one panel will power a radio with out having to convert to AC. If your going to make the argument that the home system is grid tied its irrelevant because we didnt discuss battery size and thats all the gird is, just a large battery.

Room to mount a panel isnt that crazy of an idea. My pontoon has a fixed roof. Not that it even matter. You could easily mount a panel on any bimini frame where it would be out of the way and wouldnt shade much at all.

Any one see the flexible solar panels? I have no idea why these arent in every boat cover as battery chargers/maintainers.

 

[gm280]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

biglurr54, I'm a bit confused now. Your very first post basically described what you had plans on doing with your boat. BUT you also asked for comments or issues with that setup. And now you are basically chastising anybody that seems to think it will not be as great of an idea as you initially thought. So did you honestly want other opinions or not? I think you knew all along what you were going to do whether others agreed or not. I solely went with mathematical numbers absolutely knowing electronics extremely well with a 38 year electronic career, and not idealist dreams. I hope your setup works out for you. But next time don't ask for other folk's opinions if you are going to challenge them anyways. Just do it and happy boating... However, with that stated, do let us know how it really works out either way. We all have lots to learn yet too...

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Since he has a fixed roof, his plan seems fine to me. For most boats, there isn't enough room to put one on but he does.

And now you are basically chastising anybody that seems to think it will not be as great of an idea as you initially thought.

There is a big difference between chastising...

...and this

All of you solar dreamers must work in D.C. !! IT WILL NOT WORK!! The cost is prohibitive as actual applications prove.

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

GM, I appreciate you knowledge of electronics. This is what I am looking for when i post on the forum ... Constructive criticism ... With that, I will question things that I believe are not true with an open mind eager to learn. I do know solar and I do know a bit about car audio as well. I know that a 100 watt panel will most likely put out 90% of its rated wattage in the best conditions. I also know that the solar controllers on the panels wont let it do anything unless it is at 60% of the ratings. I have a good understanding of the amount of solar exposure the panel will get.

I also know what the exact stereo system will pull for AMPs when it is running at the volume it will be running due to it being hooked up to an multimeter. I understand the math equation you did but audio watts are not the 12 volt watts that come from the battery. That is a rating for the amplifier. i figured this all out when i hooked up the multimeter to the stereo and got no where near the draw a 300 watt amp will draw.

So I will go through the math again with what I have known to be true. I am open to constructive criticism. I am not open to people just saying that i am stupid, it wont work, and I hate solar panels with nothing to back it up.

So my stereo pulls 5 amps on average at volume. (Tested with MultiMeter) This is a fact and not assumption.

1 100watt solar panel putting out 12 volts would produce 8.33 amps. Like I said before I understand that panels dont put out 100% and it is not always sunny and beautiful out. With that, the stereo is not running 100% of the time either due to me needing a job in order to pay for all the electronic gadgets. I am making the assumption that if the stereo is running with out the motor running it is either night and this convo is completely irrelevant or it is idea solar charging time (Sunny). If I am only pulling 5 amps then i should be able to achieve that with this system no problem.

The solar charger I am talking about does not reduce efficiency of the panel. It basically says charge the battery or dont. it also slows to a trickle to top off the battery instead of hitting it with 5-8 amps until full. Its 12 volt to 12 volt. The efficiency loss is when you convert to different voltages and then there is a huge loss when converting from DC (solar panels natural current) to AC.

Again, I'm not trying to be a ****. I just feel like every jumps at shooting down solar the second it is brought up. Its a very viable resource that was too expensive to be viable but a lot has changed on that front and it is now come down in price so much that a lot can be done with it. Complete RV's are off grid with just two panels running ac cooking, lights, stereos, fans and so forth.

I look forward to the constructive criticism.

 

[Star]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

If you don't use your boat a solar maintainer is fine. If you use them to light a small trailer for two hours being as you already have a battery bank. You do not get enough curent to charge a deep cycle!!! And by the way what did the 30 panels, charge controler, and battery banks cost with the inverter? Oh well I rest my case... Let us know how you do and what you do when you run out of juice!

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

The thirty panels are ground mount with individual inverters on each panel then grid tied so no bank. It cost $40,000 but NYS refunds and Federal refunds dropped the price to $19,350. It had to be installed my a NYSRTA certified installer and everything had to be inspected with a fine tooth comb. But never paying for electricity again is pretty nice. Rates here in NY got up to .28 a kwh this winter plus delivery.

I need something more than a maintainer. My lake is small. Mainly we cruise to the middle anchor and release party island which is a ton of inflatables then we motor back in when everyone is sun burnt. Were just close enough that if anyone is too hung over to get to the dock before launch then can swim out on their inflatable to join the party. This doesnt leave much room for the motor to bring the batteries back up.

I know put a charger at the dock right. ... Wrong. Its a good 2000 feet from the main at my house. Plus there is a county rd that i have to cross. We take the ATV to the lake front because its too much to walk all the time. so electricity at the dock is out of the question. I'm working on building a stationary array at the property to power a small cabin there. Off grid cabins are becoming popular. I little more involved then a solar radio/charger.

Needless to say a solar maintainer wont quite cut it for me. If only I could get power at the lake front then life would be a lot easier.

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Ahh your talking about a solar charger in a cover. What about the boats like me that go out whack the crap out of their batteries then cruise back to their slip/mooring without power. The cruise back will bring the batteries up some but not full. Then they sit all week and are expected to do it again in 5 days. I know there has to be a use for it. Specially if it can be done for around $100 on top of the cover. What does it cost to just run electricity to a dock thats 50 feet away from the breakers.

Your probably right, which is why it isn't main stream. Im just always looking for my billion dollar idea. Im tired of working shift work.

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

I more or less do the same thing, a 15 hp motor with a 4 amp charging system and no power at the slip. I run a 400 Watt stereo a live well aerator, black light and a plug in pump to inflate stuff. I run a single group 29 duel purpose battery due to weight. Last year I added a 15 watt panel and a charge controller. After a day of fun in the sun I tie it up at the slip and a few days later its back to 100 % of charge.

 

[biglurr54]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Wow 15 watt panel. Im guessing its a real solar panel and not one of the maintainers they sell that plug into a cig outlet right? Ive heard the ones that plug into the cig outlets only trickle and maintain.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Solar power for the Stereo on Pontoon boat.

Wow 15 watt panel. Im guessing its a real solar panel and not one of the maintainers they sell that plug into a cig outlet right? Ive heard the ones that plug into the cig outlets only trickle and maintain.

A 15W panel is only trickle charge. Might be lucky to get .75A out of it. These panels are rated at around 18V so even the 100W panels are only going to be putting out 100/18=5.5A and that is of they are angled to the sun and not laid flat on the roof.

I would only rely on the 15W panel to put on a 100% charged battery.