Stay AWAY from this business!

[Homerr]

Apoligies up front if this is the wrong forum. It kinda has to do with boats since I was ordering boat parts...<br /><br />I tried to order some parts fropm EBasicpower.com. I got an e-mail saying that my address didn't match the billing of my credit card. A very minor issue that most of us has ran into one at some point or other...<br /><br />I called them to see what the problem was. The person I spoke with said the numbers didn't match. I asked what numbers he was talking about, since I was looking directly at thier shipping invoice and my credit card statement. The only differance I can se between their invoice and my card statement was my middle intitial. I didn't originally include this on the order since I've never had to before. Infact, most places I order from delete the middle initial.<br /><br />Anyways, on to the story:<br /><br />He said when we run the card through, it came back invalid/numbers wrong (or something like that)<br /><br />I explained to him that if it was the card number he was talking about, I use 'virtual' card numbers. Most of us internet users know what this is. Obviously he didn't as he all but called me a liar and said he was cancelling my order! Yes he said this! He said 'We don't use virtual numbers 'round here. If you give me your real number..yada..yada..yada...<br />I said I'm not giving you my real number! That's why I use virtual ones!<br /><br />I tried (calmly) to explain to him that a virtual card number is simply a different computer-generated card number that is attatched to my main acount. I set the spending and time limit on the card. This way your real number never gets onto the internet. This is used by just about all major banks now. Very secure.<br /><br />He obviously didn't have a clue what I was talking about. He tells me to "buy it locally"<br />He asked how much my order was. I told him. (It was a small amount under $60)<br />He then basically said since the order is so small, it's not worth our time, go somewhere else.<br /><br />CAN YOU BELIVE THIS ?? !!<br /><br />I use my virtual numbers all over the internet. I have not had one single problem until this guy.<br /><br />I am calling the store owner tomorrow. His back-yard moron needs to be fired in my opinion. You don't treat customers or people like this PERIOD!<br /><br />What a jerk.<br /><br />Sorry for venting guys, but I feel that I needed to let everyone be aware. After all, word of mouth goes a heck of a long ways...<br /><br />H.

 

[sea wolf]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

if u don't trust the co. with your card # u shouldn't order from them. after all, u contacted them, not vice versa. correct? i recently ordered some parts from the co. your refering to & they were very professional & courteous to me. i believe your critisisms are way off base. there's 2 sides to every story. i'd like to hear both. it's not fair to slam a business on this forum just because u don't agree with their policies.

 

[JB]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Sorry, Homerr.<br /><br />I agree with Sea Wolf. There are two sides and this board is not the place to bash someone who is not here to defend himself.<br /><br />I don't like the idea of virtual numbers, it spells suspicion. There is a small fee involved, but Paypal is an instant and secure way to do business without putting your card number in the hands of someone you don't know.

 

[Homerr]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

No, I slammed their business because the guy was an idiot. <br /><br />He didn't want to try and help me at all. he could have simply said." I'm sorry, youll have to speak with a representative in the morning that deals with that" or whatever.<br /><br />I was simply trying to figure out what the incorrect information was and this guy wanted to argue. He gave me the complete sense of "If it don't match, you must be a crook. I don't want your business" <br /><br />Ok, I'll buy that. He's trying to be safe. But when he asked what my order total was and told me it wasn't worth bothering with? WRONG ANSWER!<br /><br />And here's another news break: I just checked my credit card account online. It shows that they infact charged my card! So what's the problem!<br />If things didn't match folks, there wouldn't be a charge now would there!<br /><br />I realize this guy doesn't know what virtual cards are. I know I must have confused him, but you DON'T tell your customer your business is not worth their time. That's the point I'm trying to make here. POOR customer service (in my opinion)<br />Sounds to my like 'ol Johnny late-shift is a bit disgruntled. Actually I think he's just a different generation that either doesn't like the internet business or just plain doesn't know about it. In either case, he needs to learn how to properly deal with internet business.<br /><br />I will never give my real number out on the internet. I've had my real numbers stolen twice NOT because of the business I was dealing with, but becasue it was intercepted in transit. This happens more often than you think.<br />And yes, I run the latest firewalls and security patches. (If that's even possible on a Windows platform..Linux is best)<br />As you well know, any time you are connected to the internet, you are at risk.<br /><br />If you're giving your real number on the internet, you're more gutsy than I'll ever be again. I think of it as playing Russian roulette (Hope I spelled that right)<br />Sooner or later...Well, You get the picture...<br /><br />At least with secure web sites and virtual numbers, you can feel almost 100% safe. The beauty of the virutals is you can set the limit.<br />Giving your number over the phone is also risky. You don't know if freckled-face Johhny over there is copying the numbers down for later use.<br />Does this happen? You bet! Hard to get away with? Yes and no. Depends how good he is.<br /><br />Yes, I'm sounding a bit paranoid, but try having your life up-rooted becasue some low life breached your card #. Try it sometime.. And bring the aspirin. My card companies were very quick to deal with it, but it was still a nightmare of headaches. You're only liable for $50, but you still have to go through the hassle of changing your cards etc...<br /><br />Virtual cards isn't about NOT trusting a company, it's about interent security. I don't have a problem trusting EBasic. I have a problem with a very rude person working there.<br /><br />Trust me..I'm married to a customer service rep.!<br /><br />JB:<br /><br />What's suspision about a virtual number? It's the most secure way to shop on the internet.<br />You set the limit. If it's ever breached, they can only get the amount you set.<br />Best thing credit card companies have ever invented.<br />I have Pay-Pal. I've had it a long time now. I buy and sell on E-Bay all the time using them. They are great. Problem is, not a lot of businesses on the internet use them. I also give Pay-Pal my virtual numbers. I have not had one problem with them.<br /><br />'Nuff said..I'm back to my boats...<br /><br />H.

 

[frroog]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Well I guess you have never worked with costomers. I do on a daily bases. You most likly tried to make him the fall guy. For the problem, AND for you info I have told people to shop some where else for much less. I wish everyone to spend 1 month on the other side of the counter. You might learn something. Even if you run into 1 bad employee that doesn't mean that you should bash the company. I have people come in on holidays and tell me I shouldn't have to work on them. But if we close 1 day year (Dec 25) you get HUNDEREDS of complains because someone need a box of butter or a loaf of bread and how WE ruined their holiday so LAY OFF.

 

[ShafferNY]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

I don't know both sides of the story, but if some guy told me that my order wasn't worth it, and to shop somewhere else, I'd tell him to F-Off and have done so before. Just because this guys order only came to $60, the next order might come to $600. It doesn't matter how much the orders for the custom service should be the same, that's the bottom line. Ask any business owner.<br /><br />And you say you shouldn't judge a company by one rep., BS, it's the company who hired them. If I was in this situation, I'd bash the company too, but only after making it clear to the company, "you either make this right, or I tell everyone I know what kind of customer service you have, and I really get around on the internet!" I'm sure they'd see my things real quick.<br /><br />Just my $.02

 

[racohoon]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

I agree w/ Homerr and SchafferNY. Your employee is the branch of your company that the consumer must deal w/. Being very polite or telling consumer you can't answer that; but can connect you to someone who can; even when the consumer is chewing your a**, will almost always deflect potential disaster. EVEN WHEN THE CONSUMER IS DEAD WRONG-- DON'T TELL THEM THAT!!!!!!!<br /> No employee should ever tell a customer to shop some where else! Never!!!!!!!! The company went into bussiness for one of two reasons or both--<br />A) To provide a service/product based on whatever need<br />B) To make profit from it.<br /> If your employee tells someone to shop some place else- we don't need you or your money! They have just cost the company money. <br />You gotta love good ol' fashion supply and demand. Can't make any money if you have a whole lotta supply and some jacka** working for you scaring away the DEMAND!!!!!!!!! Funny how mathematics works-- with or without you in the equation. And that is exactly where that employee would have been had he worked for me-completely out of the equation.

 

[Franki]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

I designed an online payment gateway myself that processes online payments in real time.. so I know abit of what I am talking about. (I've also been to a verisign PKI encryption training camp.)<br /><br />1. Never EVER give your credit card number, virtual or otherwise unless the page has a 128bit certificate from Verisign, esign or whatever, (you can check that by clicking on the padlock in the corner of the page when you are there.) 128 bit certs are currently unbreakable.. there is no way to get any details from sniffing a 128bit ssl connection.<br />2. don't use Microsoft passport or any other credit facility till such time as they have proven themselves secure. (microsoft has a VERY bad record for security and bugs.)<br />3. Read each sites security policy before purchase. they should not be storing your card details online or anywhere else.<br /><br />Our payment gateway stores no card info at all, it sends the payment through to the relevant bank and recieves a response,, there is no storage of details at all.<br /><br />Virtual numbers are not available over here, but they are a valid method.. one designed to limit the banks liability for online payments.. and a good one at that.<br /><br />Paypal is great, but unless you are already a member, you can't use it, and it takes a week to become a member, (register your card) if you have access to your transaction log online, longer if you have to wait for the bank to send it to you. but if you are registered, they are fantastic.<br /><br />Having said all that, I have two more comments to add.<br /><br />1. If an employee told me that my order was too small to worry about, I'd ask to speak to the manager.<br />2. Employees can be bad or good, its not the managers fault, it becomes the managers fault if he knows about it and does nothing. so you should have registered a complaint with him, and pointed out some bank web pages that detail virtual numbers. They probably get alot of fraudulant transactions coming through, and matching details is a valid method for weeding potential fraudsters out,, this man just doesn't have all the knowledge required to do it properly. Fraud is a huge issue on the net and most net business's are very cautious nowdays, you have to understand that as well.<br /><br />thats the normal way to conduct yourself in situations such as this.<br /><br />Having said that, I won't be ordering anything from that place until I hear something good about them.<br /><br />rgds<br /><br />Frank

 

[Homerr]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Very well put Frank.<br /><br />I too check to make sure the site is encrypted before I put my numbers out. I sometimes use a finger or other 'sniffer' programs to validate a questionable company before I order. Is this too much? Maybe. But I've been **rewd twice, and this boy isn't geting the 'ol 'third times a charm'<br /><br />I shop the internet A LOT. (Too much according to the wife..LOL) I have dealt with litterally hundreds of internet companies.<br /><br />When an 'attaboy' is due, I give it. When you get a disgruntled customer service rep, it's time to deal with their superiors.<br /><br />I could not believe my ears when he asked my order amount and then told me it wasn't worth it. This might work for Bill Gates, but not an every day American business! Take a look around. The USA isn't is the greatest financial shape right now. You'd think a business wouldn't turn away any customers now matter how much the order was.<br /><br />This was totally unaceptable behavior. I honestly believe he thought I was some kind of thief.<br /><br />Sorry guys.. It was not my intentions to start a fight here. Just wanted to let folks know how I was treated today. I don't want anyone else to experience the same.<br /><br />H.

 

[jasonnb]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Well, I'll toss what I know into this discussion. In the last 9 days, I have placed 3 separate orders with ebasicpower.com. <br /><br />The first two were on-line and went flawlessly (yes, I sent my numbers across their order system, this is a big part of the reason I insist on a extremely low credit limit on my card). They do require that your first order be shipped to the billing address for security. Both orders arrived in 2 days, well packed and on time.<br /><br />Yesterday, i needed to place another order but was unsure about a couple technical issues so I called them up. The guy I spoke with on the phone was great, wish I could remember his name. He went above and beyond what was required to help me match a gasket I needed. When I stumped him on another question, he immediately found another tech that had the answer. Even told me I didn't need something for my application that I was trying to order. My order was placed and the parts should be here Monday. This wasn't a huge order at $200, but all together I spent around $1,200 between my 3 orders.<br /><br />So far, I am well pleased with their service, I can't speak to their service on returns, but I only had one minor complaint which is likely my fault. They have shipped all orders to my billing address instead of the shipping address, but I have a feeling I forgot to check the appropriate box.<br /><br />I recommend these guys, espicially with their free shipping on orders over $100.<br /><br />Homerr, call their toll free number and speak to a manager. At least give them an opportunity to make right what sounds like the words of an unexperienced employee who didn't know what to do. Haven't we all been there before? If you call them, let us know how it goes, as it may effect future orders I place with them.

 

[FlyBoyMark]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Homerr is rite ON ALL ACCOUNTS...PERIOD. He Is PAYING for a service and the provider is dependant on HIM for HIS livelyhood. Homerr owes him nothing for his arrogance and the vendor should have bent over backwards to help him. This is precisely what is wrong with MOST business today. THEY treat and have the consumer convinced that YOU OWE them something. YOU are PAYING for a service that THEY are NOT delivering with predjudice. You have the RIGHT to EXPECT the BEST from ANYBODY that sells merchandise or services.<br />PERIOD. The customer is doing the business a favor by his patronage NOT the business doing you a favor by opening his doors to you. THERE ARE many other fish in the sea.......<br /><br />I've beeen in the direct market computer manufacturing business and fabricating business for many years and if you do not live by this creed YOU WILL FAIL! PERIOD.

 

[martyscher]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Security on the Internet is important, but the fear of your credit card racking up massive charges, wiping you out, is mostly unfounded.<br /><br />By law, cardholders are only liable for the first $50 of unauthorized charges and even this fee is usually waived. This is provided that you report the fraudulent charges promptly, when you are first aware of them.<br /><br />The card company will cancel your card number and issue you another one. They will begin investigating the fraud since they are now eating the cost of the fraudulent purchases.<br /><br />I hope this helps someone sleep better tonight

 

[TxRockdog]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

It sounds like a call to the manager is well warranted, but let me point out one thing for those who think the customer is the problem. I worked the other side of the register for almost three years at both Sam's Club and at Wal-Mart. Old Sam Walton had a couple of rules he made all of the employees learn and work by. 1) The customer is always right. 2) If the customer is, by some chance, wrong, please refer to rule #1. Sam is dead now, but his company still operates by that rule. You can say what you want about WalMart's running mom and pop out of business or squeezing suppliers, but the reason they beat Kmart and all the others into bankruptcy was that they gave the consumer exactly what they wanted for a great price. And...THEY WERE **** POLITE ABOUT IT AND GENUINELY APPRECIATED THE OPPORTUNITY! I saw three different occasions in 3 years where employees were fired because they were rude to customers. In each case the customer brought the incident to the manager's attention, and when asked by the manager, the employee admitted that they had been rude. It didn't matter if the customer was rude first. It didn't matter if the customer was wrong. If the employee wasn't polite and courteous to the customer, it was a short drive for the customer to go next door to Kmart next time. Sam Walton knew that and his business philosophy reflected it. His business hasn't done too badly lately either...largest company in the world last I recalled. And he started about 40 years ago with little 5 and dime in Arkansas being nice to his customers.<br /><br />Explain to me again why its the customer's fault the employee was rude? This post is a perfect example. That employee thought $60 wasn't worth arguing about. But I have never heard of Ebasicpower.com before, but now that I have, I will think twice before I use them. He thought he was pissing off one customer...but now he has probably a couple hundred people just from this forum who might think twice before using his business.

 

[martyscher]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

TxRockdog<br /><br />I agree wholly with the 1st paragraph of your above post, but disagree in the 2nd, as to having to "think twice" about doing business with EBasicpower.com. <br /><br />Other posts have stated that they received great value from this company, so EBasicpower should not be judged solely by the actions of one employee.<br /><br />Just like Walmart/Sams, if no one reports an employee's unacceptable behavior, EBasicpower's business could suffer. <br /><br />Although it has never happend , I would never stop shopping at Walmart, just because one associate was rude or unhelpful. I certainly would complain to the manager.<br /><br />Walmart/Sams are my fovorite places to shop. I just wish Walmart had more trolling tackle <br /><br />Maybe I should complain to the manager

 

[jasonnb]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

TX, I too agree with your first paragraph. I have worked in retail and in top level customer support for a large computer company. I know how difficult some situations can be. But on the same token, it is up to the consumer to demand adequate service. If you get horrible service, ask to speak with a manager on the spot, that is what they are there for. If you don't get resolution, it may be time to find another company to do business with. If you owned a bus. with several employees, wouldn't you want to know if one of them had the attitude that spawned this thread?<br /><br />I agree that there is no excuse if the employee was truly rude, but on the same token, don't fault a company with many employees for the actions of one front line phone rep. If I stopped patronizing restaurants because I got a bad service on one occasion, my wife and I would never be able to eat out again. My wife (I love her to death) has a true hatred for shoddy service and will not hesitate to find a manager. On a few occasions, we have gone bact only to get the same waiter/waitress and get excellent service.<br /><br />I guess my point is, make sure you understand both sides of the story before judging. Wait until Homerr returns and lets us know what the manager/owner told him. He may walk away feeling good about the company in the long run. If the mgr/owner doesn't take appropriate action, then there may be justification. <br /><br />Plus, (this is not aimed at you Homerr, this is in general) when deciding if you want to do business with a company based on others experiences, remember that there are rare cases wher it is virtually impossible to make the customer happy. I don't believe that was the case here, but it does happen.

 

[oldboat1]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

I'm with Homerr on this. All the stuff in defense of the company seems to me to be kind of irrelevant. I know if I call, the transaction could be just fine -- same when (if) Homer chooses to deal with them again. But I grew up in retail, and there is no excuse whatever for dealing with customers in that manner -- nothing even close. I would put the burden on the company to show the yahoo Homerr dealt with is an exception -- and it seems to me to be right on to give us a heads up. That seems to me to be part of the power of the internet and forums like this one.<br /><br />Now let me tell you about Fairwinds in Annapolis....

 

[steve forsythe]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

A quick comment for 'FlyBoyMark'. It is people like you that make owning your own business sooooo rewarding. I get to tell people like you that you ARE wrong, that YOU are being rude, and that I dont like it and am done doing business with you. If you are providing service or products that everyone else is providing, i agree that you better kiss a**. BUT, if you provide a product or service that is unique or top quality, above everyone else's, you have the ability to "not put up with all the crap that people feel they are entitled to give". In this country people like you feel that if a product is not perfect and exactly what they thought it would be, return it, even if it is used. Large billion dollar companies can afford this policy, because if they dont it can cost them big time. Smaller companies can be burned by the same policy. If someone has a bad experience at a store that has 5000 locations and 5,000,000 customers, it is worth it to give them whatever they want to make them happy, because the repercussions are too great. On the other hand if you own a small business with no more than 1 or 2 locations, and you deliver a quality product, you can be burned and put out of business by this policy. If i am right, and the customer is just taking advantage of me, i will NOT give in and dont care if i lose him and 100 others like him. It is kind of like the 'soup nazi' on Sienfeld, if you have a good product that everyone wants YOU MAKE THE RULES! People like you are so demanding that even small things that should be overlooked are made into a huge ordeal that is blown way out of porportion and you want it free!! When in this country did the business owner become a servant that has no rights, and the customer is always right??? If the dam* customer was always right and so smart, why arnt they the ones owning their own business???

 

[basicpower]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Thank you to all of our loyal customers who advised us of this thread that Homerr posted here.<br /><br />Homerr purchased with us on our website: ebasicpower.com. He provided a credit card which did not match his bill to information that he entered. We have a strict policy that all credit card transactions must be an exact match to the address and card holder given. They state:<br />• Please note that credit card orders will not be processed unless the billing address indicated is the same as the billing address that the credit card is billed to. All orders MUST be to the credit card holder. The credit card must be billed within the U.S. We will ship anywhere in the continental U.S. to anyone, but the billing address information MUST match the card holder's information. NO EXCEPTIONS! We reserve the right to ship orders only to the credit card billing address. We prosecute all credit card fraud. <br /><br />• SPECIAL NOTE: First time customers' orders may only be shipped to the credit card billing address (unless it is a PO Box).<br /><br />These terms are not unreasonable, nor difficult to comply with.<br /><br />Homerr provided two different addresses in two different towns. His (credit card) bill to address was a PO Box. His ship to address was in a different town. So far, so good according to our terms. When we processed this card, the bill to address did not match the billing address of that credit card according to the Address Verification System (AVS). When this happens, the card is still charged. That is the way credit card transactions work.<br /><br />Upon further attempts to verify Homerr's identity, we found that the phone number that he provided went to yet a third address and a different name.<br /><br />We tried to call Homerr and received no answer at this phone number. We then emailed him asking him to call us. When he called, our duty sales rep. answered the phone. Our sales reps. are briefed about transactions that are placed on hold prior to starting their shift. Homerr did in fact call us back. When Homerr identified himself, the name did not register with the sales rep. The sales rep. then asked Homerr the amount of the purchase (to try to recall the transaction). He stated the amount of the transaction, which helped the rep. determine the scenario. Upon recalling the transaction, the rep. advised Homerr that his order could not be shipped because it did not meet the criteria of our Ordering Terms (www.ebasicpower.com/orderterms.htm#Terms). Homerr assumed that the sales rep. was penalizing him due to the amount of the sale. Homerr then explained that he uses "virtual credit card numbers" to conduct ecommerce. As Homerr stated, the sales rep. was unaware of any such thing and explained that fact to Homerr. <br /><br />Homerr then became verbally abusive to our sales rep. The sales rep. politely instructed Homerr that he should pick up his parts locally because Basic Power Industries could not ship his parts to him under these circumstances.<br /><br />Homerr's card was credited in full this morning when the business office opened. Homerr was informed of this via email. As of this posting, we have not heard from Homerr.<br /><br />Homerr did not take the time to review the ordering terms prior to making a purchase. Homerr became most defensive and verbally abusive when discussing this issue with our sales rep. Homerr took his liberties to bash eBasicPower.com on this bulletin board without presenting all of the facts. He is now painting a very ugly picture of a situation that simply is not how he says that it is.<br /><br />For those of you who subscribe to the "customer is always right" campaign, this is a prime example of where that policy severely fails. EBasicPower sells to the general public at wholesale prices. We promise to sell you the parts at low prices on our terms. When you purchase from us, you are submitting to our terms. If Homerr had simply read the terms he had agreed to, this entire posting would not have been started on a fine bulletin board service. If Homerr had provided a credit card billing address that matched (like the terms state), his parts would be somewhere between here and there. That is the way it is supposed to work. Our security measures are for both the customer's benefit as well as ours.<br /><br />Have a good day! <br />Basic Power Industries

 

[Admin5]

Re: Stay AWAY from this business!

Now that both sides have spoken I think enough has been said on this specific matter and would suggest that all involved parties contact each other offline. Thanks everyone for posting your opinions.