The beginning of my ending

[SteveinVA]

Ok, where to start... Wife calls me on Skype while I am overseas for work and says "we need to talk" .. All married men usually know what that means and it usually ain't good. Anyway 1000 thoughts racing through my head and I settle on she is pregnant. So finally I ask her after telling me "we need to talk" way to many times and she laughs and says no but that she wants to get a BOAT!!
Well my smile went from ear to ear after hearing that. Few weeks later and we have a 94 Bayliner Rendezvous with a force 120 on the back sitting in my driveway. The list of minor but numerous problems is endless. The motor runs but, the boat was filthy, all the seat boards were rotted, the seat backs were dry rotted, numerous dings, scrapes, gouges in the gel coat. Once I cleaned it up I noticed the hull had been repaired in a few places...and then The trailer....Wholly crap, towed it home, everything is rusted. brake cylinder was bone dry with a bunch of white residue in it, brakes lines rusted inplace, bearings are shot, haven't even gotten around to checking the lights yet.
Right now I absolutelty believe we rushed into this but I want to make this boat/trailer right. More to follow.. got to run

 

[jigngrub]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Boat sounds well neglected, hope for the best but prepare for the worst. Have you noticed any soft spots in the decking yet? You should check this thoroughly by walking every square inch of all the decking.

 

[jb93]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Wife says she wants a boat and you got a project boat. :facepalm:
Good luck with what you find...lots of smart folks here to help you. My boat is still in deconstruction mode and all I have done the last 4 months is think about it. I am ancy again now that summer is here, but oh mylanta...what a ton of work a full boat rebuild is.

 

[Pmccraney]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Nice Bass in your Avatar... and props on having a cool wife that wants a boat. I'd post up some pictures of your rig...

This is not an insult, because Bayliners certainly have their place in the market. However, mid-90s Bayliners are notorious for having rot (which means they typically need more than a power spray and clean-up to be safe)...I think 1 out of every 2 restore threads on this site starts with: "I bought an old bayliner, now what..."

The big things to look for are:

1) Transom: drill some test holes in (from the inside of the boat)... See if you get dry, light shavings... If you get dark, wet shavings, your transom is rotten... Shake the motor; look for cracks in the gel coat/glass back there...

2) Decks/Bulkheads/Stringers: use the same core drilling techniques; if your seats are shot and dry-rotted, I imagine this boat sat out in the elements (not good).

3) Hull repair and "out in the elements" likely means that your foam got waterlogged at some point... If you can remove a section of your deck (with hands, if rotten, or skill saw if not), then drill down into it with a 1.25 inch (or so) pvc pipe. You will take out a "plug" of foam and see if it is holding a lot of water at the bottom. If you foam is soaked then that is not good for about 100 reasons: boat will ride heavy, you will drink gas and strain your motor and you could sink...

4) Power: Good that motor runs, but I would get it thoroughlyl checked out before putting a lot of money into the rig (check the compression, make sure the lower unit is not holding water, make sure water pump/impeller are in good shape, etc...)...

5) Trailer: You have that covered it sounds like... Probably the best place to spend money because you can always sell a good boat trailer if you decide the boat is not right, etc...

If you find that the boat structure itself is in bad shape from the above tests, then you and your bride will have some soul-searching to do in terms of whether you want to put a bunch of time and money into this boat... It can be a fun (but challenging and EXPENSIVE) process, so most people do it because they are emotionally attached to the boat, or just want the satisfaction of wrestling an old rig out of the arms of the grim reaper...

This is a great site, with lots of good information and friendly people to help you out along the way.

Good luck,
pmc

 

[idonthaveaname]

Re: The beginning of my ending

"she wants to get a BOAT" That's better than hearing, "Honey? Want to go to bed early tonight?"

Well....almost better. Congrats.

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Thanks for the replies everyone. Got some time now to fill in some more details. So far I have scraped the entire hull to remove small barnacles that covered it, especially underneath. I haven't drilled stringers yet, and the deck feels solid everywhere, and looks it, its a fiberglass deck with self bailing holes. I can access the bottom of it through numerous seat cushion removals, it is the center console model, which has the big seat/hatch in front of the center console. I can basically see the entire underside of the deck. Now the things that make me worry:
1. while drilling a whole to replace the porter potty mount (in the bow) the shavings were moist and a dark brown color, with the texture of pressed (composite?) wood. you know , the stuff cheap furniture is made of. Powder like almost
2. Pulled the cracked cup holders off the console and the ply between the glass layers has sperated from itself. However I did pull the stereo and the wood around that area is still solid.
3. While cleaning it out under the deck right behind the console (center of the boat) I saw some cracked gel coat righ in the center. peeled it back and dang near pushed my finger through some mushy wood. My heart dropped. Decide to investigate and riped it all up. Fortunately there were no stringers underneath and just the fiberglass hull. basically this piece of wood fit in between 2 bulkheads and just kind of created a cover for the water to run back to the bilge area (both bulkheads had drain holes in them). Also fortunately it was not connected to the bulkheads (wood to wood) and had a layer of glass and I think gel coat between them. That definetly got my spirits up.
4. Back to the dissapointment. Not sure if its stock, but drain plugs are in eack of the hulls (catamaran style) for lack of a better word at the stern. So I took one out and stuck my finger in and some wet foam pieces came out. BOOO
Now, About drilling to find out if the foam is soaked or not. As I said I can look under the entire deck. There appears to be a sub-floor of sorts below the seat cushions on Port and Starboard. this sub floor has drain holes (factory? I hope) drilled into them. I am hoping they do not drain right into the foamed area.... So in order to drill the foam I would have to go through this floor first? If the foam is soaked I definetly want to get it out. Suggestions? Cap off, not sure that would do it because of all the sub floors. Could I treat it like a bad Catalytic converter and jab it a ton with a long rod, break it up and suck it out with a vacuum?
Transom drilling: Its an outboard of course with splashwell. Could I just pull out one of the splashwell drains to check the wood there?
Gonna go home tonight and take a bunch of pictures. and test the transom.
Thanks again for all the replies, I knew this thing was gonna need some work, but dannnnng its one thing after the other and the wife wants to be on the boat last weekend.
Oh what little time we have

 

[greenbush future]

Re: The beginning of my ending

I recommend snapping several good pics and sharing. There are some really sharp guys here that can help you because they have knowledge. This boat may or may not be fixable, but they will sure help you determine ball park cost to make her safe and function.

 

[jigngrub]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Tell the wife you have to make the boat seaworthy fish for both of your safety.

The dismantling of rotten wood and replacement is a must, and if there's rot in a couple of places there likely more elsewhere.

Drilling through the outer skin on the inside of the transom will give you an idea of it's condition. Best places to drill are below motor mount bolts (leaky), next to/below scuppers, and in the port and starboard corners.

You'll probably have to pull the cap/liner to access the foam, since she had barnacles on her that means she was slipped which increases the chances for foam saturation.

Sounds like your boat does need work, but isn't a total basket case... if this is true you can consider yourself lucky.

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

I hope I am lucky... We' will soon find out

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Got some pics yesterday here they are. please follow the link to photobucket for the album. let me know if it doesn't work
94 Bayliner Rendezvous Restoration Photos by RCdreamin | Photobucket

Didn't get a chance to drill last night, but this evening I will. Gonna use the PVC tube foam sampling method mentioned above, and check the transom.

 

[GT1000000]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Hello and welcome to the Iboats Dry Dock, Steve...

Like has been mentioned, you may have a diamond in the rough or you may be in for way more than you bargained for...

Boats that contain a wooden substructure and are more than a few years are notoriously prone to rot...really has a lot to do with how the PO stored, maintained and cared for it...from what you have described so far, you might find that most of the wood is shot...
The barnacles indicate that it was slipped, was it fresh or salt water? The reason I ask is if it was salt water, you MAY have dodged a bullet, in that the fungus that causes rot, has a hard time getting going in salt water...that is not to say that rainwater didn't collect in the bottom of the boat, which would pretty much negate that thought...

Also noticed you mentioned it has a Force motor on it...First thing to do is find out if it is still good, otherwise you may be in for more of the same...mainly becuase these motors have been out of production for so long that parts availability, beyond the most basic stuff, is getting hard to procure...

In this picture, it looks like a bad repair, seems whoever did it knew little or nothing about making repair to fiberglass...the tabbing that is sitting on top of the gel coat finish is wrong, when making fiberglass repairs, you need to grind down to good raw fiberglass...


More of the same...


This seems to be mostly Beach rash, no big deal if it doesn't leak...you can prevent a lot of this with a "KeelGuard"



Depending on the method used to make this repair, it might be OK, it might not...



And this area may be mostly cosmetic or it could imply serious internal damage...plus it looks like you need some rub rail...and galvanized drywall screws are not the best fasteners to use...






All in all, you should be prepared to either go all in and commit to a full blown restoration, hopefully not... or chock it up to experience and look for another boat...although, if it is old and poorly cared for, it will be in the same or worse condition...

Unless you know the history of an old boat, it will be hard to determine its current condition, even then, you are going on someone else word...

The only real advantage to restoring this boat, is that it Will be better than new when done right, but you are talking many hundreds of man hours and a fairly large expenditure of funds...not to mention the very steep learning curve that goes along with it...But the pride in ownership will overshadow all the grief and frustration when complete...

Sometimes, if it is affordable, it is better to make monthly payments on a new boat, if getting on the water is the main priority...

Again, please don't take any of this the wrong way, I am just trying to give you some insight into what lies ahead...

If you decide to do the whole shabang, we'll be here to help any way we can with all the info you'd need...

Best of luck and have Fun!
GT1M

 

[Teamster]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Never seen a Bayliner like that before,...

 

[greenbush future]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Seen a lot worse condition boats brought back to life, but it sure looks like she could use some love. If the outboard runs well you will have some choices to make. Learning what to look for before buying might be your best lesson on this boat. Spending more $$ that you most likely will not get back is a tough choice to make. Force outboards are not always viewed as desirable, but others will disagree with my opinion. The only one I had, was quickly replaced. Were you looking for a project?

 

[Woodonglass]

Re: The beginning of my ending

So, we have another fiberglass Deck boat restoration. Check out Deckers rebuild. It's a similar boat you
yours. http://forums.iboats.com/boat-resto...om-deck-stringer-replacement-help-471173.html

This will be a lot of work but when completed will be a very nice boat. We'll be here to help you with it all along the way.

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Thanks for the responses everyone. GT: most of the repairs (Keel and glass on gelcoat) were done by me...before I watched the video series of Frisco jarrets SeaRay restoration. I know now the error of my ways. The keel I sanded, acetoned, and used evercoats gelcoat repair kit. I really should have posted up before I got started with it all but was excited to get it going.
The Force Outboard; #1 it runs #2 had a new impeller installed at a shop after purchase. Mechanic said it idles nice and smooth but that it was "lean sneezing" (never heard of that) due to a bad fuel pump gasket that was allowing air in. Told them to order it and took it home to get started on the cleaning. Well here we sit 4 weeks later and they haven't recieved it yet?? Seems kinda fishy to me. Anyway decided to order the gasket set on my own. They can keep the one they "ordered" if it ever shows up. So I put on the muffs, charged battery connected , and after a few tries she fires up. idles nice, so I throttle it up some and it starts "sneezing". I can see sort of where its coming from as when it happens there is a mist that gets sprayed out, right near the fuel pump. Hopefully the gasket set will fix that. Anyone seen that before? #3 One guy at the shop said it moved around to much in the housing? It does move back and forth , but the top motor mounts look new, if not new. THey said there was a bushing or lower mount in front of the lower unit that may have come loose? I looked through a ton of exploded parts diagrams and saw no such part and with the lower rear cowling off it looks like it is intended to move around a little. There are sliders (for lack of a better word) on both side, peices of metal attached to the housing with elongated holes and they are bolted to the motor with some type of thin bushing. Basically looks like its supposed to move.? Is that correct?
Wow I get long winded on here. Anyway, gonna do some drilling around tonight and hopefully get some more pics up.
Thanks again

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Most of the damage to the hull has me thinking of two possible situations; She either sank and banged into a bunch of stuff or broke loose from the moorings and floated into a bunch of crap. There is almost a pattern of scratches running down the starboard side, looks a first graders first attempt at cursive, starts near the bow and ends with pics posted above, torn off rubrail and broken through hulls.
I am going to assume it was mainly used in Brackish and fresh water (Lower Potomac River) but it was kept uncovered so no doubt alot of rain water got in.

Greenbush: Wasn't looking for a full blown restoration but was prepared to do some work. Hopefully it turns out that way.
Well fellas, thanks again

 

[jigngrub]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Your boat needs more work than I suspected, but still isn't in terrible shape.

Since it isn't one that you see everyday I'd say it's worth the effort.

... and since you have the wife nipping at your heels I'll go out on a limb and suggest slapping a few band-aids on it for this season. Then when your wife falls in love with the boat after a season of fun, explain that the repairs you made to the boat when you got it were temporary and you need to take it apart over the off season and fix it right for many years of trouble free enjoyment.

Then gut the boat, remove and replace the foam, and replace any rotten wood you can't get to right now.

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Your boat needs more work than I suspected, but still isn't in terrible shape.

Since it isn't one that you see everyday I'd say it's worth the effort.

... and since you have the wife nipping at your heels I'll go out on a limb and suggest slapping a few band-aids on it for this season. Then when your wife falls in love with the boat after a season of fun, explain that the repairs you made to the boat when you got it were temporary and you need to take it apart over the off season and fix it right for many years of trouble free enjoyment.

Then gut the boat, remove and replace the foam, and replace any rotten wood you can't get to right now.

That is exactly what I was thinking. Did some more digging around, got some more pics but no time to post now, but basically everything I drilled into came out with wet shavings bulkheads, lower deck, transom. Alot of that underneath sprayed in gelcoat has cracks in it. . Transom feels pretty solid with no flex that I could see. Got her all band-aided up right now, put some polish on her and got it looking atmost 10 years old.

So far I have done the following. New stereo, speakers, depth finder, nav lights working, horn working, courtesy lights working, new vinyl and wood for almost all the seats, put on a piece of rubrail (where it was missing), and a new insert, removed old caulk and resealed under rub rail, new fuel pump gasket (lean sneeze is gone (Whew) well for now, and patched gelcoat damage (still needs smoothing out and final spray coat). Also finally finished scraping all the da-- barnacles of the hull , what a PITA. Also started punching holes int he foan from the rear drain plug (outer ones) and drained probably a half gallon of water (not including what was soaked in to the foam.
But I think I got her as seaworthy as she is gonna be this summer. We'll see how she sits in the water. Now in the fall, the tear down will begin.

 

[IraRat]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Good luck, friend.

Where are you taking her out?

 

[SteveinVA]

Re: The beginning of my ending

Potomac, Rappahanock Rivers and Lake Anna probably.
Got some more pics to upload let see how this works
First hole drilled, starboard side under deck

Foam core sample from same side, they were damp, not soaked

This plug is from the Port side, all the layer fel apart while drilling it