Time & Dems

[Raghauler]

Re: Time & Dems

With all due respect to those with ailments or loved ones who do, well, I probably shouldn't do this, but...<br /><br />I work as a consultant to big pharma. There's a saying I have adopted. If you can't afford to take it, don't buy it. No one forces you to take any prescription.<br /><br />Research costs HUNDREDS of MILLIONS of dollars for each successful launch. Testing is so extensive because our litigious society will put pharma out of business if the drugs are not safe. The FDA dictates the cleanliness of the facilities which result in astronomical construction costs just to build the buildings and laboratories to research, test, manufacture and package prescription drugs. At the end of the day, stockholders (AKA all of us if you own any mutual funds) dictate that as capitalists, we need to make money. And big pharma needs big money because it can't compete in research AND manufacturing against generics who only manufacture... which means we will loose research, and what drugs we have today is all we'll ever have. It's much more complex than this, but that's the simplified version.<br /><br />Since Canada has socialist laws capping prescription costs, it's cheaper there. We sell to them because we still make a profit, albeit one that does not support additional research. That burden falls on our free capitalist society, fair or not. Socializing American prescription drug plans by limiting costs is a disastrous concept, one that will yield far fewer wonder drugs that we have seen in recent years.<br /><br />Big pharma is just another capitalist business venture. Like anything else, if the price of their product is too high, there will be no demand. Despite the high prices, there is plenty of demand, and therefore sells at a profit, with a rollover for future research costs typically in the vicinity of 20-25% of revenue. Stockholders are happy, employees are happy, research gets better, better drugs are delivered, and it’s good business.<br /><br />Prescription drugs are like another can of peas. As cruel as it sounds, if you can't afford it, don't buy it.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Time & Dems

Raghauler, how bout tellin those egg suckin socialists to pay the goin rate or go elsewhere. If they paid their fair share (to use an American Socialist phrase)then the Pharm Co's could lower our prices. Pass that on to the big Pharma decision makers.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

Let's see. There is every bit as much R & D pharma funding going on in Canada than is going on in the US, on a per capita basis.<br /><br />By and large, a sizeable portion of the research done in the US is being funded by the US government. US pharma companies spend roughly 4 times their R & D budget on advertising.<br /><br />I would never suggest that the pharma companies do not deserve to make a profit. However the way this drug benefit is structured is that those that do get a benefit from this will realize it at full retail on the backs of the US taxpayer, and for the specific benefit of the large drug companies.<br /><br />Oh, and my daughter does not collect nor is enrolled in SSDI because there is an income exclusion, and she prefers to work and earn more money than is allowed from SSDI. (BTW, she earns more money than allowed and she works part time while taking a full load at University) She is merely blind, and while that qualifies as totally disabled in the eyes of the government, she is hardly helpless, and does just fine.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Time & Dems

The amount of money the pharma industry spends on lobbying legislation, professional kickbacks, multi million dollar CEO's, campaign contributions and every other shady deal on Wall Street, would go along way to bring down costs to the consumer as well.<br /><br />Bottom line is the Federal government shouldn't have any reason to protect the pharm's in any way. Only the public from them. <br />The pharma industry buys protection and political influence, on our dime.....to get <extort>more from us.<br />Pure BS that we can buy almost anything, cars, tools, clothes, anything, cheaper from other countrys. Yet when it comes to lifesaving drugs. The pharmas buy legislation. And the same old crowd sold them the legislation! <br />Haveing your cake and eating it to, in this free market economy? <br /><br />So much money flying around Washington DC from grossly inflated profits and hard earned tax dollars. All to make the machine bigger and bigger.<br />It's madness we all buy into it. Election after election, the same old crooks.<br /><br />Plywoody, I'm in awe of your daughter that she has the strength to stay focused on her goals. <br />Those efforts are very hard for everyone yet requires more heart and determination for the disabled. Nice job.<br /><br />Hmm , I'll bet her journey has made her a bit more conservative then her pappy??

 

[Raghauler]

Re: Time & Dems

Like I said, this is a complex issue I am attempting to simplify.<br /><br />Plywoody: I don't like the advertising budgets any better than you do, but... they work. Like dirty politics, where a candidate slanders his/her opponent on the eve of an election... those commercials work too. We, as sheep... ah, I mean citizens, eat that advertising #%$@ up. If we want pharmaceutical co.s to stop advertising, we have to find a way to make it ineffective. Let me know when you have it figured out, I'm with you.<br /><br />Skinnywater: Like I said, pharmaceutical companies are *companies*. All that lobbying that you criticize is on my list too... I'd love to see it go. But it applies no less to the oil and gas industry, the military hardware industry, the insurance industry, trial lawyers industry, (fill in the industry here) industry... as long as they employ a few hundred thousand or more, and they have the pooled resources (AKA $), guess what, it's legal by the First Amendment. Bottom line. Is it morally right? Opinions mean little unless you vote (as I always will). Let me suggest this, as my opinion only: Stifling pharmaceutical research is not a good thing. Before we do that, my priority might include stifling the insurance and trial lawyer industries first... what can they offer us tomorrow? A miracle cure for Alzheimer's perhaps? I think not. As one who will die defending the Constitution, however, what right do I have to stifle them?

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Time & Dems

Business, industry, doctors, lawyers and citizens shouldn't be stifled. <br />It's the legislative, judicial and executive branches of the Federal Government that is long overdue for a good stifleing.<br /><br />The only business the government should have with business and industry is in areas of safety, legal issues, a lesser extent moral issues and potential tarriffs.<br /><br />Anything more is corruption. Definately anti free trade.<br />First thing I'm going to do is quit saying we're something we're not. <br />I'll be convinced by the evidence. <br />Things like we're a free market economy. We're not, thanks to the Feds.<br />Things like equal justice for all. Nope, it ain't so, thanks to the Feds.<br />Like we're a Constitutional Republic? Nope, wrong again.<br />Equal opportunity? Hah!<br />Yeah, I'll keep voting too. Trouble is its a rigged game. Nobody that is the best for the country ever runs. Or if they are half way fair, the media spins them out.<br /><br />This situation isn't getting any better.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

On the contrary. she is very liberal. <br />For example, when you have to rely on public transportation, you don't like the conservatives with their SUVs blocking funding for them.<br /><br />When budget cuts force an elimination of the budget for vocational rehab programs that used to help her pay her tuition. And while they are cutting taxes for everyone else, I'll bet you didn't know they increased federal income taxes on the blind! Amazing. As if the government really needed that added tax revenue from the few blind taxpayers that have found employment! I wrote my senator, who forwarded my question about this to the treasury department, and they have yet to explain the rationale behind this one, BTW.<br /><br />When it was liberals that got the Amer with disabilities act passed--that forced government to only buy equipment that is accessible.<br /><br />When they have Disabled student services at the univesity to aid in making classes accessible to her- without which it would have been hopeless <br /><br />Do you know that many computer applications cannot be used by the blind because making them accessible was a pain...Netscape, Apple computers...lots of others---simply ignore accessibility simply because the market it too small.<br /><br />Microsoft is the only one that makes all of their programs, including their Explorer program accessible to her, as well as Windows and all, so that they can access government contracts. Now she may have to spend a ton of money on screen readers and synthesizers and the like, but at least it is an option.<br /><br />She beleives, and I concur, that if left to the conservatives, and the free market totally, she would have no choice today but to be selling pencils on a sidewalk somewhere.<br /><br />Now she has worked hard on her own, no doubt, and believes in self-determination and making her own life for herself--It has been difficult with the services that are available--It would have been entirely impossible without them.<br /><br />Just as you need government funded roads to be built roads in order to drive your vehicle, she has needed government programs to achieve her goals. It always seems to be the conservatives that want to cut the programs that help her, while all the while spending the money on new highways and other things that help those that ought to need less help.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Time & Dems

Forgive me plywoody.<br />I would've thought with your daughters impressive achievements,that she would feel grateful for the help she has gotten. And not place blame on SUV owners, corporations and ordinary tax payers for not catering to her every need.<br />I suppose you beleive the disabled should have life completely troublefree, effortless and easier then those without disabilities? That a blind person talented enough to be in a taxable income bracket, not pay like anyone else? <br />Ply, terminal cancer is far worse then being blind. Yet that doesn't get you the same help your daughter has gotten, or is wanting. <br />She's done very good, has multiple options, is financially secure, has had help along the way, yet it is'nt good enough??<br /><br />A mighty strange and ungrateful post ply. <br /> <br />Try to have a happy holiday.

 

[LadyFish]

Re: Time & Dems

Plywoody, I'm sure you and your daughter have done your homework and maybe some of this does not apply in your state but the following is true in nearly every state in the U.S.<br /><br />Income tax exemptions and deductions for the legally blind.<br /><br />In almost every state, a legally blind person is entitled to federal and state income tax exemptions and deductions. When filing tax returns, a current Certificate of Legal Blindness is required for verification purposes if an exemption or deduction is claimed. <br /><br />A $2,200 exemption is allowed for each taxpayer or spouse who is legally blind at the close of the taxable year.<br /><br />To qualify for this exemption, one's visual acuity with correction must be 20/200 or less in the better eye, or one must have a peripheral with a radium of 10-degrees or less, regardless of visual acuity.<br /><br />There is also a property tax exemption law for legally blind persons in most states. <br /><br />Property tax letter: Many, but not all towns have a property tax exemption for persons who are registered as legally blind. Check with your town clerk to see if this is available in your area. If so, a property tax letter can be issued to you.<br /><br />Income tax letter: The Internal Revenue Service of the federal government has an extra standard deduction for individuals who are legally blind. A letter can be issued to you to include with your federal income taxes.<br /><br />Interest and Dividends letter: This is available to legally blind individuals and allows an additional $1200 exemption on your interest and dividends tax for the state. The letter is sent to the State Department of Revenue Administration by the State Department of Education, Division of Adult Learning and Rehabilitation, Services for Blind and Visually Impaired.<br /><br />Fishing License: Most states will give a legally blind individual a free fishing license. The Division of Adult Learning and Rehabilitation Services for Blind and Visually Impaired will send a letter, if requested, to the Fish and Game Department. The Fish and Game Department will in turn send the person an application form to complete.<br /><br />Walking disability: Persons who are registered as legally blind are entitled to a walking disability placard that enables their drivers to park in a handicapped parking spot. The Department of Education, Division of Adult Learning and Rehabilitation, Services for Blind and Visually Impaired will upon request, send a letter of verification of blindness, and an application form to the individual. The application must be completed, signed by a doctor, and returned to the Division of Motor Vehicles, Department of Walking Disability Parking Permits.<br /><br />I am glad your daughter is taking advantage of a non-profit that has a work program.<br /><br />I work closely with many organizations for the blind. If you have any questions, I will do my best to answer them or provide you with a source.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

I don't understand your post.<br /><br />Where does it say that I and she are not grateful? I just said that we have got none of it at the hands of the conservatives. And if they had their way, we would not have got anything. Do you dispute that?<br /><br />Name one conservative initiative that targets the disabled as the beneficiary.<br /><br />And where do you get the notion that I blame anything on SUV owners? Time and time again, however, I hear the refrain that if taxes don't benefit me directly, I don't want to pay them. Time and time again, we see initiatives that block things like public transportation, which she must rely on.<br /><br />As far as a tax break on blind individuals, which was in place, and now it is not...<br /><br />When she started high school, in order for her to compete on any sort of an equal basis, we had to invest almost $15,000 in adaptive special computer equipment for her. I don't have any problem in spending the money, and didn't at the time.<br /><br />Currently, every time the software changes for Internet explorer, for example, which Bill Gates charges $69 for, she gets to spend an additional $780 for a new screen reader, as her old one no longer works with the new software- and if she wants to stay current and up-to-date, she has no choice but to upgrade.<br /><br />We are not asking anyone to pay for this, but an acknowledgement that it is a hardship, and help on a tax rate is simply not out of line, in my view.<br /><br />We live in a society, and we make laws so that society works properly. Will it ever be perfect? Of course not. <br /><br />We sometimes pass laws to give some people tax shelters so that they can take the money they save and invest it and create jobs. Some use this simply to avoid paying taxes and create no new jobs. So it goes.<br /><br />We sometimes pass laws that aid the less fortunate, and there are some that take advantage of it. There are others that use it to benefit themselves, and everyone else. So it goes.<br /><br />It is the way the lawmaking process works. It is not, and will never be, perfect.<br /><br />She has never asked for anyone to make her life easier. If she had, she'd be on SSDI and you'd be paying for her, as many others in her situation are. (Yes, Virginia, Social Security is not, and never has been, a retirement account--it is a tax, pure and simple).<br /><br />However, it has been one long fight with teachers and school administrators and one group or another just to give her the opportunity to succeed in this world. I spent countless hours advocating for her, and teaching her how to advocate for herself (she is really good at it now) in order to break down the many and varied roadblocks she has faced, and will face. It has not been easy. Most don't have the drive, or the skill, to navigate this difficult process. She has.<br /><br />And while the system is far from perfect, and will never be perfect, and she will have to fight doggedly for everything she gets, on balance she understands that she is far more likely to get some help from those of the liberal persuasion than those on the right. They have been the ones that want to cut out the meager help she gets now, like vocational rehab funding.<br /><br />Hearing people tell her she just needs to pull herself up by the bootstraps is not particularly helpful. It is like placing a 20 lb weight on her leg, throwing her in the water, and telling her if she just paddles harder, she can swim.<br /><br />Not everyone in this society is created equal. Some need some help. Some may even take unfair advantage of that help. So it goes. It is a small price to pay, and in the end, properly done, it is cost effective. Not everyone is as talented or as driven as her, but she is paying taxes, and not receiving them.<br /><br />And she has the liberals to thank for allowing her even the chance to succeed.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

Ladyfish,<br /><br />I have not done her taxes the last couple of years, but to my knowledge, the extra standard deduction that was available to blind people is no longer offered. Instead it is a few hundred dollars additional to the one standard deduction. The last year I helped her do her taxes, it cost her an additional $147 in tax. Means a lot to a college student. <br /><br />And we do indeed know that there are some services offered for the blind, but some have been cut, at least in Oregon. Vocational rehab used to help her pay tuition at Oregon State University, but no longer has the funding to do it.<br /><br />And I am sure there are not-for-profit programs out there that provide work, but she has never done any of those. She prefers, and has and is, working alongside of others in the for-profit world.<br /><br />Neither she nor I are specifically complaining, as she is doing great. She is happy, and has lots of friends, and is very confident and content with her life. She does not want any "special" favors, nor does she want to be held to any different standard than anyone else.<br /><br />Heck, she just recently finished running the Portland Marathon, and I'd almost be willing to bet that no one, except the guide she recruited to guide her around the course, even knew she was blind. (Her goal is to qualify for the Boston Marathon, and it takes a 3hr 40min time apparently--she got caught up in traffic, and a few traffic cones reached up and grabbed her, and she finished in 4 hr 14 min--she is going to run again in the Seattle Marathon--she has done 3hr 40 min in training easily, but it is tougher with all the other bodies to deal with)<br /><br />But it has been a difficult road to get her to the point she is, but she is a pretty special kid. She will be graduating with an engineering degree this spring, and we find out shortly if she will be interning with Microsoft.<br />She has worked extraordinarily hard to get to this point, and without a little help it would have been impossible.

 

[LadyFish]

Re: Time & Dems

Plywoody. I also might want to mention I am a right wing conservative that runs a non-profit for the prevention of and treatment of blindness. I receive absolutely NO government funding. I raise every darn nichol of it myself through 2 annual fundraisers and private donations.<br /><br />Just wanted to let you know that there are many conservatives that care and give people chances everyday. I think we just do it a little smarter.

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

Good for you.<br /><br />I don't like to rely on charity, however. And frankly, we have found little in the not-for-profit world that has been any real help to her.<br /><br />We could do so much better.<br /><br />All we ever asked for is for her schooling to be accessible to her, as required by federal law (passed by the liberals). We have fought math teachers who have refused to make their classes accessible to her, and have refused to let her use her mechanical brailler in class because it was "too noisy". We won! Now it was not an easy victory, of course, as we finally compromised and the teacher was directed to provide me with his lesson plans, and a text, and I taught her the math.<br /><br />Now she works with a professor at Oregon State who developed a new language for braille mathematics which has made all the difference. an engineering degree takes a ton of math. They have also developed a new graphic display braille printer at OSU that will print her math equations, (on a federal grant, with funding provided by, you guessed it, the liberals) as well as any other line drawings in any MS office format. (BTW, the nice thing about this printer is that if it is on the university's network, any professor can access it, the printer automatically translates any text to grade 2 braille, recreates the graphics, and prints it, and the professor needs to know absolutely nothing about braille whatsoever) It is currently being marketed around the world. <br /><br />But when she is the only braille using student at Oregon State, and has been the only one in her stay there, there is a problem.<br /><br />Don't get me wrong. Most of the programs available for the blind currently have been no help to her at all. the liberals certainly do not have all the answers to this. And the NFB and the ACB, in my opinion, are counter-productive to their mission. <br /><br />And in a perfect world, we would have a system that actually offers programs that would help her. We are far from a perfect world.<br /><br />We have held no illusions that somehow some government program would hold the answers for her. It would be nice if there was, perhaps, but most programs we have found are virtually worthless.<br /><br />We are indeed thankful for the laws that require equipment vendors to the government to make their equipment accessible to her, and we are thankful that there have been laws that require the schools to offer an equal educational opportunity for her. Beyond that, we have known that we are on our own, and will have to fight for everything we get.<br /><br />Which is what we have done. Successfully, I might add.<br /><br />And we have not, in the words of Blanche Dubois, had to rely on the kindness of strangers.<br /><br />But I do think you all have a distorted, talk radio view of what it means to be a liberal. To think we do not rely to a large degree on self- reliance is folly. We just want the opportunity to succeed, and it is nice to have the force of law behind it.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Time & Dems

What your describing with your daughter and the level her journey has taken isn't taken lightly.<br /><br />The fact that as a 100% disabled person performing better then people without any disabilitys is admirable. Your daughter is driven and is a fighter. The qualities she has might make her a genuine hero with me.<br />The journey you've taken with her undoubtably makes you very proud and capable.<br />My point takes nothing away from this. It isn't an attack, mean or saracastic.<br />It's only a reminder.<br /><br />Throughout the years there have been people who touched your daughters life. People who understood, helped and positively reinforced her life. There were people in hospitals and operating rooms. People in schools and the many offices that the disabled come in contact with.<br />Because of the hardships of a disability and the successes obtained, there were many quality people who have brought quality in your daughters life.<br /><br />It would be very ungrateful to those people who owned SUV's, were Republicans or Conservative making efforts to your daughter.<br />Ungrateful to think your "distorted, talk show view" of Conservatives , says we've taken from your daughter.<br /><br />Still, I'll have to ask about that "extra" standard deduction of $147 that is gone. Is that the "extra standard deduction" that someone with Spinal biffada, Cerebal Palsy, Polio, acute cancer, severe genetic disease or Dementia doesn't, and has never gotten?<br /><br />This isn't a lib/conservative thing at all.<br />We're right back to attitude. <br /><br />Come on ply!, your daughter's doing great! The stinkin' deduction, SUV's, conservatives, rainy days and Sundays hasn't seemed to let your daughter down!

 

[plywoody]

Re: Time & Dems

I still don't understand your post, or point of view.<br />The question was asked of me whether she is more, or less, liberal, than I am, with her experiences.<br />She is more liberal, and I gave the reasons why that is true.<br />And she is indeed doing great, and I am indeed proud of her.<br />And we are not specifically complaining, but only noting that many of the programs that specifically have been of help to her seem to be under constant attack, mostly by conservatives, for some reason.<br />And the odd group, lib or conservative, that wants to offer charity to her is noted, but in our experience rarely particularly helpful, to her at least. Perhaps it helps others, and that is good.<br />As far as the tax situation, I have no idea what others get, and don't particularly care. My question was simply who changed the policy, and what was the rationale behind changing the policy. I don't know the answer. Perhaps there is a logical and good answer for that- I have no idea. I do think tax policy generally should encourage entering the work force, rather than discourage it, for all those that are "underprivledged" or disabled, but that is a different issue. <br /><br />She'll pay the tax, and it will have no meaningful affect on her.