Tohatsu 40hp M40C

[reelfishin]

I became the new owner of an earlier Tohatsu 40hp long shaft outboard last week. It runs fine but its missing it's manual recoil starter assembly.
What years interchange? This motor is blue with a silver top. The cowl has a cutout for the pull handle, I can see at least three points where it would bolt down, but the top of the flywheel has only a nut and washer. If it had one before, someone has completely removed it. It may also have the wrong cowl?
I'm sort of guessing that this is older than 1990, I'm not sure how much older.
The tag on the starboard side reads M40C, then underneath there's 3E1A- 4444 with possibly a last digit worn away by the cable. The motor runs strong and has 142psi on both cylinders so I'd like to get it in shape for use on another boat.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

Year does not matter.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I just took a look at the recoil he gave me, its missing what ever part which connects to the flywheel when you pull the cord. I've got the recoil part but the flywheel has only a nut and washer on top, and three empty bolt holes. What goes on top?
Where can I find one used or at least cheap. I don't have a dealer anywhere nearby.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

It all depends on how much of the recoil starter unit you actually have. There is a ratchet mechanism under the spool (the spool that accepts the starter rope). The ratchet is supposed to engage the starter pulley, 345059011M, $62.05, which is bolted to the flywheel with the 3 bolts. Do you have the spool with the rope? If so, does the underside include the ratchet and spring-wire guides? Most dealers (including me) are as close as your UPS truck or USPS mailbox.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

All I have is a bare steel flywheel with a nut in the middle. No rope sheave, no ratchet, no pull start whatsoever. I'm not sure if it never had one and someone changed the cowl or if someone completely removed the pull start. Its a pretty basic looking motor with nothing on top of the flywheel, I'm thinking someone got tired of removing all the recoil parts to service the motor?
Its also mounted on a 14' boat, maybe they were trying to save some weight on the transom.
I'd like to have at least the means to wrap a rope around it just in case.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

Now I am confused:

In an earlier post, you said, "I just took a look at the recoil he gave me, its missing what ever part which connects to the flywheel when you pull the cord. I've got the recoil part but the flywheel has only a nut and washer on top, and three empty bolt holes."

Is it the case that you don't have any part of the recoil starter at all? If so, you would need both the starter pulley, 345059011M, $62.05, and the 345050001M RECOIL STARTER ***'Y $248.22. You would also need the 3 bolts to attach the pulley to the flywheel, and the 3 bolts to attach the recoil to the motor. All these bits are in stock at the Dallas warehouse. Since you have great compression, it might be worth the investment to get the motor complete again. YMMV.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

Somehow part of my post is missing above.
I've got a buddy with a blown later model 40hp, he's got everything but the power head as he abandoned that at a shop somewhere. He gave me the recoil but that's all I have, the part that comes off when you remove the top bolts.
I assume the rest was still on his flywheel when he sent it out to be worked on. (The cost of repair exceeded it's value I guess).

I cleaned up the tag a bit and the numbers appear to be 361A 65599 The tag is worn a good bit from something rubbing it.

I get all sorts of opinions on this motor, the few repair shops around here all say it's too old, and no parts are available for it. But it looks like they made the same motor for many years with only some very minor changes?

This motor appears to be in pretty decent condition other than some faded paint on the cowl. The cowl is silver, the rest is blue. It runs strong, too strong for the boat it came on. The guy had it on a 14' boat with I'd guess about a 25hp limit. The thing hit 50 at part throttle and danced all over the water on plane. My thoughts were that either the recoil was totally destroyed and they tossed it, or they were trying to save weight on the transom?
The boat barely held the motor out of the water.
I bought the boat as parts, its a good boat but I hung a 20hp on it instead and it does fine.
I planned on hanging this on another boat. If I repainted the cowl, it would look a lot better, but I need to find new decals first.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

Not a problem. If you have the recoil that is correct for the 40C, but a bare flywheel, you only need the starter pulley, 345059011M, $62.05 (and of course the appropriate bolts). The part is available from any Tohatsu/Nissan dealer, including me.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I'm going to try and fiind a used one first, if not then new will be my only option.
Is the 'pulley' all one part? What is is made of? Plastic or metal?

I did a search for local dealers, the Tohatsu website shows one about 13 miles from me. That's the dealer that told me that Tohatsu don't sell parts. They sell several brands, but no parts to speak of. The first excuse was that they were a 'Package dealer' and only sell Tohatsu on new boats. I have the same issue when I run across a Honda motor, same dealer listed, same story.
Did Tohatsu offer controls back then? This thing has a remote ignition switch and kill lanyard, but was hooked up to a set of old Mercury controls. with universal ends. It would be nicer if it had everything all in the control box. But what's there does work ok I guess.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

No such thing as a Tohatsu package dealer so the "dealer" is not telling you the truth. Tohatsu has always sold parts through their dealer network, but unless a consumer complains to Tohatsu about the actions or inactions of a dealer, they can't do anything about the deadwood. Call Tohatsu at 214-420-6440 and tell them what the dealer said...You will wind up with a new, more responsive dealer in your area. Any other Tohatsu dealer will be happy to sell and ship you whatever you need.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I doubt that will do much good, that dealer is way off the beaten path, I don't suppose he does much business anyhow. I bought a 4 year old left over boat off him years ago, it had sat on the showroom floor for that long. What little parts he does have are way overpriced. He wanted $72 for a fuel hose assembly for another engine I have. I bought one for $32 at another dealer.
No much stuff gets sold there, I hadn't been there in years and the same two boats were still in the showroom.

In this area, if it's not Evinrude or Yamaha, forget finding parts. There's several Mercury dealers but neither have much of a parts department. The nearest one that does doesn't have anything older than a few years old. Tohatsu doesn't have any real representation here, even that one dealer that is listed as Tohatsu doesn't have a Tohatsu sign outside. If you don't ask if they're a dealer, you would never know. I always sort of got the impression that they didn't want to deal with Tohatsu or any of the lesser makes they supposedly are a dealer for.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

What Elvin said is absolutely correct. Tohatsu is very responsive to consumers. If you have a problem with a dealer, don't be apathetic -- blow them in; discuss the situation with Tohatsu. The only way Tohatsu knows the good guys from the chaff is when they get feedback from consumers.

The recoil starter pulley is aluminum, 1-piece, and has provision to wrap a rope around it if the recoil were to fail for some reason. Information on that procedure is on page 20 of the Owner's manual at http://www.tohatsu.com/tech_info/own_man_pdfs/Toh40C.pdf

If you will be keeping the motor for a while, consider getting a Factory service manual, Part # 003-21035-1 $42.47, (also available at any dealer, including me), as it has good photos of the parts in question. Likewise, a parts catalog will show you the exploded diagrams and have part numbers.

FWIW, some Factory primer hose assemblies for some brands of motors actually cost a lot more than that price they were asking. And with E-15 coming soon, hose quality is everything. Cheapie hoses get stiff/brittle very fast. Ditto for the o-rings and primer bulbs. Tohatsu sells two varieties of primer hoses; a "Good" quality unit, and an "Excellent" (original replacement) quality unit; prices differ accordingly.

Yes, Tohatsu has an RC box for that motor -- in fact there are two, depending on whether you prefer the electric start key switch in the control box or not. They are: 3B7Q843601 RC BOX, RC5D, AMB-W/O ELECT START $300.30 or 3B7Q843503 RC BOX, RC5C, AMB w/ elec start $371.28. They use standard Morse cables, and are the modern, "aquamarine" (nearly black) color. It's even available as dual controls for twin motors. So if you'd like to have a Tohatsu control for the motor, it's available. Not cheap, but similar pricing to other manufacturers, and very good quality.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I did get a manual for the motor when I bought it, but it's for a newer motor.
Can you tell what year is is by the numbers? (361A 65599)
I will give Tohatsu a call, but it's not likely I'd deal with that dealer now anyhow.
A buddy said he's going to check out a boat junk yard one day next week, he seems to think they have a few of these there. Does this pulley fit any other motor sizes?

The control box it's got will have to stay, there's no way I'd dump $371.28 into this thing, especially since the box it's got works.
The two cables are brand new too.
The hose on this motor isn't Tohatsu, it's custom made to allow me to run my OMC tanks on this boat. The hose I bought was for another boat, both the hose he had and the one I bought were the same, both from Quicksilver to fit OMC engines. Supposedly it's ethanol rated, which is why I hanged the hose in the first place, the old primer bulb and hose got rock hard over the last few years.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

You probably do not have the Factory service manual. There is only one current Factory service manual for these, and it covers all the 2-cylinder 2-stroke motors. If you have an aftermarket "doorstop" manual, do yourself a favor, and either give it to someone you don't like, use it as tinder for the woodstove, or relegate it to being a decent doorstop. Again, year is irrelevant. If you have a nostalgic curiosity about year of manufacture, even though it is unimportant for servicing, you can call Tohatsu and see if they have records for your serial number 65599.

I don't believe the pulley will interchange to other motors; ask Tohatsu while you have them on the phone.

All Morse-cable control boxes will be in this price range, regardless of manufacturer, I'm afraid; If your present unit is working, I'd stay with that control. It's good that the cables are OK -- on your budget, you might be surprised to find that good-quality cables themselves run more than $25, sometimes over $50 each, depending on length.

We make up quite a few "conversion" hoses (OMC-tank-to-Tohatsu-motor, for example). The important thing is to use the best possible quality tubing. If the budget will allow, a good choice is USCG Type A1 hose. But it's a bit fat and bulky. Still seems to hold up the best of any.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I got the manual with the boat, its marked 1992 and came from Tohatsu. Its got a white cover, is about 1/2" thick and says M40C right on the front. It appears to have been part of a binder at one time, maybe from a dealer?
What years did they make this motor? I was originally under the impression that it was from the mid to late 80's but that dealer told me he thought my model was made only from 1988 to 1992, then I see the model break for some parts listed online being 88 to 95. When did they start or stop making these things silver and blue?
Last year I had another 40hp, which was all gray in color, gray lower, with a silver hood. That turned out to be from around 1999 or so according to one outboard shop here.
I don't think I even heard of Tohatsu motors around here till at least the late 90's, the first I saw the brand at all was in a catalog. Seeing a Tohatsu over 15hp out on the water is rare around here. Most smaller motors I think were mail ordered online.
I have to dig around and find where I out that manual, I think I put it away with the boat title now. I only wish my MFG wasn't already drilled for an OMC, or this would probably find its way to that boat.

 

[pvanv]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

You probably have the old Marubeni manual. They haven't been available for years. It's good in that it is specific to that motor only, however it won't have [possible] updates that appear in the new manual. Yes, the dealerships would typically have a collection of these for various models, fastened in a 3-ring type of catalog rack. I have a set of those, mostly for nostalgic purposes, but there is an occasional diagram that is of interest.

Again, year is irrelevant. The critical thing is that it is an M40C. (as opposed to a 40D, D2, etc.) The blue paint is older than the grey, so the motor was likely built before 1990. The current paint color is called "aquamarine blue", which is actually nearly black (similar to mercury). That has been the current color for 4 or so years now. For exact production years of the 40C, give Tohatsu a call. They may even be able to tell you what year your serial number was built.

Tohatsu is Japan's oldest OB manufacturer; been making them more than 50 years. But they were originally typically for OEM distribution (under other brand names). Selling under their own brand label in North America is a more recent thing.

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I was under the impression that the silver and blue motors went on till at least 1992?
It seems like they go out of their way not to date these things?
Who else besides Mercury did Tohatsu build motors for?
How long did the M40C stay unchanged? Did it continue as a pre mix 2 stroke till the end?

 

[reelfishin]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

I just got off the phone with Tohatsu, they gave me the part numbers for the pulley and bolts that I need, and the numbers to two other dealers within a few hours of here.
One dealer is gone, phone disconnected, the other told me the same thing as the first dealer, that the parts I need are discontinued. It's either a matter of they don't want to order parts or can't order parts. I guess its a matter of ordering the parts online if I can't find them used. One dealer did give me a list of used outboard parts dealers, but two of those are out of business now.

Tohatsu said they can't tell what year my motor is, but seemed to think it's most likely from 1985 to 1995 due to the blue with silver cover paint job. I was also told that there were no pre 1985 Tohatsu motors, so I take that as mine has to be in that bracket, I'm leaning towards it being 1987 or there about. The serial number on mine was never registered and therefore not able to be traced.

 

[John_S]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

reelfishin,

I have a Nissan M40C which is the same as your Tohatsu, and it is from the same year range. Blue w/silver cowl. Mine has factory recoil and elec start. While it is too cold for me to go out and uncover and take pictures, if you do need some to help you out, I can go through what I have saved, or if you can wait about a month, could get whatever you want.

 

[TOHATSU GURU]

Re: Tohatsu 40hp M40C

It would have to be a 93 or older. The parts are still available. I would suggest ordering parts from any dealer outside of New Jersey as they are apparantly retarded. Paul wood be a good source as he is in New York.