Water Softener Salt

[mscher]

Anybody know the difference, other than how it is processed?

I have little/no lime, but a lot of iron, in our water.

I always just buy the "rust-out" salt, but it's now usually $2-2.50(per 40lb bag) more, than the "normal" salt.

What makes the iron-out salt more expensive? Will the cheaper stuff do the same thing, which is clean off the resin pellets?

 

[Hiya Bayaya]

Re: Water Softener Salt

buy the regular salt and buy a product called Iron Out, follow the instructions and it will help, however, if its an very old unit you may have to replace it, softeners are good for approx. 10 years and if not serviced properly they collect a lot of gunk which damages the interior resin. I just replaced mine last year after having the prev. one for 9 years, I never had it serviced and O rings became damaged and the unit did not do its job, leaving iron stains in toilets and the water also became hard as to soft.
Good luck

 

[Cofe]

Re: Water Softener Salt

There is a alternative to remove iron.
A hole house iron removal water filter. http://www.mediawaveonline.com/iron-water-filter.php

 

[j_martin]

Re: Water Softener Salt

For a nominal amount of iron, iron out works fine. It adds about 50 cents per bag of salt to the cost. I use one 40 lb bag of salt topped with 1/4 cup of iron out.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Water Softener Salt

There are three basic forms of water softening salt. They are crystal, pellet and solar cube. They are all identical except for the sizes. Depending on your style of water softener, the pellets and the solar cubes are larger and less like to stick together and form a salt bridge in your tank.

Salt will suck moisture right out of the air. The smaller crystals tend to want to stick together and not fall down into the void created by the salt being used from the bottom of the tank.

That being said, any form of salt with 'iron cleaner' in it does absolutely nothing in the ongoing treatment of the water. Additives in such salt simply help keep iron oxide from developing and building up in the resin bed. Waters that contain 100% disolved (clearwater) iron usually do not suffer this problem.

High levels of particulate (ferrous oxide) iron coming from the well should have some form of physical filtration applied. Water softeners are ion exchangers not physical filters. Water softeners will however remove low levels of iron oxide, if present. This is where a resin bed cleaner should be used. Iron cleaners in salt are one way, the other is a periodic application of a stronger cleaner (as noted above) such as Iron Out.

Also depending on the configuration of your softener (tank in tank or seperate salt tank) it is not often a good idea to layer the Iron Out in with the salt. It is very corrosive and will fume even when dry. If your control valve is directly above the salt tank it will eventually corrode any metal parts or electronics.

It is best to dump the poweder down the brine well and use it all at one time.

As for softener alternatives, if you are talking about anything related to magnetics, they are pure unadulterated snake oil.

 

[jtmarten]

Re: Water Softener Salt

As for softener alternatives, if you are talking about anything related to magnetics, they are pure unadulterated snake oil.

I used to replace my washing machine's water solenoid valves about twice a year because mineral deposits would cause them to not close all the way and I'd have a flood. I only use cold water to wash, so I'd even swap wires/hoses to maximize my useable time. About 9yrs ago I put a magnetic conditioner on the incoming washer cold water hose, and have never replaced another valve. I'm convinced the snake oil works.

 

[mscher]

Re: Water Softener Salt

I used to replace my washing machine's water solenoid valves about twice a year because mineral deposits would cause them to not close all the way and I'd have a flood. I only use cold water to wash, so I'd even swap wires/hoses to maximize my useable time. About 9yrs ago I put a magnetic conditioner on the incoming washer cold water hose, and have never replaced another valve. I'm convinced the snake oil works.

Yes and no.

I don't doubt that the way these devices are designed, they may indeed keep lime and iron residue, from collecting in plumbing fittings, valves, etc.

They do however, become snake oil, when they claim to be water conditoners(which a lot of these companies do,) which they are definetely not. The lime and iron may not stick in the pipes, with these devices, but every bit of these minerals, still ends up in your dishwasher, shower, laundry and hair.

Lime and iron are usually a much bigger problem in the entire home water use, moreso than just having valves, etc. clogging from the minerals.

Most people will just install a brine-based water softener, or other filtration unit, which will in addition to supplying mineral free water for use in the home, will also keep pipes, water heater elements and valves mineral free.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Water Softener Salt

I used to replace my washing machine's water solenoid valves about twice a year because mineral deposits would cause them to not close all the way and I'd have a flood. I only use cold water to wash, so I'd even swap wires/hoses to maximize my useable time. About 9yrs ago I put a magnetic conditioner on the incoming washer cold water hose, and have never replaced another valve. I'm convinced the snake oil works.

The water that comes out of your faucet is still laden with those minerals. They will continue to act like they usually do when it comes to the use of that water in your home. It will still combine with soap products and stick in your hair, stick in your laundry, dry your skin, stain your fixtures, dull your razor blades and everything else it would do, magnetics not withstanding.

 

[jtmarten]

Re: Water Softener Salt

Absolutely, but I'd much rather drink water with minerals than without, it actually benefits your body, and DI water tastes like a** LOL. I also dislike the slimy feeling after showering with 'soft' water, feels like you never get the soap off. I don't think I could live with city water again, can't stand the chlorine and fluoride additives. My well water has calcium and quite a bit of copper, but no appreciable iron.
I'm prepping to install a new ICP in the lab, maybe I'll run a water sample and see quantitatively what metals/concentrations I have.

 

[PiratePast40]

Re: Water Softener Salt

There is a limit to the amount of iron that a standard resin bed softener will remove. Afraid I don't remember the exact numbers but your county extension office should be able to analyze a water sample and let you know the iron concentration. There is an additional resin bed that is effective on iron. It's sometimes called a "green sand" filter and uses a potasium permangenate flush. The water softener manufacturers should be able to give you an idea of the iron concentration when that method would be necessary.

If it's really bad and you have high levels of sulfer as well, a chlorination and precipitation system is the next step.

jt - I've heard just the opposite about non-colloidal minerals in that the body can't use those and they must be filtered out. The theory is that dissolved minerals in that form may contribute to kidney stones. Don't know if it's true or not but have heard many times that, with the exceptions of electrolytes, you should be getting your minerals from food and not from water. Not a doctor, or scientist - just wanted to point out that there are differing opinions.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Water Softener Salt

The body does not utilize 'rock' calcium. It just needs to process it out before the body can use the pure H2O that it needs.

JM, if your water has a large amount of copper, it could well be coming off your plumbing. Maybe in Colorado, with all the mining activity, ground water could have elevated levels of copper. That is not normal (natural copper) in many areas.

Water low in Total Disolved Solids and/or of low Ph will strip copper off of home plumbing.

 

[mike243]

Re: Water Softener Salt

most of the WS use to say in the directions to not use ironout contiusely.they will remove clear water iron but when it reaches a certain # you will need a iron filter that uses a potasium mix to clean the resin bed.then a clairifier & possibly a chlorinator .a lab can tell you what your dealing with & you can waste a lot of time & $ guessing.also i have seen wells change & no amount of work will make the water potable & a new well has to be sunk.properly sizing a unit will make life better also.most/all are demand regen systems now that counts water used.too small & it may need to regen more than once a day so it will lose effectiveness before your done .prefiltering the water is the biggest culprit for WS problems.most of the prob i found were due to trash/sand eating the rotors & seals up.a sediment filter pays for its self in the long run as a WS is not a filter but some think that it is

 

[j_martin]

Re: Water Softener Salt

Don't most wells fail because of a failed casing allowing surface or shallow water to get into the system? In that case, there's some pretty good PVC resleaving systems.

 

[mike243]

Re: Water Softener Salt

theres several ways a well will fail.in tn they will drill down to bedrock & then sample water amount & clarity.if all is good they will run a casing into it.when the earth shifts the pocket may get opened up to other sources of water.1 case i seen they moved to the other side of the property in order to hit clean water.