What is Draining My Battery?

[jcornell26]

Alright, Here is the back story. Bought a 2001 Galaxie 1800 Deckboat with Volvo Penta 4.3 GL 190 hp I/O back in April. The seller said it was a new battery (so he says) but it did look pretty new. A month ago I had to get a new battery because it was shot an not accepting a charge. I bought an Everlast Deep Cycle Marine battery from AutoZone. Not long after I had my mechanic out working on something and asked him to make sure my alternator was working properly because of the battery issue. he tested it and said it was operating perfectly at 14V's while the engine was started. He recommended I disconnect the positive from the engine when not in use, and I have been doing so when not in use.

So, the first couple weekends out everything was fine. Boat cranked right up after sitting for a week and sitting for a few hours while we were "beached" at the sandbar. Two weekends ago it was crappy all weekend and we didn't take the boat out. I wanted to make sure the battery was still OK, so i fired her up on Sunday. Cranked right up and let it run for 5 mins, then shut her down.

Fast forward to the next weekend (last Sat). Connect the battery leads up and go to crank her...shes dead. I jump it with my truck, and we head out on the lake. Cruised around for 45mins-an hour and then stopped at the sandbar. After being there 20mins I try and turn her over just to see, and it's dead. Luckily someone had a jump box and let me use it so I got it started. I called my Mechanic that night and he thought that the alternator didn't have time to fully charge the battery while we were cruising. I went out and bought a charger and left it on overnight. When I hooked up the battery it was at 95%. So, from not being able to start it at the sandbar to a 10 min ride back to the dock it was sitting at 95% charge.

Next day, battery is fully charged, and we head out again. Engine turns over right away. Cruise for about a half hour and then stop at the sandbar. 15 mins after the engine was shut down I want to see if she fires up.........nope. Dead. I got my hands on mt neighbors jump box and got it started...but what gives?

Couple things. I am exchanging my battery tonight form AutoZone as there is a 1 yr warranty on the Everlast's. Hopefully its just a bad battery. Something is drawing power though, and fast? Do you think I needed to also disconnect my stereo and bilge when not in use. To combat this I am going to install a Battery Kill switch. Can someone refer me to a simple inexpensive one that will work for just engine/radio kill? I should keep the bilge hard wired right?

Sorry for the long post, but I thought you should have the background on the last month of activity.

 

[jmarty10]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Check the wiring of the alternator. I had a loose wire on the alt and it drained the battery. If you have an auto bilge pump make sure its not stuck on. Yes, disconnect the radio for sure.

 

[Levinz11]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

I don't what's up with your boat, but do you go out on Lake Conway?

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

@jmarty - Thanks! Will check that out.

@Levinz11 - Yup, We live on Lake Conway. I take it you've been?

 

[Levinz11]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

@jmarty - Thanks! Will check that out.

@Levinz11 - Yup, We live on Lake Conway. I take it you've been?

I live on Starke Lake in Ocoee. Everyone I know pretty much goes to Conway to hang out at the sandbars, though.

I can run my radio all day and she'll crank up when I need her, too. I can't imagine what can drain a battery in 15 mins.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

It is easy to check for a drain to the battery. You need to connect an ammeter between the pos post of the battery and the pos battery cable of the motor, and see if it draws current with everything shut off. it would need to be a large drain if it can discharge a battery in the short time after you connect the battery and you go to start the boat to come home. I would touch the pos battery cable to the post to see if you can draw a spark. A spark indicates a large short. Make sure you have no gas fumes in the bilge. If no spark, it is probably safe to test for drain with a multimeter set on the 10A ammeter setting.

Alternators are prime candidates for shorts. One of the diodes can short to ground and cause the battery drain.

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

I would touch the pos battery cable to the post to see if you can draw a spark. A spark indicates a large short.

It definitely gives off a little pop when I connect the positive every time.

Alternators are prime candidates for shorts. One of the diodes can short to ground and cause the battery drain.

How do I check this?

I guess where i am really confused is how the first few weeks with the new battery it was OK. Now when I shut the boat off, I can't restart it without a jump.

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

I live on Starke Lake in Ocoee. Everyone I know pretty much goes to Conway to hang out at the sandbars, though.

Yeah, my daughter loves going out there (as do we). You ever make it out there? I posted about a huge Wipeout event in the Boating Activities Section that is happening out there Mid-July. Expecting thousands of people.

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

I exchanged my battery last night, so we'll see how that goes.

I also wanted to mention that when I first got my batter a month ago. With the engine running the volts were at a steady 14. Last weekend while I was out the volts were between 13.2-13.5. On my last trip out I also noticed my gauges were not functioning properly. Doesn't the alternator supply power to them while the boat is running?

Can someone recommend a battery kill switch? There's a bunch of them in the store here, I just want to make sure I am purchasing the correct one.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

if you get a little arc, you definately have a short. Disconnect the battery and then disconnect the alternator wires. Now see if you still have the arc. if so, try to disconnect something else, like the bilge pump. Eventually you will find the short. Remember the short could be where the wire goes across the block and the insulation was scraped off.

 

[sqbtr]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Sounds like a large drain, old indian trick since i don't like to carry a ton of tools around with me. Disconnect the neg cable from the batt, attach your test light clamp to neg post, touch your probe end to the neg cable, if it lights up you have a draw. Now just start pulling fuses and disconnecting things till the light goes out.

 

[H20Rat]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

You can't judge much from the results of getting a spark when you connect a terminal. That is a nearly useless test for most modern boats.

If you have any electronics with capacitors, you will get a very small arc. (radios, depth finders, even engine ECU's can sometimes cause it) For a very brief instant, capacitors will show up as a dead short, electrically speaking. It doesn't take much for it to cause a small arc.

 

[H20Rat]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Sounds like a large drain, old indian trick since i don't like to carry a ton of tools around with me. Disconnect the neg cable from the batt, attach your test light clamp to neg post, touch your probe end to the neg cable, if it lights up you have a draw. Now just start pulling fuses and disconnecting things till the light goes out.

This method can and will destroy electronics... Engine ECU's in particular are very picky about this, so if you have an EFI engine, don't even think about doing this. That test light could cost hundreds or thousands of dollars. The CORRECT method is to use a multimeter in line on the current setting. It will still pass full voltage/current (up to 10 amps usually), but will actually give you a readout of the amp draw. The test light is restricting voltage, and some electronics are not happy with half the normal voltage. Some won't function, but others will try and overheat in the process.

The only time a test light should be used in this way is if there are 100% no computer chips on board that will be powered by the test light. All radios/depth finders should be unplugged, and the engine has to be old enough not to have any electronic control circuits. (which means most outboards in the last 30 years are out, although many inboard engines still are ok to test like this)

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

ok first off as others have said the arc when you hook a battery up is not a clear indication of a short, smoke on the other hand is, an arc when hooking up your battery could simply be the electronics drawing power and clearly not liking it.

Second there is only one sure fire way to troubleshoot this situation, as stated once before you need an amp meter, and your probably going to need to rent one, using the amp meter on a small Digital Volt Meter (for this situation) is likely to blow the fuse since from what your telling us this will be a large draw on your system.

Get an amp meter rated at better then 10 amps, hook one end to your battery cable and the other to the battery in other words you want all power to go THROUGH the amp meter.

Remove all fuses in your fuse block noting what they are and the fused values.

now one by one install each fuse and note the draw on the battery, once you note the draw for each circuit remove the fuse, then once complete replace all of the fuses and again note the draw.

Turn your boat switch on DO NOT START THE BOAT as this will not happen and you will blow the fuse on the amp meter unless its a huge amp meter! Once again, go through the same steps as you did when the boat switch was off.

I would agree with disconnecting the alternator power lead this should be easy to identify since it will be the largest wire on the alternator and note the draw connected and disconnected.


Also take note of any other wires connected to the battery and put the amp meter in line with them, again note the draw of each.

Somewhere in this you are going to find something drawing a lot of power, I'm not talking 1-4 amps were talking 10+ amps, Drawing a full size deep cycle battery down in 15 minutes is a huge amount of power being drawn off the battery.

Having said all of this I would not overlook a short, maybe not a big short but a short none the less, also I would like to know if the motor tries to start or if it just says no and doesn't even try, you could be looking at a partial/bad connection or a poor ground but I need more info, electrical gets a little funny at times and even the most experienced electrician never stops learning.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

If there is an arc with everything shut off, you can bet there is a short. As was said the best way to measure it is with an ammeter. My advice was designed to keep you from burning out your multimeter.

There were some OBs that had the switchboxes always connected to +12VDC, but I never heard of any I/Os that drew power with everything off.

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Thanks for the info everyone. I am a brand new boater and not very engine savvy. I have been learning though the last few months by asking questions here and researching the net. I do not own a multimeter or an amp meter. You say I'd need to rent and amp meter? How much are the damn things? Google searched this: http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/t...mpaignId=T9F&gclid=CIuIh47d37ACFYd9OgodB15cww

Lipp-In reference to your last paragraph. 15-20 mins after I shut down the engine and try to restart. She doesn't even turn or make a noise. You can hear a beep beep of something electronic turning on. But that's it. Hook it up to the jump box for 10 mins and she fires right up.

IRT Chris - Is there a big difference between a "pop" and an "arc"? I'll test it out tonight or this weekend.

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

ok thats good info, get a DVM probably cost you less then $20, or borrow one from a buddy, when you jump start your boat do you hook YOUR side up to the battery posts? or do you hook up the red to the battery and the black to the engine block?

When your boat will not even try to start I want you to measure your battery voltage at the battery post, NOT THE TERMINAL I mean I want you to push the probe firmly into the top of the post and tell me the battery voltage.

I don't trust the gauge cluster voltmeter when I am troubleshooting, there are to many variables that you don't know, owning a volt ohm meter and knowing how to use it properly will make you a hero in your boating clique, not many know how to do this for sure and right now I am still not sure you actually have a voltage problem so I am trying to do this through you and at the same time teach you a thing or two, could be your problem isn't what you think it is or it could be exactly what you think it is but we don't know right now.

Just as a note I am sure the mods will move this to the electrical forum...

 

[Vegas Naturist]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Get an amp meter rated at better then 10 amps, hook one end to your battery cable and the other to the battery in other words you want all power to go THROUGH the amp meter.

I would have to respectfully disagree with this. This will damage your meter, or hopefully just blow the fuse. When checking amps, you run parallel to the load, not in series with it.

To the OP, You can go to Sears or some other tool store and get an inexpensive "amp-clamp" type ammeter, and clamp it around the positive battery cable(s) (in case you also have small wires attached to the battery + post). Then as has been said, start eliminating circuits till you find the draw.

John

 

[jcornell26]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

ok thats good info, get a DVM probably cost you less then $20, or borrow one from a buddy, when you jump start your boat do you hook YOUR side up to the battery posts? or do you hook up the red to the battery and the black to the engine block?

I was using a jump box and I hooked up both the pos & neg to my battery.

When your boat will not even try to start I want you to measure your battery voltage at the battery post, NOT THE TERMINAL I mean I want you to push the probe firmly into the top of the post and tell me the battery voltage.

Will do. Am i testing the pos, neg, or both?

I don't trust the gauge cluster voltmeter when I am troubleshooting, there are to many variables that you don't know, owning a volt ohm meter and knowing how to use it properly will make you a hero in your boating clique, not many know how to do this for sure and right now I am still not sure you actually have a voltage problem so I am trying to do this through you and at the same time teach you a thing or two, could be your problem isn't what you think it is or it could be exactly what you think it is but we don't know right now.

Why I love this place. So many people willing to help. Appreciate it!

 

[Maclin]

Re: What is Draining My Battery?

Vegas N, this statement from you, "When checking amps, you run parallel to the load, not in series with it." is not correct.

Ammeters with leads that wire in have to be in series, not parallel, you have to break the circuit somehow. Connecting in parallel, no current flows. Connecting in parallel with a voltmeter will give voltage drop but not current. LippCj stated ammeter with appropriate current load capability of 10 amps.

The clamp on type needs no physical connection, measures flux so yes it is simpler but the "connection" cannot be compared to an ammeter with leads that wire in regarding whether or not series or parallel is correct because it works on entirely different principle.

A wired in ammeter has to be in series, not parallel.