Which Fish Finder?

[greatoutdoors]

Can't decide between Humminbird Piranhamax 170 and the 525c. The 170 has dual cone selector--20 and 60 degrees view and the 525 has speed sensor and higher resolution. I fish mostly in lakes that are 10-60ft deep. Which one would you recommend?

 

[Boss Hawg]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

The Lowrance

 

[greatoutdoors]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

They're both Humminbirds.Anyone else?

 

[Boatist]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

I also perfer Lowrance fishfinders.

In 60 feet of water resoultion is not much of a factor and power can be very low and still get good returns. If your fishing 400 to 600 feet then resoultion and power are the most important thing. So I would not be conserned about resoultion.

Frequency and Cone angle
If your fishing a area with a large flat bottom and no structure then a wide cone angle is a good Idea but if you fishing a area with lots of rocks and structure then you will see more fish with a narrow cone angle because of the DEAD Zone.

If your running down riggers then a wider cone angle will allow you to see your downrigger balls. With a 20 degree cone angle then you would not see your downrigger ball untill they get very deep. at least 40 feet.

Higher frequency will display more detail and seperation between targets.
Lower frequency will pentrate deeper but give less detail.
In your case you want a 200kh frequency or higher for that shallow water.

What ever you buy turn off the fish ID and look at raw returns.
Turn the sensititive up until the screen starts to black out then down until it only has a few false returns. If you turn it down until a clean bottom and no false returns then you will not see many fish. Learn how to tell the size of the fish and a what a bait school looks like.

Today I would only buy a Color unit but it mostly personal choice, both will show most of the returns but the color is eaiser to view and determine what your seeing.

Good Luck and tell us what you buy and WHY.

 

[greatoutdoors]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

Thank you. Thats good info.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

Can't decide between Humminbird Piranhamax 170 and the 525c.

They are 2 different beasts. The 170 has a dual beam ducer which will show targets directly below the boat and off to the side (solid or hollow fish marks) while the 525 has a single beam ducer which shows directly below the boat.

With the 170 I'd be guessing which side of the boat the hollow marks were coming from, so I'm not sold on that technology. I have an (old) Eagle Tri-Finder which shows marks centered, left and right,,, so you know where the fish are at. A down side to the 170 is the small screen, less time to notice marks.

The only things going for the 525 is the bigger screen and temp sensor.

If choosing between only the 170 and 525 the deciding point would be do you want the dual beam ducer of the 170 or the bigger screen and temp of the 525.

Personally, I have looked at a lot of Humminbirds and the ones in my price range ($200) didn't "click" with me. I've had 3-4 Eagle's and they have been great, just bought a Fishmark 480 tonight. Though,,, I'd love to have a side imaging Humminbird sonar... That's a fish finder

 

[John_S]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

What ever you buy turn off the fish ID and look at raw returns.
Turn the sensititive up until the screen starts to black out then down until it only has a few false returns. If you turn it down until a clean bottom and no false returns then you will not see many fish. Learn how to tell the size of the fish and a what a bait school looks like.

I am not sure about the HB models asked about, but many of their models now put the fish icon over the fish arch. It helps newbies identify fish arches over debrie, etc. Once they become familiar with arches, the symbols can be turned off. The old way where you had to choose one over the other left allot a detail out.

HB now has a mode which I call Lowrance Mode. They have a clever marketing term though, Switchfire. It was first released in S/W updates as TVG on/off. Switchfire has two options, clear and max. Clear is where you have what was a "normal" HB 2D screen, where max produces the large arches, screen filling info that Lowrance users are familiar with. In the latest S/W new color palletes are available that match Lowrance screens as well.

I haven't used the feature much. It is probably because I am use to the "clear" mode and just have the sensitivity cranked up. Most of my time spent learning fish finder capabilities have been spent understanding the Side Imaging screens. While structure is easy to see, finding the fish within them, not so much.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

but many of their models now put the fish icon over the fish arch.

While structure is easy to see, finding the fish within them, not so much.

I noticed that too, arches below the fish symbols, but the arches were small in comparison to the Eagle/Lowrances I've used.

I'm curious as to why it was hard to pick out the fish from the Side Imaging display, too much information on the screen and the fish hidden? I though it would be cool to check out some of the underwater structures where I'm at, sunken B29 in Lake Mead, flood that washed cars and buildings into Lake Mohave, flooded towns, etc... It would also be useful in trying to skirt the edges of sunken forests, I'd think.?.

 

[John_S]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

I noticed that too, arches below the fish symbols, but the arches were small in comparison to the Eagle/Lowrances I've used.

They are much larger if you set Switchfire to max or TVG to off, depending on the S/W loaded.

I'm curious as to why it was hard to pick out the fish from the Side Imaging display, too much information on the screen and the fish hidden?

Allot of it is the scale to the size of the screen. If you look at the side image shown above, it is covering about 200 ft by 150 ft. It takes a big fish to be obvious. If I am looking for fish, instead of structure, many times I view only one side and set it to 70ft to get more detail, and mine has a smaller screen than the one above. I like doing this as I proceed along the shoreline looking at everything between me and the bank.

I though it would be cool to check out some of the underwater structures where I'm at, sunken B29 in Lake Mead, flood that washed cars and buildings into Lake Mohave, flooded towns, etc...

Allot of people use them for just that. They don't use them for fishing at all.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

Allot of it is the scale to the size of the screen. If you look at the side image shown above, it is covering about 200 ft by 150 ft. It takes a big fish to be obvious.

That makes sense as fish would blend in with structure, I looked at a side image pic on the Humminbird site that showed a bunch of fish which were easy to see,,, and thought to myself, those have to be big fish... I fish for 20+# stripers, so imagine they would show up,,, If I were to spend the bucks on a side image sonar (drool...)

 

[greatoutdoors]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

I'm pretty much exclusively a bass fisherman, so it seems to me that the best thing that these fish finders would do for me is to tell what depth water I'm in--drop offs etc. and maybe some structure and cover. It seems that it is hard to determine what you are actually seeing on the screen is a fish or not.

 

[dingbat]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

That makes sense as fish would blend in with structure, I looked at a side image pic on the Humminbird site that showed a bunch of fish which were easy to see,,, and thought to myself, those have to be big fish... I fish for 20+# stripers, so imagine they would show up,,, If I were to spend the bucks on a side image sonar (drool...)

Side scan is pretty useless fishing for the reasons mentions above. If you want a view of your surrounds in something usable you need something like search light sonar. If side scan makes you droll you'll just flat out slobber over this stuff.

Search light sonar is basically a transducer that rotates on a shaft extending down from the boat that returns a 360 degree view of the surrounding waters out to a ? miles radius.

The technology certainly not cheap, but it? quickly catching on with the offshore guys, especially the tournament guys who want that little edge.

http://www.marcomwatson.com.au/clients/marcomwatson/downloads/CH250.pdf

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

I'm pretty much exclusively a bass fisherman, so it seems to me that the best thing that these fish finders would do for me is to tell what depth water I'm in--drop offs etc. and maybe some structure and cover. It seems that it is hard to determine what you are actually seeing on the screen is a fish or not.

I pretty much use my sonar for depth, and depending on the fishing might look at the returns. I don't 100% trust the returns as where I fish there are a lot of bubbles (decaying vegetation, seep, spring?) in the water which will show as a fish. Plus I'm looking for the biggest return (20-40# stripers) and have seen these returns and caught nothing, and then had blind strikes where nothing was marked.

Heck, I've fished a lot of trips without even turning on the sonar. I know the river and don't want an un-natural sound clicking away in the water and potentially scarring off those big-old fish, (5-15YO fish?)

Others will look, use and trust their sonar 100% as their fishing style is different than mine. Actually, I'd say most people probably fish different than me.

Side scan is pretty useless fishing for the reasons mentions above. If you want a view of your surrounds in something usable you need something like search light sonar. If side scan makes you droll you'll just flat out slobber over this stuff.

Search light sonar is basically a transducer that rotates on a shaft extending down from the boat that returns a 360 degree view of the surrounding waters out to a ? miles radius.

The technology certainly not cheap, but it? quickly catching on with the offshore guys, especially the tournament guys who want that little edge.

http://www.marcomwatson.com.au/clients/marcomwatson/downloads/CH250.pdf

That's sweet dingbat, looks like what the sportboats out of SanDiego use for tuna fishing as a lot of boats say "we have side scanning sonar". While trolling they will mark something interesting, and then circle the area while chumming into the middle of their circle,,, they marked a school of fish and trying to bring them up. I think that technology is probably more for offshore/saltwater fishing, but it would be interesting to see how it would work on Lake Mead.

$15,000 worth of interesting

 

[John_S]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

FWIW: Fishing a river this weekend established a pattern of finding smallies tight to wintering cover such as submerged trees. SI was able to easily find many a prospective spot to fish. I gps marked them with cursor and then postioned boat to drift over said area. We had to drop our jigs into the thick of it to catch them. If I had to search with 2D sonar it would have taken a long time. I need to pull images from SD chip to post.

 

[John_S]

Re: Which Fish Finder?

I quickly posted some of the snapshots from the weekend.

SI Snapshots: http://joefishin.com/hbsi.html


Fishing Results: http://joefishin.com/NovemberSurprise.html