Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

[JB]

All of my local stations currently broadcast analog signals on their channel number.

Each also broadcasts HD signals on channel number point 1, and several have HD signals (weather, for example) on channel number point 2, point 3, point 4, etc.

When analog broadcast goes away next month will we still have to add the point 1,2,3 or 4 to the channel number to get the HD signals or will a digital signal appear at the basic channel number?

 

[Pony]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

All of my local stations currently broadcast analog signals on their channel number.

Each also broadcasts HD signals on channel number point 1, and several have HD signals (weather, for example) on channel number point 2, point 3, point 4, etc.

When analog broadcast goes away next month will we still have to add the point 1,2,3 or 4 to the channel number to get the HD signals or will a digital signal appear at the basic channel number?

You will still have to add the point 1,2,3....etc to access the digital channel. Its important to remember these are only digital channels and aren't HD unless broadcast that way.

The anolog channels will just be snow when they switchover occurrs......

 

[TilliamWe]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

Pony is correct, and he reminds you of an important piece of terminology. The switch is to DIGITAL, not to HD.

 

[Tail_Gunner]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

Thread's like this really amuse me.There once was a time i could define how tech would define a outcome..but time passes and one loses his perspective.

Some fundamental's still stay true however.....if a video was shot with film it can be digitized in HD....there is no substitute for grain density...if it was shot with electronic storage and only a 240 scan resolution both HD and SD wont change a thing...That is shown in HD means capola,,
It takes a HD camera shooting a scene to really deliver HD quality however if the HD tape or cd is broadcast casted in with a analouge signal then the whole thing is out the door.

So almost 80% of shows will be sent now in a digital format meaning there will be very little noise.....snow. And the few HD camera's that were used in the original fiimimg will show HD quality because of the scan time's.....pixle count etc....they should not be of any higher res than digital SD...meaning HD or the new SD on a high quality monitor will not or should show any vislbe difference.

Any broadcast tech here that can clear up thae above mud statement....

 

[rwise]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

When analog broadcast goes away next month will we still have to add the point 1,2,3 or 4 to the channel number to get the HD signals or will a digital signal appear at the basic channel number?

One of the stations I get just added .3 my DAC picked it up with no intervention from me. Maybe all of them wont, I picked up the best buy brand DAC (Insignia).

The picture on any digital set up I am not happy with, it is not as clean and clear a picture as analog even with a bit of snow! Example I was watching a western, the trees in the back ground when the dude was moving became little square blocks! I hate it! But what ya goin ta do? Dady says you have to,,,,,

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

There is no way a digital signal will be less clear than an analog one. If you saw little boxes then something was wrong, it wasn't the "digital" part that did that.

I hate to tell you but all TV signals, even analog ones, now originate in a digital format from your TV provider like Cox. They are converted to analog to be broadcast out over the air, but the are digital originally. This wasn't true 20 years ago, but it is now.

The transition to digital is irrelevant if you have one of these new flat screens. They have digital tuners in them and don't need the converter box. You also don't need the box if you receive analog cable channels to an old TV or if you have a DSS provider like DirecTV or Dish Network. Those pictures have always been digital, hence the name "Digital Satellite System", or DSS.

 

[rwise]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

There is no way a digital signal will be less clear than an analog one. If you saw little boxes then something was wrong, it wasn't the "digital" part that did that.

I see it on every digital transmission on any brand set, the square boxes are digital, analog would have looked good. Also the wind will blow the signal away (not good) wind never affected my analog signal! So Branden, I will have to agree to disagree with you on this! I will have to put my antenna 50 or 60 feet up to get half the stations I got analog. My Dad is the only one in the hood that gets one of our stations, and I get station he does not, our antennas are about 200' apart and about the same hight. Digital sucks! I would gladly keep analog I like getting weather reports in bad weather, not *NO SIGNAL* as I got on many stations last night during the ice storm!

I hate to tell you but all TV signals, even analog ones, now originate in a digital format from your TV provider like Cox. They are converted to analog to be broadcast out over the air, but the are digital originally. This wasn't true 20 years ago, but it is now.

I still have analog transmitters in my area, (all of them will put out an analog signal until feb 17) and some will remain (schools). Cox only sends on what it gets, most comes to them via satellite digital, and they will continue to provide analog for a while (for folks like me that refuse to go right out and buy a new tv) The locals here have been broadcasting a test and some of the folks out there have failed the test because the head end (like cax) is not putting up the digital signal yet (get on the ball folks)

The transition to digital is irrelevant if you have one of these new flat screens. They have digital tuners in them and don't need the converter box. You also don't need the box if you receive analog cable channels to an old TV or if you have a DSS provider like DirecTV or Dish Network. Those pictures have always been digital, hence the name "Digital Satellite System", or DSS.[/quote]

Well it is very relevant to me, I dont like being told by big brother how I have to spend what I used to think was *my money*

Smile and have a nice day!

 

[MrBigStuff]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

With all due respect, the wind does not affect radio broadcasts, either analog or digital. Likely, existing problems have been masked by the analog signal reception and processing. Pixelation is the result of a partial loss of the digital signal. Any chance you are using the same antenna you used for the analog broadcasts? If so, the VHF section of that antenna is useless, digital is in the UHF bands. Check to make sure it has a UHF antenna and it is connected. Also, make sure that your connections are not corroded at the antenna and that any signal conditioning or splitters in line are not bandwidth limiting or overly lossy to the digital signal. You can't just slap a digital receiver on an old antenna setup and expect good results...

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

That's right, the only reason you are getting the little boxes (as stated, called "pixelation") is because of a weak signal. Wind does not affect any radio signal. I'm a federally licensed radio operator, trust me, I know. The reason you are getting pixelation is because of one or more of the following:

1. You are trying to use an analog antenna for a digital broadcast. You must buy an antenna tuned to the right frequencies.
2. Your antenna mount is weak, and so when you get a breeze, it's blowing the antenna around.
3. You have corroded or otherwise poor connections between your antenna and your TV/box.

If you don't catch as many stations in digital, it's because they moved the location of the transmitting antenna. I know for a fact that we used to barely receive a signal from a station about 70 miles away analog. Now that they are digital, we can get them not only perfectly clear in digital, but they're now HD.

You can't compare the two, that's like apples and oranges, or more like apples and picture frames. An analog signal will be strong near the transmitter and as you get further and further away, it gets weaker and weaker until you get snow. With digital, you either get a perfect signal or a black screen. Pixelation occurs RIGHT before a total screen freeze. It's very rare as it's not common to hold a signal right at that threshold.

So you are indeed right, we will have to agree to disagree, but it's simply because I am familiar with radio signals and how they behave and I know what I'm talking about. I help people with these same issues all the time. Some are even as hard headed as you!

And to those who say you can pick up an HD signal with a regular antenna, ok, but it's not going to be nearly as strong as an antenna designed to bring in those types of signals. Not saying it will not work, but it will not work as far away from the antenna. Someone stated they got 20 miles range, I know we get 70 miles from our HD antenna, at least.

 

[Pony]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

That's right, the only reason you are getting the little boxes (as stated, called "pixelation") is because of a weak signal. Wind does not affect any radio signal. I'm a federally licensed radio operator, trust me, I know. The reason you are getting pixelation is because of one or more of the following:

1. You are trying to use an analog antenna for a digital broadcast. You must buy an antenna tuned to the right frequencies.
2. Your antenna mount is weak, and so when you get a breeze, it's blowing the antenna around.
3. You have corroded or otherwise poor connections between your antenna and your TV/box.

If you don't catch as many stations in digital, it's because they moved the location of the transmitting antenna. I know for a fact that we used to barely receive a signal from a station about 70 miles away analog. Now that they are digital, we can get them not only perfectly clear in digital, but they're now HD.

You can't compare the two, that's like apples and oranges, or more like apples and picture frames. An analog signal will be strong near the transmitter and as you get further and further away, it gets weaker and weaker until you get snow. With digital, you either get a perfect signal or a black screen. Pixelation occurs RIGHT before a total screen freeze. It's very rare as it's not common to hold a signal right at that threshold.

So you are indeed right, we will have to agree to disagree, but it's simply because I am familiar with radio signals and how they behave and I know what I'm talking about. I help people with these same issues all the time. Some are even as hard headed as you!

And to those who say you can pick up an HD signal with a regular antenna, ok, but it's not going to be nearly as strong as an antenna designed to bring in those types of signals. Not saying it will not work, but it will not work as far away from the antenna. Someone stated they got 20 miles range, I know we get 70 miles from our HD antenna, at least.

DITTO!!!!!

I helped a few nuns from my parrish set up their converter boxes a few months ago, and one of them could not get a good digital signal at all with the set up they had been using for analog for years. The picture would pixilate like crazy and sometimes not show up at all. I ran home, grabbed a quality antenna, and boom she got every channel crystal clear.

The fact is, don't blame digital or the government for your issues.........something else is wrong with your set up. You need to find it and fix it instead of complaining about "big daddy" making you spend $10 for a lifetime of digital TV.

 

[rwise]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

definitely not *pixelation*, I am talking about not enuf info to begin with, not enuf space in the band (with all the other stuff) for it unless the transmit in HD. I and all I have talked to here, completely loose signal when the wind blows hard, not *pixelation* gone just for a moment. And it does not mater if the antenna is outside or inside, wind blows hard the signal is gone! by by! No picture! Nothing!
Oh and my antenna is a digital outside about 40" up at the moment, will go to 60" soon (spring its cold outside now!) Also rain seems to affect digital transmissions,,

The distortion I am refering to is not *pixelation* though is similar, the rectangles are the proper color (not just green blocks) but lack any detail! Most people dont even notice it, but it bugs the hello out of me! IF the image being shown is NOT MOVING it is clear, mostly in the background.

 

[MrBigStuff]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

I am talking about not enuf info to begin with, not enuf space in the band (with all the other stuff) for it unless the transmit in HD

Now this is bordering on being humorously ill-informed. High Definition (1080i) takes MORE bandwidth than a standard digital (480i) signal, not less. The 480i being closer to the bandwidth required for a standard NTSC analog video transmission.

Heavy rain can have an effect on satellite based broadcasts due to the limited power but I find it very hard to believe that any terrestrial broadcast is affected unless you live 100s of miles from the broadcast antenna or are situated in a deep valley or have some such physical obstruction for the signal. Some stations are not braodcasting their digital content at full power yet. For extremely remote receivers, this may be a problem. But by and large, the digital signal can be kept intact at much lower power levels than the analog counterpart. This is due to the digital nature of the signal where anything above a certain level is a "1" and below it is a "0". Less susceptable to noise or ambiguous analog levels...

Edit: I should have added, the best possible signals right now are the terrestrial broadcasts. They have no compression. The next best are satellite followed by cable, which has the highest compression applied to the broadcast. Recently, we suffered through a significant ice storm where power and cable were knocked out for quite a few days. I used an old beater set top antenna (think rabbit ears and UHF loop) and could barely recieve the analog broadcasts but the digital channels came in crystal clear.

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

What you are seeing is motion blur.Very common on these newer tv sets unless you buy the higher end models.
Its the same as the refresh rate on a PC monitor..
The newer higher priced LCD sets are 120 hz where the less expensive or ones a year or two old are 60hz..nothing to do with signal pixelizing.

Other problems with signal loss is running through splitters or poor connections.
Older homes with rg-59 cable.

My neighbor worked for days trying to figure out why his new HD set kept freezing..He had the cable run through a vcr...That was the problem.

 

[joed]

Re: Another question about local broadcast HDTV.

There is no difference between and analog antenna an HD antenna or a digital antenna. The only difference is that most of the old analog signals are VHF and most (but not all) digital broadcasts are UHF. If you have a UHF(any channel above 13) antenna then it is good for digital tv, HD tv.