TB's 1977 Starcraft Chieftain 22?

[FrankenCub]

Gotta agree with Watermann, just get it over and pull the engine and drive so you can replace the transom and floor. Do the major stuff first and you will feel much better about the whole process. Each big part knocked off the list is a big jump The little piddly stuff is just treading water. If all your mechanic said was the engine was bad because of loss of compression in one cylinder, I'd question his judgment. Did he say why it was lost ? Did he tell you the numbers for all 6 cylinders ? If you have 5 with realy good compression and one without, it is possible that it has a valve hanging up. If one isn't closing you'll never get it to build compression. Pull the valve cover and plugs, rotate the engine manually. Watch the valve springs for movement and note if that cylinder is moving less, or at all. Probably best to look for signs of a cracked block first, right under the exhaust manifold. Plenty of examples here in the SC section. Then move on to watching the valves.

 

[thebrain]

You should do a compression check yourself and see what the numbers are. If one cylinder is bad pull the head and see if it's worth rebuilding or switching motors.

Drain the LU oil, no water and no metal on the magnetic drain plug then you should be good there. Next is the seals, if bellows have oil in them then you have an upper shaft seal leaking. Inspect u joints for slop and rust.

Start tearing her apart, you have a bunch of work that lays ahead. Sorry to say Brain but spending time polishing fenders at this point is not going to be progress towards getting you on the water.

I am limited to weekends to work on the engine.

yes I plan to compression check then pull head if I see a piston w/ .60 on it. I'll part out the engine like sell the manifold riser, and other componets

I may get lucky and find a blown head gasket.

I can build a cylinder head minus any machcine work.

if I see a hole in a piston I may concider paying the machince shop $50. to inspect to see to what extent of machcing is required if a hone I mite opt. for this.

then I have to calculate a parts list cost.

the engine rebuild kit is $284.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/260902975906?item=260902975906&viewitem=&vxp=mtr
then since I have the timing cover off mite as well install water/oil pump kit has timing set.
I have a list of other parts that will add up quick Parts list for engine swap
Please recommend parts I?m thinking
1.spark plugs
2.sterndrive gasket inbetween helmit and OD or just use RTV?.
3.valve cover/timing cover/oil pan gaskets or just use RTV?
4.new points/condenser distriber cap/rotor wires or electronic ignition upgrade?
5. front rubber engine mounts, did?nt see the rear mounts?
6.bellows (rubber tube from riser to OD).
7.cooling tubes big U-shaped and smaller tube on thermostate.
8.alternater belt
9.carb. rebuild kit
10.waterpump
11.water to fuel separater
12.fuel line
13.fuel tank rebuild kit
14.dual fuel tank switch

I'm doing what I can when I have time thus cleaning everything is absolutely filthy.

Thanks for surport TB

 

[thebrain]

Gotta agree with Watermann, just get it over and pull the engine and drive so you can replace the transom and floor. Do the major stuff first and you will feel much better about the whole process. Each big part knocked off the list is a big jump The little piddly stuff is just treading water. If all your mechanic said was the engine was bad because of loss of compression in one cylinder, I'd question his judgment. Did he say why it was lost ? Did he tell you the numbers for all 6 cylinders ? If you have 5 with realy good compression and one without, it is possible that it has a valve hanging up. If one isn't closing you'll never get it to build compression. Pull the valve cover and plugs, rotate the engine manually. Watch the valve springs for movement and note if that cylinder is moving less, or at all. Probably best to look for signs of a cracked block first, right under the exhaust manifold. Plenty of examples here in the SC section. Then move on to watching the valves.

excellent advice
Must I use marine plywood to rebuild the Chiefs transome?

From what I understand marine plywood is designed to be repeatedly submerged into water transomes aren’t normalley dunked into water.

Lowes sells marine plywood however they force you to buy a whole stack at $100.per sheet.
I was thinking of using there top choice Burch plywood priced at $50. per sheet it’s untreated so I’m thinking it would be safe in the aluimin boat then water proofing w/ west marine expoxy.

I believe the orginale transome is 2"” that fits into the Starcraft bottom and side angles
Will I have to seal both sides of each sheet before glueing them together or just the outsides?
Redoing transome?
I don’t see the transome cap being removed.

Can I drill the side angles that hold the plywood then bend back the bottom angle then lean the top of new transome shove into place then lift bottom onto the bottom angle then revito the side angles?

Either way I end up either rebuild the L6 or a conversion pod I will need minium 2” of transome remember this thing is 45” high and 90” wide.

So I’m thinking one ?” sheet sandwhiched by two ?” sheets?
TB

 

[Watermann]

Quite a few of your questions will be answered when you tear down the boat. The transom wood is 1.5" thick and 2 layers of 3/4" ply is used.

There're 100's of threads about plywood here and this one of the recent ones in the SC forum. http://forums.iboats.com/forum/owne...ind-boggling-choices-when-it-comes-to-plywood

 

[Grandad]

I don’t see the transome cap being removed.
Can I drill the side angles that hold the plywood then bend back the bottom angle then lean the top of new transome shove into place then lift bottom onto the bottom angle then revito the side angles?

Typically, the sternmost decking should be removed. It sits on top of the gunnels and the outermost edges are trapped by the rub rail. Start by removing screws in both starboard and port rub rails for a couple of feet, so it will spread away from the hull and release the decking. Note that the rubber insert is likely to shrink substantially in length and it's expensive and replacement is difficult to find, so take care of it if you can. Once the decking is lifted off, you'll find that ends of the gunnels also trap the transom. Most guys cut 1 1/2" of the end to give you a space for the transom to lift out vertically. This part may not be easy, but I wouldn't go drilling out rivets or bending the Z brackets that surround the transom wood. - Grandad

 

[thebrain]

Must I use marine plywood to rebuild the Chiefs transome?

From what I understand marine plywood is designed to be repeatedly submerged into water transomes aren?t normalley dunked into water.

Lowes sells marine plywood however they force you to buy a whole stack at $100.per sheet.
I was thinking of using there top choice Burch plywood priced at $50. per sheet it?s untreated so I?m thinking it would be safe in the aluimin boat then water proofing w/ west marine expoxy.

I believe the orginale transome is 2? that fits into the Starcraft bottom and side angles
Will I have to seal both sides of each sheet before glueing them together or just the outsides?
Redoing transome?
I don?t see the transome cap being removed.

Can I drill the side angles that hole the plywood then bend back the bottom angle then lean the top of new transome shove into place then lift bottom onto the bottom angle then revito the side angles?

Either way I end up either rebuild the L6 or a conversion pod I will need minium 2? of transome remember this thing is 45? high and 90? wide.

So I?m thinking one ?? sheet sandwhiched by two ?? sheets?
TB

 

[Watermann]

Why copy and paste your post #23?

It's easy to remove the transom cover and you will want to in order to pull the motor. Not sure why you think it's too difficult?

 

[dozerII]

Why copy and paste your post #23?

It's easy to remove the transom cover and you will want to in order to pull the motor. Not sure why you think it's too difficult?

Too bad nobody has ever documented how to do this.:faint2:

 

[g0nef1sshn]

Will I have to seal both sides of each sheet before glueing them together or just the outsides?

I sealed both sides first. I do not think that's the best way though. I think you should glue them together first. The glue will get a tighter bond to wood than sealer. Wish I asked that one first before I did mine although I think (hope) it will be fine.

 

[thebrain]

Why copy and paste your post #23?

It's easy to remove the transom cover and you will want to in order to pull the motor. Not sure why you think it's too difficult?

The tramsone cover on the chief is welded I believe the horizonale /vertical angles inside holding plywood are either removed or bent back, then tilt the bottom inward then pull from inside. I maybe wronge I can post images of this welded transom cap. if I'm mistaken please post a link to how this is done.
Thanks TB

 

[thebrain]

I sealed both sides first. I do not think that's the best way though. I think you should glue them together first. The glue will get a tighter bond to wood than sealer. Wish I asked that one first before I did mine although I think (hope) it will be fine.

thanks for heads up yeah I was thinking why seal the inside the sandwhiched pieces then seal all around the outside.

Please post link of what you used to waterproof.

I thought I was going to use West marines water proof expoxy when I was in there store 2 months ago I should have had the Guy print what he suggested I just looked at there site http://www.***************/buy/west-s...04_120_001_507
http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-system---105-epoxy-resin--P004_120_001_503

there's a bunch of stuff to choose from and I'm confussed.

BTW I picked up the donor today will post up how the carbed 2 stroke sounds and runs. it will probabley sound strange a cruiser w/ a 2 stroke.

I've got L-6 out/stern drive out next the old transom (that's if I can figure out how to. the big Gal up on serious wooden blocks.
Thanks TB

 

[thebrain]

Quite a few of your questions will be answered when you tear down the boat. The transom wood is 1.5" thick and 2 layers of 3/4" ply is used.

There're 100's of threads about plywood here and this one of the recent ones in the SC forum. http://forums.iboats.com/forum/owne...ind-boggling-choices-when-it-comes-to-plywood

Thanks I'll be doing some reading.TB

 

[g0nef1sshn]

Brain, i used several coats of spar urethane by hellsman to seal my deck and transom.

 

[thebrain]

update I'm searching localley for marine plywood one Guys quoted around $100. per 3/4 sheet. I believe I need two 3/4 sandwhiched by 1/2 total 2"

?s
1.I want tp replace both fuel and oil injections lines can a fuel line be used for oil injection?
2.is there a threaded hole under the flywheel that's used for hoisting the engine ?what is the thread size? can I bend a threaded rod to use as a hook? or please recommend where I obtain this eyehole hook.
3.please post link on removing a chief transom.
TB

 

[Watermann]

update I'm searching localley for marine plywood one Guys quoted around $100. per 3/4 sheet. I believe I need two 3/4 sandwhiched by 1/2 total 2"
?s
1.I want tp replace both fuel and oil injections lines can a fuel line be used for oil injection?
2.is there a threaded hole under the flywheel that's used for hoisting the engine ?what is the thread size? can I bend a threaded rod to use as a hook? or please recommend where I obtain this eyehole hook.
3.please post link on removing a chief transom.
TB

You need 2 sheets of 3/4" ply for 1.5" then a 1/2" horse collar that is glued on around the keyhole for Mercruiser. If you're thinking that a 2" thick transom will be better for a pod then I guess that could be true. I'm sort of lost here in your brain... :noidea:

1. Oil injection? For an outboard? Fuel rated lines are used.

2. I'm still lost... are you trying to hoist the OB off the donor now? Without knowing what kind of motor it is other than 2 stroke it's tough to say. My Johnson has a lifting eye. The Merc I had to put a strap around the motor's waist between the mount and the powerhead where it pivots. For some motors they make lifting eyes that bolt onto the top of the flywheel.

3. Knock yourself out! http://forums.iboats.com/forum/owne...ft-rebuilds-and-restorations-they-re-all-here

 

[thebrain]

1.what is a 1/2" horse collar? I was planning to cover the merc. stern drives hole w/ a street sign. then smear JB cold weld expoxy around edge.

2.I want to prepare myself w/ whatever tool I need to lift the Johnson. where is the model # located? thinking about removeing the plastic flywheel cover to see if there is a threaded lift point?

3.are both the fuel line and oil line 3/8"? how doe's this look?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-3...ash=item3cf20dcaf2:g:sxkAAOSw2s1U0eke&vxp=mtr
Thanks TB

 

[thebrain]

Brain, i used several coats of spar urethane by hellsman to seal my deck and transom.

what type of plywood did you use exterior grade the marine is very expensive.is the spar urethane by hellsman better than the west marine expoxy? or are they the same?

Thanks

 

[thebrain]

Typically, the sternmost decking should be removed. It sits on top of the gunnels and the outermost edges are trapped by the rub rail. Start by removing screws in both starboard and port rub rails for a couple of feet, so it will spread away from the hull and release the decking. Note that the rubber insert is likely to shrink substantially in length and it's expensive and replacement is difficult to find, so take care of it if you can. Once the decking is lifted off, you'll find that ends of the gunnels also trap the transom. Most guys cut 1 1/2" of the end to give you a space for the transom to lift out vertically. This part may not be easy, but I wouldn't go drilling out rivets or bending the Z brackets that surround the transom wood. - Grandad

the transom cap is welded I don't see a way to remove transom vertically? this'nt a islander.

 

[thebrain]

update

I removed the mercruisers helmit, lift hooks, blower motors,fuel lines basicalley everything attached to transonsome.

the transom plywood is in very good condition I think I'll slap a sheet of Arauco plywood on the inside and call it a day.

yes Waterman a 2" transom is stronge enough for under 200HP I attach the Armstronge pod installation instructions.

I believe the Johnson is a 20" shaft I mearsured from cavitation plate to where the engine hangs on transom it was like 22".

this means the top of my pod will be 18"s from the bottom of boat (keel) the pod will almost cover the intire mercruiser hole there will be about 3"s of hole on top of pod.
TB

 

[GA_Boater]

You have old wood in the transom and you're going to "slap a sheet of Arauco plywood on and call it a day."

You will also be calling SeaTow when the bracket and motor fall off in the ocean.

Are you going to continue on your merry way and ignore all you've been told? I'm sorry, but you are headed down the road to disaster. You don't fool around with boats when they can kill you!

Please do the job right!