1988 Bayliner Trophy 1910 With 1988 Force 125 Wont get on plane

[FreestateFishing]

Okay Gentlemen , First I want to say Thank You for the replies.I've searched and searched for hours on this but I've come up empty, Maybe it's because I'm new to these forums, Who knows? Alright So here's the deal. I've got an 1988 Bayliner Trophy 1910 With a 1988 Force 125 outboard. Paid 650$ Boat , Motor , Trailer. I've checked compression , spark , timing . Everything is within specification( Atleast so it seems ) . I took her out , She won't get up on plane but She will manage a slow troll speed all day .?If I throw the throttle forward to WOT RPM's increase, slight lift of the bow but almost no acceleration . I was running a Aluminum 13x19P Prop that came with her. At first , I considered maybe the propeller hub was spun. Took it to the local prop shop. They insist that the propeller hub is intact and fine. However , They do Point out that one of the propeller blades is bent. So I decided to purchase a new propeller Aluminum 13 3/4"x15p prop. I've yet to take it out and test with the new propeller. I have replaced the stator,spark plugs , impeller and fuel pump (at engine) and Primer bulb as well as fuel lines . Any suggestions , thoughts or idea's would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Jiggz]

Can you post the compression numbers? Also check the following:
RPM at WOT
Verify position of the throttles (not the choke butterflies) at WOT
Have you tried running it without the cowl cover and if it made any difference?

 

[FreestateFishing]

All 4 Cylinders are holding compression at 120psi ( I checked each cylinder 3 times , never once under 120psi and never once over 125psi) The throttle butterflies are fully opened and in sync at wot . I'm going to get out this weekend with a photo tachometer and check rpm at wot. I've been running it with the cowl off ( Choke solenoid is bad so I've got a string to pull the choke up ) .

 

[legalfee]

Try this:
HIGH SPEED MISS: 1. Using the CDI meter with the 511-9773 peak reading adapter, (or CD-77) and 511-9770 piercing probes, DVA check stator voltage to each pack at high speed. If it exceeds 400 volts, replace the pack. 2. Disconnect the rectifier. If the engine now has spark, replace the rectifier.

 

[FreestateFishing]

Try this:
HIGH SPEED MISS: 1. Using the CDI meter with the 511-9773 peak reading adapter, (or CD-77) and 511-9770 piercing probes, DVA check stator voltage to each pack at high speed. If it exceeds 400 volts, replace the pack. 2. Disconnect the rectifier. If the engine now has spark, replace the rectifier.

Mind sending me the direct link to that? I'm not ruling that possibility out but I honestly doubt I've got a high speed miss or weak spark. I'm sort of leaning towards a bad gasket somewhere, wet buoyancy foam or over pitched prop. But Anything's possible. Hoping Jiggz Or JerryJerry05 got some idea's. I've read enough of their post's and it's gotten me this far .

 

[Jiggz]

The WOT rpm will indicate if the problem is due to spun prop (which you already eliminated), water logged, or simply not just coming up to rpm speed due to misfire or fuel starvation.

 

[FreestateFishing]

Thank You Jiggz . Alright, So I suppose best course of action. Get her out this weekend , try this new prop. If the issue occurs still. Test the output from the CD boxes, coils , and maybe bring out my idle air mixture a bit? Could I use my timing light on each cylinder to confirm a miss?Aside from any work I've done she appears all original. I've got my eye on a few parts motors just in case. Any suggestions on where to pull a foam sample from?

 

[jerryjerry05]

You kinda wasted the $ on a 15p prop.
The 19 is probably what needed.
You'll get areal good hole shot with the 15.
It won't allow you to rev up like the 19 would.
Take the prop off, mark the rubber hubs position and then go for a ride.
If it still won't move? take it off and check the marks to see if they moved?
If they moved? then the hub is spun.

You say you accelerate and the bow goes up, does it continue to rev up? Yes? the hubs probably spun.

Motor off, have someone shift into F as you spin the prop, all the time watching as the linkage moves the towershaft
and trigger arm.Then check the position of the throttle cam at the roller on the carb.
The butterfly's should be horizontal and they can even be past horizontal.

Does it backfire?

Get a spark tester and make sure there is spark on all cyl as you go past idle into the faster range, do this in the water as you move.

 

[legalfee]

Mind sending me the direct link to that? I'm not ruling that possibility out but I honestly doubt I've got a high speed miss or weak spark. I'm sort of leaning towards a bad gasket somewhere, wet buoyancy foam or over pitched prop. But Anything's possible. Hoping Jiggz Or JerryJerry05 got some idea's. I've read enough of their post's and it's gotten me this far .

I don't think this site will let me put in a link to another site but go to CDI Electronics site, do a search for the stator for your motor, and then view the PDF file. The same issue happened with my motor and when I disconnected the RR I got WOT. Not saying it's your issue but CDI has good troubleshooting docs.

 

[FreestateFishing]

Thank You LegalFee , Jiggz And JerryJerry05. Jerry , the 19p hub is fine , but one of the blades are bent. If I put her in WOT revs would increase bow would lift slightly but it wouldn't gain rpm past that point. It would kind of sputter a bit like it was straining? I'm going to get a spark tester this evening . But LegalFee may be on to something. If I turn my key to the on position,my tach reads 1000rpm before I even crank the starter. Bad Rectifier and a bad coil wire maybe? I'll put the 19p back on, I assume I should be reading about 5500rpm +/- max on my imaging tach? I really appreciate all the help and patience.

 

[Jiggz]

With a 19P, you will be very lucky to get to 4500~5000 RPM. Go ahead and do more diagnostic runs and post your WOT RPM. Make sure you start with the motor trimmed out and just do slight adjustment until it barely porpoise on the water.

 

[FreestateFishing]

Alright Jiggz, I'll have more numbers Friday after i do more diagnostics . Any chance the that the 19p having a bent blade could cause this issue?

 

[Jiggz]

You can easily rebend aluminum props although not perfect. But that doesn't still prevent the motor to getting at least 90 percent of rated rpm. However, 19P prop is a little bit too big for your type of boat, Trophy. The new prop should be the right size. Let us know how the test goes.

 

[jerryjerry05]

I rigged a lot of 19ft. Bayliners with the 125 and the 19p was the prop used.
The 15 was used on pontoons.

You said "

It would kind of sputter a bit like it was straining?"
That doesn't sound electrical at all.
More of a fuel delivery problem.
Start with the basics, check the tank vent,the inline hose connections,the tank for water, the squeezie can block the flow, check the fuel pumps diaphragm and filter.
Clean the float bowls.
Try running it on a spare 6 gal tank hooked right to the fuel pump.
The top 4 posts in this forum have tips and procedures for making the motor run right.​

 

[FreestateFishing]

Well I'm glad you said that Jerry , I went n looked at that vent and the line to it. I'm pretty sure it's not suppose to hoop..it should be in a straight line up the vent right? Look like it's got about an 8 " hoop just before the vent connection. And I pumped gas from the tank into a mason jar , let it settle bout 20mins I really don't see any water on the bottom.

 

[Jiggz]

The hoop (actually loops up) for the vent line is by design which prevents water from getting into the tank.

 

[jerryjerry05]

The "hoop" like Jiggz said is a loop.
It's supposed to be there.
If for some reason the vent went under water.
The hoop stops the water from siphoning into the tank.

 

[FreestateFishing]

Alright , I really appreciate everyone's help. I think I've got it covered from here. The weather pattern changed and I'm unable to get out and run diagnostics. I will post what I find as soon as I can .

 

[FreestateFishing]

Between work and weather , I haven't had the chance to get out and work on it. Hoping that changes this weekend. Replaced the fuel vent and all lines. Started on muffs it idles like a champ. So we will see , but..I've noticed my battery cables are getting rather warm , probably the original battery cables. With my tach not working properly, I've read that can be traced to a bad Rectifier, any possibility that could cause ignition issues as LegalFee said?

 

[Jiggz]

Depending what caused the rectifier to go bad, yes it can affect ignition. Most of the time though, the rectifier will go bad by going "open" instead of a "short". If it opens, meaning either a copper wire melted out or a solid state component burnt up open, then this should not affect ignition. However, if the rectifier goes "short", it will affect ignition.

There are two separate windings on the stator sharing the same core, one for ignition and one for charging. If the charging circuit gets short circuited it will affect power generation in the ignition winding. But if the charging circuit gets opened, it would not affect the ignition winding but will stop the unit from charging.

The easiest way to test this is disconnecting the AC lines (usually yellow wires) from the rectifier. Temporarily tape them off to prevent shorting.

As for the cables getting warm, more likely this cannot be from the rectifier as it is rated only at 7 amps. But to make sure all you need is touch the rectifier to make sure it doesn't get too hot. It will be warm but not hot. Battery cables will get warm for starting especially if it took more than 15 seconds of cranking.