LiFePO Batteries ???

[tpenfield]

My concern is that while the batteries are installed in the boat, it is supplying power (and small amounts of current) to the various systems throughout the boat. Mostly the inverter, but there is other stuff like CO detector and stereo keep-alive.

So, even though there is some loss within the battery itself (about 2% per month), more significantly will be the current draw within the boat.

Anyway, my go-forward plan will be to pull the LFP batteries during the off-season and keep them in a reasonably warm place . . . maybe put a charge to them now & then.

In other News, my new battery arrived. . .
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I've got it on the charger . . . the initial voltage was 2.54 volts . . . Which I think means the BMS was 'sleeping'. The LiTime charger kicked it over and the voltage immediately came up to the 11.3 volt range and continued to rise.

I will give the shipping dept. folks at LiTime a "D-" on their report card, as the battery was not packaged (in the outer box) very well . . . it looked like the UPS folks had to shore things up during shipment.

 

[airshot]

My plan as well is to remove the battery over the winter and store in my heated garage. Easy to monitor it over the winter. Based on all my radio control batteries ( lipos). They drop very little, some have not been charged in a year and still show storage charge...

 

[airshot]

I’m not sure if all LFP batteries are the same, but . . .

The cold protection in my batteries stops charging @ 32F, but the discharging keeps going until about 4F. So, with my boat, which has a lot of parasitic loads, the batteries run down.

I has some of those sneaky draws from my house battery. After replacing some wiring, cleaning up some questionable connections, and removing some long deleted switches, I have removed the parasitic draws. Also added a shutoff for future winter storage. I also monitor my batteries as my toys are stored in my pole barn where easy to acess. If my toys were locked up in some storage facility where I couldn't see or check on them......not sure I could sleep at night !!

 

[tpenfield]

I'd like to put my boat under cover for the winter, but it stands a little over 12 ft high on the trailer. Maybe something to think about in the future.

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I checked on the batteries after charging for about 2.5 hours (@ 20 amps) (13.48 volts). I'll have to see what the 'at rest' voltage comes out to be.

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I'll let it go for another hour or so, then let it sit overnight. Tomorrow's agenda might include installing the battery in the boat.

 

[alldodge]

I'd like to put my boat under cover for the winter, but it stands a little over 12 ft high on the trailer. Maybe something to think about in the future.

Always build your pole barns with a 14ft door

 

[bruceb58]

I know for a FACT that the BMS module does.. COULD.. draw power ALL the time. We use these batteries in Radio Controlled model airplane. SOME ...BMS systems HAVE ruined the battery by constantly drawing MONITORING POWER. You MUST have a full current rated switch to turn off ALL Parasitic currents. Some electronics STILL draw power even when turned off. Memory systems of radios can have that constant current draw when turned off.
The BMS should have a STANDBY mode of operation to prevent The BMS system from ruining the battery.
Why some of us still use Lead Acid batteries.

You are talking about an external BMS system. The internal BMS in these batteries have a standby current of 1mA.

 

[tpenfield]

Quick update . . .

Yesterday, I let the new battery come down to a resting voltage, which it did after a while. 13.24 volts. Checking it again in the AM it was 13.22 volts. So, about 70% charge per the voltage chart. I decided to give it a few more % of charge and hooked the charger up for about an hour.

When I came back to the battery, the charger had completed and the voltage was at about 12.9-12.8 volts . . . (weird). I disconnected the charger and it was still 12.8 volts all on its own . . . At that point I was not sure what was going on . . .So . . . I put the battery in the boat to let the solar charger have a go at it. I put the old/existing battery aside for the time being. After a short time, the (new) battery was at 13.34 volts. My thinking was that the charger (a LiTime brand charger at that) had done an over voltage thing at the end of the charging cycle and the battery went into protection mode. (maybe)

So as not to waste a moment, I had the old battery at 13.28 volts and the new battery at 13.34 volts (close enough!) So, I joined the two batteries into parallel matrimony and called it good.

 

[tpenfield]

It's raining so the solar charging is a bust for the rest of the day. I hooked up the AC power and ran the inverter charging. It went into bulk mode for a few minutes (20 amps), then went into absorption mode . . . was pulling 1-2 amps.

I'll see how things look in the AM.

 

[airshot]

Always build your pole barns with a 14ft door

Yep....realized it hat after building mine !! A 12' tall shot is be a minium....

 

[tpenfield]

The Admiral and I will be house-hunting in the next year or so . . . Having adequate space for cars, and all the toys will be top of my list. Not sure I'll be able to find something with a barn, never mind 13 ft high doors . . . but we shall see.

In other news, the 'defective' battery is now all the way across the country (CA) and should be delivered to the LiTime facility on Monday. I'm not sure what the turn-around time will be, but it will be nice to have a third battery in the mix.

 

[airshot]

Can't beat a nice barn for the ultimate cover for all your toys, you can change the size of your toys without having to make a bigger cover !!
Wind and snow does not effect the cover, and this type of cover actually increases your property value ! Unfortunately it increases your property taxes as well !

 

[cyclops222]

Some garages are TALL enough to have a taller door installed.

 

[bruceb58]

3 months ago I bought a small 50A LiTime battery to power my trailer's electric over hydraulic brakes when I tow it with my Rivian. My Rivian can't supply enough current so I just use the battery in the bed to power the brakes during the short drive between the storage place and the launch ramp.

I charged this battery fully 2 months ago and when I went up to my house where the battery was yesterday, I measured the battery at 11.4V. It has lost it's entire charge in 2 months! I will never buy a LiTime battery again. I bought it because it was cheap and I only needed to use it twice a year.

Should have bought the Epoch battery.

 

[tpenfield]

A nice thing about LiTime from my experience is that they have been responsive. We shall see how things go with the battery that I returned. It arrived (Chino, CA) on Monday.

As for the new one I bought . . . it seems to be fine. I ran the inverter powering the shop vacuum, drawing 50 amps from the battery as a stand-alone, and it did fine. Charged back up nicely.

 

[tpenfield]

In other news . . .

I am wanting to get the RS485/USB cable for my DuoRacer controller so I can tweak the parameters for the batteries. It seems that the batteries are saying that they are full (and shutting off charging input) a wee bit before the DuoRacer thinks they are full. I keep seeing maximum voltages higher than they should be and have decided to blame it on the DuoRacer.

Also, somehow I got an over voltage on the starboard engine and boy did it get mad . . . the (ear piercing) buzzer would not turn off until I got my Diacom computer out and erased the fault code. I took care of future buzzer incidents, if you know what I mean.

I started the engines today for the first time this season, the port engine is the designated source for the DC-DC converter to charge the batteries while underway. I ran into an issue last year where the charging would kick in while the engine was at idle speeds and not really able to handle the load. I had done some work-around with the voltage settings, but this does not seem to be working very well during my pre-season testing of the engine. So, I'm probably going to put a switch to activate charging of the LFP battery bank as need and while underway. A buddy of mine with the same boat and a similar Lithium set-up just uses a switch that he can use when the engine (alternator) is at cruising speeds. I may follow his lead.

 

[Scott Danforth]

This thread has me thinking old school diesel genny if I ever buy a boat that sits on the hook

Ted, your posts have me embracing the Luddite lifestyle

 

[tpenfield]

This thread has me thinking old school diesel genny if I ever buy a boat that sits on the hook

Ted, your posts have me embracing the Luddite lifestyle

Yea, all this stuff works in theory . . .

 

[bruceb58]

I started the engines today for the first time this season, the port engine is the designated source for the DC-DC converter to charge the batteries while underway. I ran into an issue last year where the charging would kick in while the engine was at idle speeds and not really able to handle the load.

Remind me again which DC to DC converter you have? As we discussed beginning of 2024, I bought the Victron 50A XS model. It has been outstanding and you can program in any current you want as well as the voltage it kicks in at which likely would solve your idle issues.

 

[tpenfield]

Remind me again which DC to DC converter you have?

I have the previous model (Orion TR Smart 12 | 12 30) It does the voltage sensing as well as the engine sensing and ignition feed, which I had set last year in response to the engine throwing fits at idle speeds.

The XS model was released last year (IIRC), but not readily available at the time I was buying components.

The port engine/alternator seems to have taken vitamins over the winter, as the idle speed voltage is pretty high (14.5 ish) this year vs. what I recall from last year.

 

[airshot]

3 months ago I bought a small 50A LiTime battery to power my trailer's electric over hydraulic brakes when I tow it with my Rivian. My Rivian can't supply enough current so I just use the battery in the bed to power the brakes during the short drive between the storage place and the launch ramp.

I charged this battery fully 2 months ago and when I went up to my house where the battery was yesterday, I measured the battery at 11.4V. It has lost it's entire charge in 2 months! I will never buy a LiTime battery again. I bought it because it was cheap and I only needed to use it twice a year.

Should have bought the Epoch battery.

Give them a call and at least give them the opportunity to correct the issue. No matter what you buy, there is always a chance to get a bad one. It is how the problem is resolved that defines the company or manufacturer !!