1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

[micks110]

OK- To begin I am a newbie to boats and a big time newbie to motors. I really don't have a clue about motors other than I know what the carb is and what the spark plugs are- that's about it. I got a 1962 Arkansas Traveler from my neighbor that I am currently in the process of restoring- her is the link to my iboats thread http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=365820

Once I get done with the restore of the boat I plan on taking the engine to my local boat dealer whom I've built a pretty good relationship with. I plan on having them doing all/most of the work on the engine because again, I have no clue.

I was hoping you guys could give me some general info on the engine so that I have a pretty good idea what kinds of questions to ask the boat shop so I have an idea of what they are talking about when they say you owe me this much money for this and that much money for that, etc...

I have the brochure and parts manual for this engine that I got off ebay. I know that it was there top of the line engine in 1961 and that it comes with the unicharger.

I really like the look of the engine for this boat and I like that it is period to the boat. I will at reasonable cost do everything I can to keep this motor for this boat.

My neighbor and I had the boat out a couple months ago and it really took off and seems to run pretty nice and smooth.

I know that these are pretty open ended questions but whatever you could offer me to help out would be greatly appreciated.

Here are pics for your viewing pleasure. More are available at my photobucket sitehttp://s816.photobucket.com/albums/zz86/micks110/?start=all

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more pics continued...

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

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Thanks Again for any help you can offer!
Mick
http://s816.photobucket.com/albums/zz86/micks110/?start=all
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=365820

 

[Willyclay]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

I was hoping you guys could give me some general info on the engine so that I have a pretty good idea what kinds of questions to ask the boat shop so I have an idea of what they are talking about when they say you owe me this much money for this and that much money for that, etc...

Your motor appears to be in great shape externally and, from your description, performs pretty well. You are many miles ahead of where most people start with their project boats.

I can help you with some info about your motor. If interested, please send me a Private Message with your email address and I will reply with scanned pdf copy of a non-factory service manual that covers all V4 OMC 50-85HP outboard motors built from 1958-1968. While it is not as complete as a factory manual, it served me well for many years with a 1962 Johnson 75HP that had the same ignition system as your motor. Good luck!

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

Thanks Willyclay. PM has been sent.
Mick

 

[F_R]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

Thanks Willyclay. PM has been sent.
Mick

As outboards go, your model is relatively simple. The ignition system is just like an old car. It has a simple down-draft carburetor that OMC used for years. The gearshift is mechanical, the possible problems are loose linkage and jumping out of gear. If you have good equal compression, you should be good to go.

The Unicharger--that might blow some people's minds if they are not familiar with it. When you ran the boat, did it work? Actually, they are a pretty simple system if you understand it. The biggest problem with them is the junction box in the boat. After close to 40 years, the wires are usually disintegrating. Add to that, the location of the junction box makes it vulnerable to submersion in bilge water. Not meaning to scare you, if it is in good condition, they work very well and put out up to 20 amps.

 

[R.Johnson]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

Those were quite rugged old engine's, but I doubt if you could find a shop today that would consider working on it. If you have no mechanical exsperience, think of it as an older British sports car. Work on it all week, and drive it out of town on Sunday, if you have the nerve.

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

F_R
Thanks for the help. I'm not sure if the alternator worked or not- how would I know that and is it used just for stuff like a radio and to charge the battery of the boat. The location of the unicharger was on the knee wall away from the bilge area. I opened it up and evrything inside looked realitively good- no rust or damaged wires. I did break a screw head of when I was loosening a wire to remove it so I could get the wires out of the boat. No big deal though. The guy at the shop that I go to told me that could be about$700 just to get that working if it doesn't work already. I found that kinda hard to believe- what are your thoughts?
Thanks Again,
Mick

Bill- thanks for the digital scan- I will add it to my notebook with the factory one.

 

[F_R]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

F_R
Thanks for the help. I'm not sure if the alternator worked or not- how would I know that and is it used just for stuff like a radio and to charge the battery of the boat. The location of the unicharger was on the knee wall away from the bilge area. I opened it up and evrything inside looked realitively good- no rust or damaged wires. I did break a screw head of when I was loosening a wire to remove it so I could get the wires out of the boat. No big deal though. The guy at the shop that I go to told me that could be about$700 just to get that working if it doesn't work already. I found that kinda hard to believe- what are your thoughts?
Thanks Again,
Mick

Bill- thanks for the digital scan- I will add it to my notebook with the factory one.

You should have an ammeter on the dashboard---at least they came with one. If it is working, the charge/discharge will show on it.

"could be $700"? Well I suppose it could be. But I'll fix it for you for a heaping lot less than that, assuming everything is not totaled out--which you indicate it is not. The most expensive thing in the box is the voltage regulator. Of course you have to bring the boat to me, I'm not going to it unless it is local.

 

[R.Johnson]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

This is where thing's get sticky. I don't care what you want to restore if you don't have the skill's. You simply take it to someone who does have the skill's, and pay them a living wage.

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

I have no problem paying someone with a skill that I don't have the money to fix something for me. That was never the issue. The issue was the unicharger costing $700 to fix. That seemed as F_R put it a little high.
F_R where do you live- you can pm me if you'd like. I do have an amperes guage on the boat but to be honest I didn't look at that one time when we had the boat out. Heck something as small as the unicharger I could even mail to you if need be.
Like I said in an earlier post- I just want to have everything in order so when I get to that point of the restore I am ready to go and understand what has to happen next.
Thanks Again,
Mick

 

[Chris1956]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

When you guys say Unicharger, you mean the mechanical auto-style voltage regulator? My '64 Merc had one of those mechanical VRs as well as a conventional generator (pre alternator days). Do you think the regulators could be matched to an automotive style one from someone like a JC Whitney?

 

[F_R]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

I have no problem paying someone with a skill that I don't have the money to fix something for me. That was never the issue. The issue was the unicharger costing $700 to fix. That seemed as F_R put it a little high.
F_R where do you live- you can pm me if you'd like. I do have an amperes guage on the boat but to be honest I didn't look at that one time when we had the boat out. Heck something as small as the unicharger I could even mail to you if need be.
Like I said in an earlier post- I just want to have everything in order so when I get to that point of the restore I am ready to go and understand what has to happen next.
Thanks Again,
Mick

Well, I see you are in PA. I'm in FL so that puts considerable miles between us. Something "as small" as the Unicharger is kind of an oxymoron. A "Unicharger" is a field excited alternator under the flywheel. The rest of the system is in the junction box, consisting of four rectifier diodes, a 60 amp fuse, and a voltage regulator. With associated wiring and the ammeter. So, obviously you need the complete rig to do any troubleshooting.


BTW, this is worlds different than the alternators on today's motors. The field excited part is the biggest difference. New motors have magnets in the flywheel to generate electricity as they pass the coils. Your motor has no magnets. The regulator sends a current through a separate field coil, which becomes an electromagnet. The regulator controls the voltage by varying the current sent to the field. Over your head yet?? Sorry.

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

F_R
Yeh, way over my head! But this site is great- I learn something new every post and I really appreciate it! I am starting to grasp what you are saying to me.
Thanks,
Mick

 

[samo_ott]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

The simple way I use to see if a charger is working is to put a volt meter on the battery and see what it rises up to under throttle.

BTW, that's a great looking engine. All 248 lbs of it!

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

samo_ott
Thanks for the info., but again over my head and out of my realm
Yeh it wasn't easy getting that thing off the boat. My neighbor and I were struggling a little to say the least to get it onto the stand I made for it! I'm surprised the transom held it with how heavy it is and how rotten the transom was!

F_R- I read over your last post about 20 times and I am starting to understand more about the unicharger a bit more- thanks.

You sure you don't want to take a drive up here to beautiful eastern PA with and your tools and work on my motor??? J/K

Ok, I'm understanding now that the unicharger is alot more than the small box I talked about but my next question is will the motor work without it? For instance, say it doesn't work and I don't want to dump a boat load of money into the unicharger like my boat guy said- can it come out and the motor still work? If it can come out how would I power anything then that I wanted to put in there.

In the future all I basically want in there is an FM radio and possibly a fish finder.

And my last question for you for now is how much should I expect to pay to have the motor rewired? The reason I ask is when I was looking over the motor again today I noticed that alot of the smaller wires are still probably original with the fabric type covering on them. Some of them are spliced and taped together with newer wire that has the plastic covering on them. I don't know if this is a big deal or not but I want to have this boat for a long time and I want to do in a sequence of steps what is necessary to keep the boat and engine running properly so it can last another 47 years. I would think that at some point this would have to be done??

That leads me to ask- what should I do/ask to have checked to the motor phase 1, phase 2, phase 3, etc...

I will pay for your gas to come up

Thank You Again,
Mick
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?p=2438030&posted=1#post2438030

 

[F_R]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

samo_ott
Thanks for the info., but again over my head and out of my realm
Yeh it wasn't easy getting that thing off the boat. My neighbor and I were struggling a little to say the least to get it onto the stand I made for it! I'm surprised the transom held it with how heavy it is and how rotten the transom was!

F_R- I read over your last post about 20 times and I am starting to understand more about the unicharger a bit more- thanks.

You sure you don't want to take a drive up here to beautiful eastern PA with and your tools and work on my motor??? J/K

Ok, I'm understanding now that the unicharger is alot more than the small box I talked about but my next question is will the motor work without it? For instance, say it doesn't work and I don't want to dump a boat load of money into the unicharger like my boat guy said- can it come out and the motor still work? If it can come out how would I power anything then that I wanted to put in there.

In the future all I basically want in there is an FM radio and possibly a fish finder.

And my last question for you for now is how much should I expect to pay to have the motor rewired? The reason I ask is when I was looking over the motor again today I noticed that alot of the smaller wires are still probably original with the fabric type covering on them. Some of them are spliced and taped together with newer wire that has the plastic covering on them. I don't know if this is a big deal or not but I want to have this boat for a long time and I want to do in a sequence of steps what is necessary to keep the boat and engine running properly so it can last another 47 years. I would think that at some point this would have to be done??

That leads me to ask- what should I do/ask to have checked to the motor phase 1, phase 2, phase 3, etc...

I will pay for your gas to come up

Thank You Again,
Mick
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?p=2438030&posted=1#post2438030

It will run without the Unicharger working. Till the battery goes dead. Then you will go nowhere without a tow. How long it takes to go dead depends on the battery (they vary a lot), and the load you put on it, not only in accessories, but starting and stopping. Depending on the fault, a non-functioning Unicharger itself can put a considerable drain on the battery.

Before you get so deeply concerned, I suggest you run it again and check the ammeter next time. It might not even be broken or need fixing. If it doesn't work, the cause could be anything from a broken wire or blown 60 amp fuse, to some expensive or obsolete part.

Sorry, I can't quote prices for somebody else, especially without examining the motor. Parts prices can be out of this world in some cases, and labor rates vary around the country. Our shop rate when I changed vocations in 1978 was $10/hr. Now it averages $80-100. Obviously, it doesn't take very long to rack up a big bill. That's why so many people won't work on old motors. Yeah, I should go back to work, but don't have time since I retired.

 

[Willyclay]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

I had to replace the voltage regulator for my 1962 Johnson 75HP. It was a DELCO brand product, part number 9000561, and thought this might be useful info for you. Good luck!

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

F_R since you are retired you can go on an adventure to get up here. You can hop on the Appalachian Trail in Georgia and go on a hike. You will run right into our town in Moore Township. If you started now you could get here in about 3 months- just in time to check out the engine when it is hopefully ready to go back on the boat!
Mick

Seriously though- Thanks for the info!

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

Bill thanks for that piece of info on the regulator. When I was at the boat place yesterday I asked the guy again about the motor and they said they could do all the work on it there and they can still get parts for it as well. That made me feel a little better.
Mick

 

[micks110]

Re: 1961 Evinrude Starflite III Unicharger Questions

Hey guys! Just an update- the boat is done and at the boat shop having the motor gone over like I planned. I managed to find a NOB unicharger that had been sitting in its original box on ebay and got it- everything about it is brand new- awesome find.

So here is where I'm at today I was at the boat place when they were going over it. That had to put new points(s) on it and it has spark in all cylinders now.

3 of the 4 cylinders were at 90 compression but the 4th one was at 40 (it was the last one we tested BTW too so I was smiling ear to ear and then- BAM!). So we took the head off the block and saw that the piston had creosote build up on it and it was worn in spots. There was no damage to the rings though and no shear marks on the cylinders. I hope I'm making sense.

Then They said what do you want to do? I was like ???? fix it? The one guy said it was junked, the other two older guys said it can be rebuilt and they could still get the pistons for it. The other two guys said that I should just run it for the summer since that was the plan and then they or I can rebuild during the winter.

So I agreed that this was the way I wanted to go because I don't have the $ to spend on rebuilding it at this time, and I want to keep the boat and engine as period as possible, so buying a newer engine that will save me on gas is out of the question.

So what do you think? I'm kinda tied to this engine because it has been with the boat for over 35 years! Do you think I will have any issues running it for maybe 30-40 hours until the winter months? The guys at the boat place said with the creosote build up on it that it has probably been running this way for quite some time. They also said that for them to rebuild it that it will probably cost around $1500 to rebuild all 4 cylinders.

Let me know what you guys think. Thanks!

Oh yeh- here's what she looks like now

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