470 shift interrupter question

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Did you put a new lower shift cable in by chance? If so, how much movement did you leave in the end slider (in the bell housing)? You don't want ant more than about 1 thou. Also you didn't do the 'turn the brass barrel on the remote control cable back 4 turns". That's why you still have to go slightly into reverse to disengage forward. It's not in the manual to make it thicker, it's there for a reason..... Know what you gotta do now don't you .....

Chris..............
(Sorry about your forehead, That looks nasty, and close to taking an eye out )

I omitted the 4 turns because it only compounded the problem of it shifting into forward. When I follow that procedure exactly, it ratchets a lot going into forward, so I have to move the barrel forward a few turns anyway to get the firm ka-chunk at the detent.

I may take some aluminum foil tape and put a wrap around the pivot points to remove a little play between the cable ends and the shift lever. Hey, I'm from Alabama! Just give me some duct tape and hay baling wire and I can fix anything.

I made need a new shift spool one day.

BTW, I wear glasses so the eyes were protected. I normally wear a ball cap because I have this proclivity for cutting my forehead...bending over to pick something up off the floor and whacking my forehead on the edge of the counter top (x2)...flinging open the truck door and not getting out of the way quickly enough and splitting open my forehead (x2), drilling a 2" hole through a 2x4 overhead, hitting a snag, and having the drill spin out of my hands and cutting my forehead with the spinning hole saw...now this. I have a picture folder called "My Forehead Cuts." It's a big family joke. My wife chides me saying, "Honey, can't you remember that your forehead is right above your nose?"

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Nate,

I don't know if this will help you, but I got a boat that had years of problems with shifting into reverse. I tried following the manual and it didn't really help me. First I had to deal with some slightly bent shift shaft parts and intermediate shift shaft (the shoe and bracket), that needed replacing. And I can tell you that the mercruiser brand was much more exact than the off brand, just by playing with the parts. Then what I had to do to get it working correctly was basically doing it backwards, I got reverse to work correctly first, and then did my barrel adjusting from there to get neutral and forward right. It's been 2 years now, boating in lake erie with their busy public launches and the thing shifts like a dream. I'm pretty sure I have a worn shift spool in the lower unit and will have to deal with that some day, but not now!

I'll try that. I'm pissed at myself for not doing the troubleshoot procedure for the shift shaft and spool while I recently had the outdrive off.

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Did you put a new lower shift cable in by chance? If so, how much movement did you leave in the end slider (in the bell housing)? You don't want ant more than about 1 thou.

No, I reused the existing one, but I did replace the slider and all that stuff at the end. I used a micrometer to put it back like it was.

Let me ask this question again: In the troubleshooting procedures for testing the play in the lower cable et. al., the max play was 9/16", right? The make or break question is whether or not you make the first mark at the precise moment the prop locks in forward (CCW) or at the limit of travel of the cable? As I said before, the first mark results in a pass, the latter mark results in a fail, by like 1/4". The service manual doesn't specify, but it makes all the difference.

 

[achris]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

... The make or break question is whether or not you make the first mark at the precise moment the prop locks in forward (CCW) or at the limit of travel of the cable? ...

He shoots, he..... misses... Sorry Nate, first mark at the limit of travel..... You can now start looking for where all that extra movement is coming from. This whole system is reliant on as little slop in it as possible. A little at each point will end up with the whole system not working properly.... like what you have.....

Chris.......

 

[achris]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

You know... I worked on MANY Mercruiser engines and set up these shift systems all the time when I was a dealer, yet you and sti(something, something, something) have had more problems than I ever had to deal with... What's going on?

Ok... the system needs to be tight... When putting the drive halves together don't forget to put the rubber washer and the steel washer on top of the gear housing shift shaft (really important). The shoe on the end of the intermediate shaft needs to fit into the top of the lower shift shaft with as little slop as possible. A really snug fit. Give the shoe a GENTLE squeeze if necessary. Check to make sure you don't have excessive clearance in the lower bushing of the intermediate shaft. This bushing is the only place where there is usually a bit of movement, but if the bushing is oval, replace it (and the top bushing). Next up the line the roller on the end of the shift arm can't have any wear on it, make sure it fits inside the fork on the slide really closely. Make sure the screw/pin locking the arm to the shaft is tight (it should be loctited). The slide on the end of the shift cable (inside the bell housing) must be able to rotate on the cable, but have as little float as possible. The adjusting screw MUST be wire-locked. I try for less than 1 thou without it binding on the cable when rotated. As long as the shift cable itself is in good condition and you have eliminated all the slop you possibly can, the rest of the adjustment is a doddle.... BUT, the whole job relies on you being METICULOUS in getting these things right. This is a case where close enough is definitely NOT good enough. You need to work to VERY close tolerances and take your time and get it all correct..... If you even think "is that close enough?", it's not.... tolerance on this particular job is +/-0.0000....

HTH,

Chris.........

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

He shoots, he..... misses... Sorry Nate, first mark at the limit of travel..... You can now start looking for where all that extra movement is coming from. This whole system is reliant on as little slop in it as possible. A little at each point will end up with the whole system not working properly.... like what you have.....

Chris.......

I needed this answer when I had the outdrive off. :facepalm: But thank you for all the help. Now I've narrowed down the problem to the lower shift cable and everything behind that. Oh well, it's a good thing that I actually like working on cars and boats, and I've got a 24 year old boat and a car with over 100,000 miles and two more with over 150,000 miles to keep me busy. Bummer that I don't have access to the special tools to get into the foot and replace the shift spool. A visit to Lou's Marine in January is in order, I think.

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Good write up Chris. I replaced the bushing/slider/roller in the outdrive a couple years ago. Got the rubber and steel washers in place. Haven't checked the shoe for slop. After a catch a redfish, I'll pull off the outdrive and check all that. Thanks again.

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

The aluminum tape around the clevis pin/barrel nuts/pivot points was a good idea. A wrap or two around them took out a significant amount of play. I also took a vice grip to the upper shaft shoe and got a little out there. Probably a paper widths space between it and the intermediate shaft shoe. Measured the 6" with a digital micrometer. Did the 4 turns plus about 4 more to get it to shift into forward. I did have to adjust the slot to get it to shift into reverse, though.

Now, sitting in the driveway on muffs it's working the way it should. It's coming out of gear fine. The frustrating thing is that it won't be that way in the water, just wait and see.

However, I did not have the 9/16" maximum play in the lower shift cable, rather, 11/16".

Chris, is there any way to get rid of the slack in the lower cable at the slider end, assuming the shift shaft play is less than 12 degrees? Before I took the old slider off, I measured how far the barrel net protruded out of it, then just put it back the way it was. That was probably an error knowing what there is probably a procedure for that, too.

View attachment 118444

If not, I need to replace the lower cable.

Regardless, going fishing this evening.

 

[achris]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

..Chris, is there any way to get rid of the slack in the lower cable at the slider end, assuming the shift shaft play is less than 12 degrees? Before I took the old slider off, I measured how far the barrel net protruded out of it, then just put it back the way it was. That was probably an error knowing what there is probably a procedure for that, too.....

Yeah Nate, not the right way. After you put the slider on the cable screw the grubscrew in until it touches the end of the cable and then back it out until the slider will rotate on the cable without binding but with almost no float, then wirelock the puppy....

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Just got back from the sound. What a beautiful sunset. My son and I we were having so much fun that we stayed out for an hour past sunset. My first time out at night. I caught a monster speck (or is it a Spanish Mackerel?) and my son caught an under-sized redfish.

Monster speck Picture #1
View attachment 118513

Monster speck Picture #2
View attachment 118514

My son's first redfish (not a keeper though)
View attachment 118515

Okay, the shifting was acceptable after my tweaks. After I take care of the lower cable slop, I'm sure it will be great.

 

[telstar1]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Going back to your orig post you I believe said you had to go slightly past neutral to get out of gear?My secret, based on coming up to 40 yrs of reasonably affable relationships with the mercruiser ladies is:so what if thats what it takes do it. Heck I thought they were built that way. Never spent much time(sounds like HOURS) getting all the little sources of slop out of the system,just always made my shifts by "going past neutrel" trained my wife and kids to do same in about 30 seconds each;must admit Ive learned a lot from reading this thread but will suggest it may not be worth the effort-its just a handle,learn how to make it work best...

 

[natemoore]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

Going back to your orig post you I believe said you had to go slightly past neutral to get out of gear?My secret, based on coming up to 40 yrs of reasonably affable relationships with the mercruiser ladies is:so what if thats what it takes do it. Heck I thought they were built that way. Never spent much time(sounds like HOURS) getting all the little sources of slop out of the system,just always made my shifts by "going past neutrel" trained my wife and kids to do same in about 30 seconds each;must admit Ive learned a lot from reading this thread but will suggest it may not be worth the effort-its just a handle,learn how to make it work best...

You don't know my wife. Besides, it's not within me to live with something that I know I can fix. I could have lived with the corroded hinges and rotten wood on my seat cushions. I'm mean hell, they opened and closed just fine and no ones' butt knew the difference, but I was compelled to fix them by something in my DNA.

That shift system is taunting me.

 

[telstar1]

Re: 470 shift interrupter question

I hear you