5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

[ashleygoodin]

Okay, I am planning the next project on my honey-do list. I surprised myself and my wife by winning a '95 chaparral sunesta 220 on e-bay about two weeks ago. I went and picked it up. Hull is in great shape, interior is iffy at best and needs some work but I think that I have that covered. The main challenge is the motor. I have the complete Penta 5.0 that is original to the boat as well as the SX outdrive with stainless prop. They were both off of the boat when I bought it. I asked the guy that I bought it from what was up with the motor (the boat was at a small repair shop/storage yard and the mechanic didn't look like I would put too much confidence in him). He stated that the motor wouldn't turn...that he worked with it a little bit and finally got it to turn a little bit.

Judging from the nature of the rust on the motor mounts and around the edges of the valve covers, I would say that this was probably run in salt water and then not properly flushed. I am thinking maybe a stuck valve, possibly a past hydrolock, and a little rust in the cylinders. I have the motor sitting out under my shed on a pallet. I also have some time to kill over the winter.

First question....I am wondering if it is worth popping the manifolds and heads off of the original block, taking a peak inside, pouring in a little marvel mystery oil and seeing what happens or should I be looking for a long block? I am leaning toward a long block or a Michigan Motorz gold package with new exhaust manifolds and risers...and also in a 350/5.7 size.

Second question...The outdrive is intact and other than the skeg on the bottom that has a little bend in it and is missing the lower 1/2" from what looks like was an unfortunate encounter with a fixed object or gravel, it doesn't appear to need anything but a new anode. Should I look at changing over to all Mercruiser GM or should I stick with Volvo Penta.

Help, comments, tips, and good conversation are always appreciated!

 

[Maclin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

It is usually best to rebuild what was in there, especially on that new of a boat since all the parts are available. Changing brands is always problematic and can affect the value of the boat adversely in my opinion. If the block is toast then you can step up to a 5.7 as you say, and the cost (5.0 vs. 5.7) is the same. Sounds like an interesting project! good luck on it...

 

[captmello]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Are you sure its a 5.0 gm and not a 5.0 ford?

 

[Don S]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Before you start throwing motors at it, you might want to check the gear lube in the outdrive, and pull the drive off the boat and check the bellows for water. Is the engine carbed or EFI?

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Thanks for giving me a start...now keep it coming.

I haven't even considered it being a Ford 5.0 as an I/O. I will do a little checking today and hopefully post some pictures as well.

Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) the outdrive is off of the boat and the motor was already out when I picked up the boat (we just dropped the motor into the back of my truck). That limits a bit of the troubleshooting options. I think that my first step is going to be pulling the exhaust manifolds/risers and see what I can see there.

This motor has a carb. I haven't looked to see if it is a 2bbl or 4bbl yet, pretty much just offloaded it onto a pallet and haven't had a chance to get back to it yet.

I only have $975 in the boat plus the fuel to go and get it (about another $150), so I am thinking that even with picking up a trailer and some interior work I will still come out pretty well. Plus I am a mechanical guy and like working on older/broken things rather than buying new so this is right up my ally and right in line with my budget.

I am up for a rebuild if that will save some money. I am just wondering what the value of the time and effort of reinstalling the motor would be when factored in to this whole equation.

 

[Don S]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

If it's a 5.0L, it's a Ford. GM had the 4.3 and 5.7 up through 97. Volvo only used the Fords in 94-95-96, all GM from 97 on.
Not what you want to hear, as parts for the Fords are getting harder to find, little things, like spark plug wire sets. The good news, the carbed engines are easier to deal with than the EFI for those years.

 

[dpoelstra]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

quick way to tell: GM has the distributor in the back of the engine, and Fords are in the front. Easy Peasy if you cant find a tag, or if you don't know motors.

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Okay, now I am thoroughly confused. All of the printed tags on the motor, specifically the control/fuse panel on the riser state 5.0. Now I am not trusting that entirely. However, the distributer is in the rear of the motor a la GM style as stated before. The valve covers look to be what I am familiar with as the four bolt commont on the 305's and 350's. However, the heads seem to have too many bolts to be GM. Here are a few photos.

Oh, and it is a Holly 2bbl carb on this motor.

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

I took a little time and pulled off both exhaust manifolds and risers. I also pulled the valve cover on the right side of the motor to take a look. I wasn't too thrilled at the oily/carbon/rust sludge that I got when I pulled the water intake from the thermostat to the exhaust manifold. (See attached photos. It looks like I have only one complete spark plug left in the motor, one broken off, and two others with either pieces of the base or helix inserts poking out on the left side (I needed more time and a set of extra hands to do some deeper exploration. From pulling the valve cover, everything on that end of the head looks pretty good, strait, and clean. Now as far as the exhaust valves...they look pretty rusted and it should be interesting to see if they will actually seat or what I can do with them. Enjoy the photos...

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

And just in case you were wondering, here is a photo of the outdrive.

 

[dpoelstra]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

definitely a Chevy motor. Volvo used a lot of the 305ci Chevy motors which is the 5.0l. I am not sure when these stopped but they used them for years. I had a 79 with one, and now an 85 with 2. This is a later model than I am used to, but the motor is definitely a Chevy small block.

Easy swap for a 350, but from the looks of things, you are going to need everything. May be easier to go with a new crate marine motor with all the fixens.

 

[Don S]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Well, like I said earlier if it's a 5.0 and 94,95, or 96, it would be Ford so obviously it's newer if it's a 5.0.

Your engine also has a newer style raw water pump, so I'm thinking you may have a newer engine, possibly a replacement or upgrade at some point.
Look on the port side by the oil filter, and see if there is a metal tag with model and serial numbers on it.

Also, some of your pictures are not showing (those in post 9) do not try to post pictures in the Quick reply box, they disapear in 1 hour.
Use the Go Advanced screen for posting pictures.

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Okay - after checking the numbers, here is what I have come up with....

Volvo Penta
Product #3865544
5.0GL PWTR
S/N 4110184025

Outdrive:
SX-C
1.51 Ratio
Product # 3868162
S/N 4112008434

So, can any of you interpret what that means for me? Also - how does that weigh in on the rebuild or replace scenario? If I replace, will that gear ratio work for a 5.7/350?

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

OK-

So according to the Volvo Penta website I have a 5.0 Liter GM (305), limited output (?), made in 1998-99, with a type "R" control.

 

[Don S]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

The 1.51 gear ratio is for a 5.8L engine, but it should work fine for the 5.7 you plan on installing as well. Changing the long block to a 5.7 and new manifolds, you should be back in business if the carb, fuel pump, distributor, wiring harness, alternator, starter and other add on's are in good shape.

 

[insttech1]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Is it just me or does that skeg look like it was completely re-contoured and shortened?

 

[dpoelstra]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

The only thing if you go from a 5.0 to a 5.7 is you will need to re-jet the carb, and replace the prop. The carb will run too lean for the bigger cubic inches, and the prop will be too small for optimum performance.

 

[ashleygoodin]

Re: 5.0 Penta - Trouble Unknown - Rebuild or Replace?

Dan - thanks for the information about the carb and the prop. The prop will be a definite replacement if I change sizes. I think I may go for a fuel injected motor for a replacement. While the parts for the 305's are available, the 350/5.7's are certainly more prolific with many more options. For me, this is what I am calling a "10-year rebuild", so I want the availability. I am thinking that the EFI may save a little $$$ on fuel over the long run as well.

Opinions on that?

As far as the skeg goes, it looked a little odd to me as well. Since this is the first Volvo outdrive that I have owned (my other I/O is an Alpha I), I don't really have a point of reference. However, I figure that there is certainly enough to put a skeg-guard replacement on there to attain something closer to the intended profile and length.