85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

[notsunkyet]

ok guys got the motor rehung on the new transom and guess what? It didnt fall off! So feeling a bit of good luck i decided to start her today figgin thing fired right up after sitting for almost 2 years! NOW for the problem.... All works great except I thought you should be able to pull the throttle out (stock by the way) and rev the engine without engaging the prop. WEll I cant! the shifer moves fine with the trottle engaged to work the prop but not so much when pulled out ,, its like something i binding up any ideas? is it in my controller or the linkage? also is 12.72 at the battery a charging battery voltage?

 

[jaybirddog11]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

Battery sounds good but without testing you can never really tell. How do your cables look, any cracking? Look at the connections at both ends to make sure nothing is binding. Also look how the cable is ran to the motor, any kinks or twists could cause binding.

 

[brdhntr]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

I think there is a limiter on the idle speed when in neutral. On my 85 HP, when I pull out the shift lever and advance the throttle, it doesn't travel even half as far as when in gear. Keeps you from over revving the engine.

 

[ozenine]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

I am having similar issue. I tested it by taking the controller down and disconnecting the throttle cable - then i MANUALLY moved the cable - it moved fine, so I have isolated the issue to the controller,now I will ahve to take it apart and figure out why there is no "throttle only" mode

 

[Smokepole27]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

Do you have the option for throttle only? On mine I dont have that option. I have a little turn knob on the back but it doesnt do anything... Sound like something came apart on the inside, possibly a wire or maybe a cotter pin rusted out and came loose and isnt connected anymore, If I read this right..

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ALL Chrysler and Force engines (before 1995) have an RPM limiter built into the engine at the shift linkage and throttle tower below the bottom carb. Throttles will only crack open and timing will only advance a couple of degrees when in neutral. It is what it is!

The black knob at the back of the control box adjusts handle drag when it works--which is not often.

 

[notsunkyet]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ALL Chrysler and Force engines (before 1995) have an RPM limiter built into the engine at the shift linkage and throttle tower below the bottom carb. Throttles will only crack open and timing will only advance a couple of degrees when in neutral. It is what it is!

The black knob at the back of the control box adjusts handle drag when it works--which is not often.

ok so Frank if i understand .. there isnt much throttle i can give it "IF" the control handle pulls out? ok then i can deal with that ....also i need to find a way to lube up my cable .... they are kinda stiff.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

There is no way to lubricate cables.They are like brake pads and meant to be replaced if damaged.

However, I did have a bit of luck with a steering cable. What I did: Over the winter, I raised one end high and attached a length of hose over it. I then filled the hose with 90 weight gear oil and let it try to penetrate and trickle into the cable over the period of months. Took a lot of time but it did work--sometimes we get lucky!

 

[Smokepole27]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ALL Chrysler and Force engines (before 1995) have an RPM limiter built into the engine at the shift linkage and throttle tower below the bottom carb. Throttles will only crack open and timing will only advance a couple of degrees when in neutral. It is what it is!

The black knob at the back of the control box adjusts handle drag when it works--which is not often.

Ahhh so that could be a reason its a little tense to push... I was screwing the darn thing clock wise seeing if it would do anything and nothing happened, just thought it was meant for something that just wasnt for my 85hp force. Any ideas as the length of travel adjustment after gear is engaged? I have to push the thing almost all the way forward for the new throttle cable to engage. Or is that just the way the usmarine control is made?

 

[notsunkyet]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ok guys here it is,, last nite at midnight i decided to rebuild or at least clean the throttle control, Removed the dirt and hard grease reassembled and operated smoothly. unhooked the cables from the controller and engine and have smooth easy operation.. but shifter was still binding.
hooked cables back up and watched contact points on engine... at the block going vertically there the the throttle shaft/timing lever. it moves fine a little stiff but moves, but there is, what id consider to be a parking pawl the goes towards the middle of the engine and hits a bent steel piece that is worked by the other cable for forward and neutral, reverse. these two come close to each other in there respective actions and will hit in the neutral position and "lock" or bind"
is my cable adjustment wrong? if so what is the best proceedure to adjust them? also are the two piece that engage are they timed wrong?
also the first lever to move in the throttle control is for shift engagement correct?

 

[brdhntr]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

Disconnect the shift linkage where it goes into the lower unit (just above where you put the gear oil in), and try the shifter again. If it is smooth now, the problem is the lower unit shift rod seal, and you will need to tear down the lower unit. I am in the process of doing exactly that on mine.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

At normal neutral, there is not much space between the two pieces 1/16 to 1/8 is all. On the old Chrysler engines, if the distributor drive belt was too tight, it caused this problem too.

On your engine: Either the shift linkage is out of adjustment OR---most likely-- throttle idle speed stop screw isa way too far advanced. You need to re-synchronize the throttles and timing so the stop screw is somewhere near the center when idle speed is correct.

Causes: Timing too far retarded. Or, fouled plugs, so idle must be raised for dependable idle, Or, throttle butterflies completely closed--synch issue, or carbs too rich, slowing idle, Or, weak cylinder, or, throttle cam too far retarded--ball link too short---you get the drift--anything that slows the normal idle and makes you screw in the idle stop screw will cause the problem. SO: first thing to do is re-check compression ratio on all cylinders then synchronize the throttles and timing, and set timing to 30 Degrees advance at wide open throttle.

If the shift linkage is too long or too short, then in order to acheive neutral in the lower unit, the cable and upper arm will be biased and the interlock will hit.

SO; you need to check all these areas. If you know what you are looking for, it is a 15 -20 minute job.

 

[notsunkyet]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ok will have to do tmro... all i have the seloc manual... Yes i know i know i know....gonna find one this weekend.....is tearing the lower end off a big deal? there was a guy who was having issues finding a seal on here the other day

 

[Smokepole27]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

Depends on what model you have. The easiest way to tell is by your impeller. If the houseing is a hardened plastic then you have one like mine, if you have the cast aluminum you should be able to get the seal. I was one of the misfortunate ones that had to buy a new assembly. You should be ok.

 

[Smokepole27]

Re: 85 Force shift binding! NEED HELP!

ok will have to do tmro... all i have the seloc manual... Yes i know i know i know....gonna find one this weekend.....is tearing the lower end off a big deal? there was a guy who was having issues finding a seal on here the other day

Tearing it down consists of removing the lower unit and taking off both of the housings, impeller and shaft seal housing. Take your time with that their is an o ring that is restricting it and if you look in the book or on a parts diagram you will see how it is circular that intrudes down about 3/4s of an inch and youll need to work it out with either wedges or I just used 4 screw drivers and taped on each side of the lower intruding seal takes a little while and add a little heat as you do it.