ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

To maximize engine/transom height to perfection you must sea trial it on flat calm, glassy no wind waters, once height is correctly dialed, boat will work top at any sea condition. Bear in mind that riding at plane or wot on choppy seas it's not the best way to go boating, unless you have tough kidneys and buttocks...

Happy Boating
 
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fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Certainly so. Normally when you go out for the day, the waves are nominal or you would stay on the hill. It is not unusual for things to get worse during the day, so you are forced to deal with whatever happens. Mounting an engine too high and having it gulp air while fighting rough water is not my idea of a picnic.

I would much rather have the engine mounted on the low side for normal boating. You will quickly lose interest in that extra MPH or so you got by mounting the motor for top speed in calm water when you hear the engine fighting wave action. I have seen prop hubs give way when things got rough :( Then you cross your fingers, slow down and hope the hub holds until you reach calm water.

Now that I think of it, isn't that one of the reasons that Sea Rider posted instructions to begin with? His instructions provide for good general boating rather than getting every once out of your motor in flat water.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Luckily for us the South Pacific as its name suggest is very Pacific, and from where got its name, no unexpectd surprises at all throughout the entire boating day, at the most 5-10 MPH winds and slightly wavy waters on windy days during winter time, wind turns seas into choppy ones in which you'll need to throttle less for passenger seating confort or get ready to get wet due to overboard water splashes. Remaining wet will definitely give you cold. That's why big engines over 40 HP are not required on most large inflatables.-

Happy Boating
 
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fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Now you are making me jealous. Here the water can kick up fast and even the rivers are subject to a very uncomfortable chop when the wind and tide are in opposite directions. You are running in flat water down a river and when you go around a bend, it gets nasty. The near shore Atlantic here has 2 to 3 ft waves on a nice day. I avoid open ocean running at all times unless in a 20 ft or larger boat.
 

alanfox55

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Time to throw my two cents into the mix. #1. Why not use a jack plate for adjusting up or down rather than cutting down or adding shims? #2. My motor came with an 8in pitch prop. That's because it came off a pontoon boat. Going to go slow and have over revving issues no matter what the engine height. According to my service manual I should be running about a 15in pitch for best performance. #3. The go fast people are running there motors way high and using special go fast props. They're doing 4-5in from bottom of the boat to middle of prop and using water pick ups down lower on the shaft if need be. Granted they are probably using jack plates that can be adjusted on the fly and going up and down depending on what they are doing...not sure. I certainly can understand that different boats and motor combinations need different shaft height adjustments but again wouldn't a jack plate take care of that problem?
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Alanfox,

It's entirely up to any boater if shimming, chopping transom down, placing a engine mount or buying external jack plate, whichever way you go must match what's been stated and tested to exhaustion for best boat/engine combo performance. Bear in mind that we're talking about small to mediumm sib/ribs with max portable 30 HP engines used for fishing, goofing around, sailing, etc and not racing. To each his own....

External jack plates, are costly, engine will work extended too far from transom, could have rear transom ballance issues as you're shifting engine weight out from ideal transom sitting. Wooden, plastic shims costs cents compared to jack plates. Boaters usually likes minimum investment...

Happy Boating
 
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alanfox55

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Granted using shims is cheap and does not involve much time but you cannot say the same thing about cutting down a transom. A jack plate can be expensive or inexpensive depending on the model. I have a non-adjustable jack plate that cost me $100 brand new. It was easy to install and it has a set back of only 2 inches which is not going to hurt anything unless maybe your motor is already overweight which mine is not. It's called a non-adjustable yet it can be adjusted my taking out four bolts and moving to another hole up or down...not very labor intensive and costs nothing.
 

fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

As long as it can be installed with clearance for the transom clamp screws, it should do fine. How about a report on how well it works for you.

We looked at one to put a 20 inch shaft motor on a 15 inch transom and it did not work out due to interference of the clamp screws.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

To install a long shaft enine on a short shaft transom better is a 5" transom mount, the one that sits on top transom, will need to remove both front and rear engine plates and bolt to transom for a permanent fix. Then you can secure engine clamps to transom mount.

Sometimes you need to raise engine just some mm to achieve best LU/transom water performance specially when in need to get rid of unwated water splashes produced at transom's middle, that's what shims are for, useless going for a manual or hydraulic jack plate , out of this world on a small or medium size inflatable.

Happy Boating
 

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alanfox55

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Mine is already installed but has not been in the water. I will be sure to give a full report after some experience with it. Mine is bolted to the transom and jack plate,there are no thumb screws on my motor. The motor sits completely off of the jack plate and above it. If I was to lower it down I would have to lower the jack plate down but it still would clear the transom. My anti cav plate is even with the bottom of the boat but keep in mind that you can mount the motor higher with a jack plate because it sits back from the transom and how the water flows upwards after clearing the transom.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Alanfox,

Which type of boat and brand model engine do dou have ? Your engine definitely is not a portable one, usually unclamped engines which bolts direct to transom are over 50 HP.

Happy Boating
 

fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

I have a feeling that alanfox is talking a completely different situation than a thread that was meant to help normal inflatable motor installations.

If the motor was run on a pontoon with an 8" pitch prop but 15" is the recommended for normal service, he has a bit of horsepower on his hands. Talk of raising the motor and others using low water pickups indicates he plans on shallow water running which is a whole different kettle of fish than normal inflatable boating.

A bracket on a full inflatable would be problematic if the boat were folded, so he must have a RIB with a fairly large motor. He probably has a fairly special situation he is working on, but it would be doubtful if it falls into the range of general inflatable boating where shimming or cutting a transom is definitely recommended.

Although I highly doubt the installation alanfox is contemplating has much to do with normal inflatables, we would like to hear just what it is? Sounds interesting even though not associated with the recommendations for general boating in this thread.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Hi Fbpooler,

Was thinking exactly same, that's why asked. Mixing products is not alwats best. To each his own. His installation objects the suggested recommendations for standard for up to max 430 size sib/ribs. Let see if he chimes in and clarifies his current boat/engine installation, just for the record.

Happy Boating
 

alanfox55

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

I have a feeling that alanfox is talking a completely different situation than a thread that was meant to help normal inflatable motor installations.

If the motor was run on a pontoon with an 8" pitch prop but 15" is the recommended for normal service, he has a bit of horsepower on his hands. Talk of raising the motor and others using low water pickups indicates he plans on shallow water running which is a whole different kettle of fish than normal inflatable boating.

A bracket on a full inflatable would be problematic if the boat were folded, so he must have a RIB with a fairly large motor. He probably has a fairly special situation he is working on, but it would be doubtful if it falls into the range of general inflatable boating where shimming or cutting a transom is definitely recommended.

Although I highly doubt the installation alanfox is contemplating has much to do with normal inflatables, we would like to hear just what it is? Sounds interesting even though not associated with the recommendations for general boating in this thread.

Let me chime in here as Sea Rider suggests. First, Sea Rider I appreciate everything you have taken the trouble to write about on this subject and find it all to be useful and and valid information. Second, how both of you can read what I've written and make the assumptions you have is beyond me.

I have a 2013 Sea Eagle 14SR which weighs about 170lbs total and is rated for a 40 hp motor. My motor is a 1997 Mercury 30 hp which is basically the same as their 40 hp of that year. Being that it's the same motor as the 40 hp its a large 30 hp of about 650cc's and weighs 155lbs. Most 30 hp two strokes have been about 500cc so I'm assuming mine will have more torque than the 500cc motors. The motor has a 20in shaft and my boat has a 15in transom. This is a remote motor so I have a steering wheel and controls for it.

I am not a "go fast person" I'm mostly a go slow person that wants his boat and motor to be operating at its best. Peak miles per gallon rather than go fast is much more important to me. I use my boat for cruising,exploring,scuba diving and fishing...nothing other than general boating wouldn't you say?

I needed a way to use a 20in shaft motor on a 15in transom and I found an easy simple solution was to use a jack plate. It is a simple light weight jack plate and I'm sure it will work good for me. I thought it would be a simple solution for others also so that really was the whole point to my reply. Another point I made was there are a number of things that go into getting peak performance from you boat/ motor combination,meaning more than just "go fast",one of them being prop pitch. I used as an example props and pitches from different ends of the prop spectrum and where mine should probably be for my boat and boating needs.

For me a jack plate is a good solution to my problem while nether suggesting or implying it's a solution for everyone's motor installation issues. I roll my boat up twice a year and it's a simple thing to unbolt four bolts and take the jack plate off before rolling it up. Sure, if you had to do it every time you went boating it may not be the solution for you but it is one option to think about. Hopefully my chiming had cleared up your confusion.
 

fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

You do have a special installation situation as you are putting a 20" motor on a 15" transom. You certainly cannot use a shim to make up for a 5" difference, and the motor will have to be mounted quite high on the transom.

You sure threw me by mentioning low water pickups and high mounted motors. Even though you have setback which allows for a higher motor mounting, the same information laid out by the OP regarding location of the anti ventilation plate applies. The effective waterline will be higher than on a transom mounted unit.

In your case, it would be good to watch that you do not have a transom mounting problem with the boat. You are adding leverage which will tend to work on the transom mounting members and tend to bend the transom itself. Hope you get a satisfactory installation.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

Alanfox.

Post some pics of your current installation. The issue about installing a long 20" shaft on a 15"short transom is all related to the engine used. That is if having clamp screws located at swivel bracket or not. In your particular case your engine doesn't have clamp screws, so it's a must have a jack plate installed, no other option will work, not even a simple engine mount.

We're currently fabricating epoxy water deflector plates to use long shaft engines on 15-18" height transoms and forget all about engine mounts, raising transom accordingly. Just go for a wot spin and check at which tail height the outward water splash is produced. Under trial and error, play with deflector plate set at different heights untill splash ideally disappears flattened out against water flow, finally secure deflector's base with epoxy, cracy glue, silicone and rounds of electrical tape against tail and voila. Will get some pics to post.

Down issue, pivot engine if getting closer to shallow coastal waters, bear in mind that you'll be dragging a longer 5" tail than with a 15" shaft engine.
 
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fbpooler

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

If he just clamps the 20" motor on a 15" transom, he will lose efficiency due to lower unit drag, so I understand why he wants to use the bracket.
 

Sea Rider

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Re: ABC Sib-Rib Installation Guidelines.-

If he just clamps the 20" motor on a 15" transom, he will lose efficiency due to lower unit drag, so I understand why he wants to use the bracket.

What is lost clamping a 20" engine onto a 15" transom is not just efficiency, is plain fun too as you won't be able to pass from 1/3 throttle. To clarify, a 20" engine will work fine at non plane speeds, but tail against water flow apart from drag will produce excessive double water splash at speed. One is from back tail towards back transom, the other from back transom to wake, a real boating shower.

More throttle, more water drag and worst back splash issues, less throttle the inverse. If you correct this issue adding a second water deflector plate engine will work fine with no water back splash whatsoever at any throttle range that puts you onto plane including full wot.

A close friend of mine and boater pal bought a 340 rib with a 2 strokes Parsun 15 HP 20" shaft. Tail being 5" under water flow produced so much water splashes at both sides of engine at just 1/2 throttle that literally two could take a shower there at same time. Have added to cure his boating frustration a second water deflector plate well height matched against water flow and voila, splash issue is gone forever. He now runs full wot with an ear to ear smile...."Thumbs Up"

Happy Boating
 
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Sea Rider

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Installing Long Shaft Engines on Short Transoms.-

Installing Long Shaft Engines on Short Transoms.-

Update,

Have reinforced my previous WDP (Water Deflector Plate) after some months of daily boating has cracked a bit. Have removed the false sharp edge placed between WDP and AC Plate, useless. Having locked WDP against lower tail with just some rounds of 3M electrical tape proved not to hold well varying it's height along water splash height against wake due to water flow hitting strong underneath WDP. Now has been state of the art heigh tested & seated and locked in place with epoxy cement along some tight rounds of thin rope wrapped in tigh rounds of 3M tape, just in case.

Third and fouth pics corresponds to my boating buddy's long shaft engine mentioned on previous post, his water splash issue was more complex than mine. His 20" leg has double WDP compared to the single of the Tohatsu. His rib's transom heigh is 16", at wot, water flow hit above upper WDP by 2 cm, that's were the splah was produced. 2 could shower there.

Ideal would have been to add a 2 cm wooden shim to transom and match for water flow to skim slighly under upper WDP, but didn?t want to move both engine plates heights accordingly, so a new acrylic wing type was added and under trial and error was correctly water flow matched. Now combo runs like a charm.

Adding false WDP is a cheap and inovative alternative to engine mounts, wooden shims and jack plates if wanting to use a long shaft onto any 15/16/18" transom heights.-
 

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Re: Installing Long Shaft Engines on Short Transoms.-

Re: Installing Long Shaft Engines on Short Transoms.-

does the 20" shaft ON a 15 transom create more drag vs 15" shaft?
 
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