Alarming Tilt During a Turn

[vanashke001]

Hi All, I am a new boater and this is my first season. I have a 19' '88 Bayliner Capri Bowrider with a 165hp OMC. I've been having a great old time with friends towing a tube and all that. I recently put one of those nifty whale tails on the drive to assist in getting on plane a little quicker. I do have power trim but no gauge so I don't really use that much. The concern I have right now is I have found myself getting rather startled at the extreme tilt I get during a spirited turn. (maybe 20-25mph)
I never really noticed it before and I figure some of it is a result of weight distribution.
It was really noticeable this weekend, I was driving, I'm about 195-200 and on the port side of the boat right across from me was a passenger maybe pushing 160-170 and another in the port side of the bow around 155-165. We were pulling someone who runs 240. (the battery is also on the port side) When I turned to port the starboard side lifted quite a bit and scared the crap out of me.
My friend I was towing on the tube chuckled and told me that it would take a lot to flip a boat but it didn't stop me from stressing out. I began limiting my turns to starboard and had the passengers relocate. When all of us were on the boat I still noticed a tilt when turning to port. When I swapped to starboard at one point chuckler decided to "look over the starboard rail" changing the weight again and scaring me when the port side tilted up. punk. lol
The question I have is, is this normal? Is a boat like this normally this sensitive to weight distribution? Am I simply trying to turn too tight? I swear I'm turning like I normally would but I do wonder.
Is there a way I should position passengers to mitigate this? Being inside the boat I really have no idea just how much the boat is actually tilting but it seems I look directly across the passenger seat into water. We don't really take on water beyond spray but man it freaks me out.
Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Maclin]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Did you notice the tilt before the whale tail was installed?

 

[Maclin]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

I had more to say, hit submit instead of preview...

Anyway, if it is indeed an undue tilt and not just a normal boat action that you are not used to it can be due to many things.

One factor is the drive trim angle, do you adjust trim as the boat begins to plane? If the drive stays down it can make the handling feel odd by adding bow steer. If it is too far up it can make the hull want to fall into the turn as mentioned earlier. Usually the prop will blow out of the water before that would happen, but each boat and prop combo acts different.

Water logged foam underneath and perhaps only on one side, or a hook in the hull, and more.

Trim tabs are a better solution for a planing aid than the tail, and the tails have been known to cause some squirrely action when turning. My brother had an I/O boat that felt like it fell into the turn, I finally convinced him to take the tailfin off and it acted more like it was supposed to in my way of thinking. It was hard to convince him though, I felt like he just thought it looked too cool on the trailer with it on.

 

[UncleWillie]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Yep! they really like to turn to port!
The prop turning Clockwise walks the stern to the right so the bow goes left big time.
Ever notice that all powered boat races have only left hand turns?

Learn to enjoy the experience. Were you the only one stressed?
It sounds like your two passengers that were looking the at the water up close and personal were OK with it.

Go out and do some donuts.
Put the boat in a left hand turn and keep adding power and tightening the turn to get a feel of how it handles.
Watch out for your own wake.
After two or three laps it will look like a hurricane is brewing!

 

[Part-time]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

check out the boat in this you-tube video
Near the end about 1:00 min in.

 

[5150abf]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

It sounds pretty normal, I have a 16' alumium v hull and a mid pseed turn will send water shooting straigt off the top of the gunnels, looks pretty scary but is totally normal, the boat will only lean so far in a turn and never far enough to flip or anything like that.

I think kyou will enjoy boat ing alot more once you learn how to use your tilt trim, start out down and as you pick up speed keep bumping it up, outdrive away from the boat) you will notice the bow lifting and the boat will come up on plane alot faster, after a bit of practice it will just become second nature and you won't even think about it.

 

[500dollar744ti]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

d

I recently put one of those nifty whale tails on the drive to assist in getting on plane a little quicker.

take it off, it's probably digging in while you are going into a turn on a plane. if it catches right it will pull you over and feel like you are in a car that spun out. for a whale tail to even come close to doing what it supposed to, it needs to be on top of the water when planing. they are best suited for outboard engines that are configured properly to use it.

i took my whale tail off because it was costing me fuel economy, dragging my hole hole shot, losing top speed and like what's happening to you, digging in on a turn and pulling the boat over unsafely.

i also have a sterndrive and if you do a search on here, anybody who knows what they are talking about will tell you to stay away from the whale tails.

 

[eavega]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Yep! they really like to turn to port!
The prop turning Clockwise walks the stern to the right so the bow goes left big time.
Ever notice that all powered boat races have only left hand turns?

...And this is why I go to iBoats forums every day. Always something to learn! I had noticed that I could carve a much sharper turn to port than to starboard. I simply accepted it as some kind of boat setup issue i.e. the steering rod was better able to push the motor in that direction. Now it makes total sense!

Rgds

 

[vanashke001]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Thanks for all the feedback this all makes tons of sense. I have had the tail on for the last 3-4 outings and hadn't noticed anything so alarming until this past trip. I still attribute some to the weight difference but the direction of the prop makes tons of sense to me. I can also see from the video that they can edge up quite a bit with no real concern. The chuckler has an old 13.5' with an over-sized engine and he is always on one edge or the other in turns so I can see why he doesn't worry. I enjoy being in his boat as it's more of a ride than a cruise. lol It's a little different I guess when it's my boat and I worry about what'll happen when it keels over to one side like that. lol
I'm not sold on the whale tail just yet, it does seem to help its hole shot and it does plane a bit easier, but I've noticed moving people forward seems to help that as well. I don't know how cool it looks on the trailer lol, I think the outdrive would look a lot better if I refinished it and painted it nicely.
I'm still sorting out the trim, but without a gauge I've worried about damaging something. I've read a couple of threads on here that explained somewhat how to use them. One of these weekends I'll have to go out with just one other person and toy with it so I can get a better feel for it. If the whale tail is going to make it that unstable (to my limited experience) I may yank it off for the time being. That or I'll just turn a little less spirited. lol I do have to admit, like on my motorcycle, I kinda dig the hard turns.

 

[Maclin]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Be careful. Some hulls can corner flat at speed. My boat has a warning label on the dash just under the steering wheel. I know of other boats that have this warning sticker as well. I can't go look at it right now to get the exact wording, but it goes like this...


"WARNING -- This boat corners FLAT at speed. Warn passengers before attempting tight turns at speed."

The word FLAT is all caps on the label.

And it does too, no leaning, and the next thing you know you can be on the other side of the boat. I am still not sure how good of a thing that is

A good driver that is ready can make the thing go 180 the other way in 3 or 4 boat widths and a lot of splash and still have momentum somehow.

When under 30mph it leans as one expects, above that it is flat and the side G force is a factor of the speed. I almost lost control of it one time when showing my brother, just he and I, and he ended up on my lap.

Easy enough to control with "normal" width turns. But it can turn hard with just a little more movement of the wheel.

 

[emoney]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

As a previous sailboater, that "heeling" is in fact a "cool thing", but then again, I've always had a 1500lb fin keel to assure me I wouldn't go all the way over, lol. But, as been said, a power boat will always heel to port when being turned that way simply due to the physics of the thing. There's a chance, too, that the whale tail you added isn't affecting it, it's just something you're paying attention to now which tends to exaggerate things. The next time you're out, have someone videotape you from the bank and make a couple of hard turns to port and you'll see that it's probably no steeper than what's in the video that was posted. Perspective is a huge thing. Once you stop worrying about it, it becomes much less of an issue.

 

[jdlough]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

I would get rid of the Whale Tail and install Nauticus Smart Tabs.

The Smart Tabs pop you up on plane with much less bow rise. They also let you stay on plane at a lower speed.

Before I installed them on my boat, it would heel over quite a bit on turns, like yours. Gave me quite the creepy feeling too.

After I installed the Smart Tabs, the boat doesn't heel over anywhere near as much. The ride feels much more stable and safe.


Search these forums for Nauticus Smart Tabs. There's LOTS of info.

 

[greenbush future]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

As others have mentioned, lose the tail, and learn to run your boat with the trim, that is what it's designed for. And as far as gauges go, they really aren't required to use this part of your boats mechanics. You will learn the best motor position to be in, based on how the boat handles and watching your RPM gauge too. I don't even have a gauge on my boat, it's all based on feel and that takes a little practice but you WILL figure out how to trim your boat out based on all the conditions.
I wouldn't even consider a run about boat that didn't have trim on it, give it some effort and you will be happy with your result. I also wouldnt buy a run about that struggled to get on plane, but you didn't say that was an issue either. Usually smaller boats don't need tabs to get up on plane, there are many other options to consider like using your trim effectively, or switching props, before I would spend any $ on tabs for a run about style boat. Dont spend your hard earned cash on anything until you have tried all the features that come with your boat.
To me, Trim tabs on a small boat are a band aid to other problems that could include, the wrong prop, not trimming the boat for the conditions, underpowered power plant, wet foam under the floor boarsds, adding lots of weight. Hope this help you out a bit.

 

[MWBoatFan]

Re: Alarming Tilt During a Turn

Another vote here to loose the whale tail, they simply do not belong on an I/O boat. Get that off there, work with your trim and if all esle fails, get smart tabs.