Engine and electronic systems

[novice boater54]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

Hi Joe. it's ok my fingers do the same thing and then I don't proof read my material when I hit send key, lol.
Ok regarding the rectifier situation I presume from what you are saying that it doesn't even have to be hooked up.
On the same topic does the rectifier affect ignition as indicated in my seloc manual, as it indicates that if the rectifier is faulty the starter will operate but ignition will not occur, is this true?
I have looked at the prices here on i-boat for the rectifier and theyr'e wuite reasonable here may order through here.
I guess as I said the next test will be the pulse pack test to determine if there is failure there.
By the way the color of the paint is a green colour so I'm presuming it's Johnson colours. It has been indicated to me that a lot of parts can be subsititued between manufacturers and models so I wouldn't really know what had or hadn't been subsitituted. I had been told by an unscrupulous marine repair shop that when I ordered an exhaust gasket for the lower end that my lower end must have been switched as the gasket received was nothing close to the one I had and I even had the lower end with me when ordering the parts. This individual didn't choose to compare pictures in his parts book and exclusiviely went by part number trying to tell me that this lower end must have been changed.
I'll let you know the results of the pulse pack test.
Thanks again
Regards
Ron

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

On some models there is a possibilty due to having the charging system worked into areas of the ignition system via a diode etc at the terminal strip that ignition might be affected.

When you get to a point whereas you have spark, disconnect the rectifier and retest for spark...... easiest way to find out. Too much in depth for me to list all of the wiring systems/components and their explanations.

 

[novice boater54]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

Hi Joe. Yes understandably there could be a lot more info on this. Strange thing is though when I first installed the motor on the boat and connected the key switch 'n all, then tried to start the motor I got an initial bang (which of course meant a fire) then had it running for a bit then it sort of died and then the battery went down trying to start it again, while I was using a 30amp charger to keep the battery up all I could get was a few kicks here and there then more or less nothing, so I am wondering if the booster of the battery charger could have done something to the ignition system or the rectifier could have shorted with that wire I mentioned to you about being cracked and exposed to a possible short.
None the less once we get a repalcement rectifier whether new or used one we'll see?
As I indicated the Seloc manual seems to claim that if the rectifier is compromised that ignition will not operate?
Question regarding the topic of the 70A battery rating and the starter voltage drop, would it then be therefore prudent to have two batteries in parallel to avoid such a drop in starting only? Just a thought?
Also you indicated that I can test the pulse pack without the recifier even being present, does that mean even disconnected from the circuit as well?
If that's the case I'll be continuing my tests and checks this weekend and hopefully I'll have conclusinve results.
Thanks for all the help so far and I will fabricate the add on with the diode as well to correct the voltage deficiency to the pulse pack. By the way from my elementary electronics recollection there will be only two wires on a diode?
Ron

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

The rectifier should'ne need to be present at all UNLESS it is incorporated into the ignition system via a "Clipper Circuit" component.... check your service manual.

Two batteries in parellel would have the amperes of the batteries added together but would still be 12 volts...... same as having a two battery setup via a battery switch, that's okay.

The diode betweenn the solenoid and power line of the pulsepack would be a simple 2 wire diode.

 

[novice boater54]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

HI Joe. I'm not sure about the style circuit you refer to nothing spfivc such as that is said bu it does say, In think generally, that if the battery terminals were inerrantly hooked up in reverse polarity, poof! there goes the rectifier which then renders the ignition inoperable but starter function is still functioning. That's all I can tell you from waht I'm reading. Ohters may know a bit more. I vivisted my local marine wreckers to obtain a used rectifier which appears to be functioning via ohm meter test.
This fellow indicated to me that more than likely from what I was describing to him it will be the pulse pack.Of course from what you've told me as well as what I've read regarding the imprtance of maintaining the minimum voltage and amperes this is what how and why mainly the pulse pack fails is due to the voltage drop similar to a bad battery, and a fulaty alternator on a car, if you continue to use a starter with low voltage you will burn the starter due to low voltage and the alternator will prematurely fail due to trying to keep a bad battery charged. it's that visious circle, believe me I know that one real well. This could be the same scenario with the pulse pack as well.
With that said I was told and have heard and read that a auotomotive type coil man be utilized but may not be as efficient) but if its more reliable then why not. Along with that it' said to have an external resistor wired to the car coil as well as a condensor. Do you have any feedback on accomplishing this similar to the voltage solution with the CDI ignition system with the pulse pack . Again if I substitute the pulse pack for the car coil setup I won't need the diode between the starter solenoid and the pulse pack will I?
I'm going to run the tests on the pulse pack right away as I had to go and get the rectifier this morning. Will let you know my findiings.
Thanks
Regards
Ron

 

[novice boater54]

Re: engine electrical

Re: engine electrical

Hi Joe .
Well here are the result/s of the one test I conducted.
I checked the rectifier before I installed it and it checked out ok. I then installed the rectifier and connected the battery to attempt to start the motor. Not even so much as a kick but when I moved the lever which controls the breaker point base I did actually get one kick and also heard the snapping of the points. Still no fire. The spark plugs are apparently getting wet with fuel too so...
I then did the bulb test with an 8.5v flashlight type bulb with no results not even a glimmer. Guess the pulse pack is dead it seems. As you said I don't have the S80-M80 testor so I can't do the first or second amplifer test as in the Seloc manual.
Now for the previous question I asked in the previous thread. What's the alternative in installing an automotive type coil and how is it wired with a ressistor and if need be a condensor for the points or a ballast resistor as mentioned by the guy whowas at the marine wreckers and is a marine mechanic?
What's all involved here and this time it should work.
By the way there is a glob of epoxy with three wires coming from it, a green with green stripe connnected to #9 terminal on the terminal block, and two yellow wires which apparently are connected to both #1 & #3 terimnal and looks like the wires from there go to the stator or the coil under the flywheel. is this for the charging circuit possibly? The other green wire seems to go around and towards the harness connector and then towards the dash> There's one of these globs of epoxy with some wires at the dash or key switch too.
I guess I just need some help in installing the alternative an automotive coil and whatever related parts necessary to get this beast to run.

 

[novice boater54]

Re: Engine and electronic systems

Hi there any body seen Joe. I've sort of been awaiting an answer to my continuing dilemma with my Johnson outboard engine electrical problem?
I haven't received any reply for several days now? Is he ok or just busy?