Getting ready to re-wire the trailer

[dingbat]

Those solder rings are good enough for military and OEM marine use. What's the issue here?

The use of AWS certified welding rods don't make one a welder...

The use of M83519/1-2 compliant solder rings, when installed by a trained individual are allowable where specified. The problem you run into is the competence level of the installer.

The connectors are marketed as a quick and easy solution but like everything there is a degree of knowledge and skill involved that most DYI don't have.

https://workmanship.nasa.gov/lib/insp/2 books/links/sections/406 Solder Sleeves.html

From a DYI perspective, your better off using the Ancor, heat shrink crimp connectors which are much more forgiving for a novice.

 

[guy48065]

I have to disagree. It's very easy to see the solder ring as it melts. It will be obvious if the solder doesn't melt properly & penetrate the wire.
Most DIYers use a non-ratcheting crimper that produces very unreliable connections. I think a solder ring sleeve where you can SEE a good joint (shiny & smooth) is way better.

 

[Grub54891]

Bad link.

 

[guy48065]

Bad link.

Worked for me, but shows a slightly different type of solder sleeve used for terminating shielded wire. I've installed many hundreds of these in military electronics.

 

[gsh]

Where do you plan to drill the holes?
I would suggest the bottom for drainage.
On one of my trailers I had intermittent electrical problems until I removed all lights & markers & found water inside the frame tubing that corroded wire splices. This particular frame had NO drainage anywhere so whatever got in just stayed there.

If I were you I'd make sure there were holes on the back end of the trailer so that the water would drain as you pulled up the ramp.

My trailer for my 14' boat has open ends on the tubing so water can easily flow in and out of the tube.

 

[guy48065]

Sorry--i thought I had mentioned that one is a utility trailer.
I didn't know there was a water problem until it revealed itself as rotted connections within the frame.
Point well taken. Seal holes if possible. Make sure there's an exit if water gets in.
I don't know how you'd do that for tubular crossmembers that have lights, unless you drill holes in the bottom...

 

[JASinIL2006]

Well, last night, I experimented some with my all-in-one connectors. I used a propane torch rather than a heat gun. In every case, it was pretty clear when the solder ring completely melted, but I found I had to try several different flame intensities to get it hot enough to melt the solder but not burn up the plastic sheathing. When I figured out that I needed a fairly low flame, I got some connector joints that superficially looked pretty good.

I checked the integrity of the joints by putting one end of the wire in a bench vise and pulled hard on the other end of the wire with pliers. The plastic wire casing (where it was held by the bench vise) failed before the all in one connector joint did. In fact, no matter what I tried, I could not get the joint to fail. I put far more stress on it than it will ever see on my trailer.

I also stripped away the plastic shrink tubing at the solder joint to examine the solder connection itself. It appeared that the solder infiltrated the wire for the length it was stripped (about 3/8"). Cutting the solder joint with a pair of wire snippers confirmed that the solder had penetrated the wires completely. In fact, the actual soldered joint between wires looked as good as I could do with a soldering iron and a spool of solder.I did not use flux in my tests, but I might use it in actual operations for good measure.

I'm not sure how else I might test these connectors, but the results are enough to convince me that they are sufficiently safe and effective to use for trailer connections.

 

[JASinIL2006]

So, just as a bit of follow-up and closure on this topic, I finished my trailer work. I installed new brakes, hubs and drums (I noted in another thread - https://forums.iboats.com/forum/gen.../trailers-and-towing/10840842-dodged-a-bullet - that one of my bearings had apparently disintegrated). I used Dexter Nevr-Adjust electric brakes, a new wiring junction box, and for good measure, I replaced the breakaway box and breakaway switch with a new Curt model.

The wiring directions and diagrams that came with the Curt box were terrible. None of the colors of wires in the kit matched what the instructions showed. I eventually figured it out, but unfortunately I had pulled all the old wiring out, so I didn't have that to instruct me. What a pain...

I used the all-in-one connectors in one or two places. I had a fair amount of difficulty managing the heat; getting enough heat to melt the solder thoroughly while not frying the insulation was a challenge. It wasn't to hard to get a good connection when doing it on my workbench, but trying to do it under the trailer, on a creeper, was pretty much impossible. I ended up using mostly crimping, waterproof connectors as recommended by dingbat . Those didn't seem to seal as well, so i hit them up with just a bit of liquid tape. (Overkill, maybe, but it made me feel better...)

Anyway, it's all done, and despite my aggravation at the horrible Curt breakaway box instructions, it all works and looks pretty good.

Now it's on to swapping out the front suspension of my wife's Sienna minivan... this stay at home stuff has allowed me to get a lot more projects done...

 

[bruceb58]

Did you use something like this:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

These are all I use.

For future reference, I use these crimp connectors.
https://www.genuinedealz.com/marine-electrical-supply/wire-connectors?cat=85

And this crimper
https://shop.marinehowto.com/products/the-pro-hst-heat-shrink-terminal-crimp-tool

 

[sam am I]

My only problem with my trailer is SQUIRRELS! Yes, those pesky critters love to chew through any exposed wire(s). They have even chewed the red lens plate on the trailer. !

gm280

They're are typically after salt when they chew wires (not sure about the lens, maybe to get to wire?), something about the composition of the insulation I had read somewhere.....Try placing some salt/mineral licks around the place in various locations, I get those round ones (10 for $1) with the centers drilled out, easy to mount to things with wood screws.

 

[JASinIL2006]

Did you use something like this:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

These are all I use.

For future reference, I use these crimp connectors.
https://www.genuinedealz.com/marine-electrical-supply/wire-connectors?cat=85

And this crimper
https://shop.marinehowto.com/products/the-pro-hst-heat-shrink-terminal-crimp-tool

My junction box was branded differently, but it looks to be pretty much the same as that in your link. Seems to be really well made and it was easy to use. (It would have been easier if I hadn't mistakenly ordered one with a 10' cable between plug and box; as a result, I had to cut it down and re-terminated the ends in the box.)

I also have a really nice ratcheting crimper, and it is a big improvement over the simple plier-style crimper I used in the past. The connectors look like those in your link, but the were off-the-shelf items from the local O'Reilly's. They mostly seemed to work pretty well, although the metal part (that gets crimped) was fairly short, so getting two of the heavier wires (e.g., the ground wires) to fit was a bit of a challenge. ..

I'm hoping we'll get to use the boat a bit more this summer. Last year's flooding on the Mississippi and Illinois rivers and my hand surgery in early September meant only using the boat once all summer.

 

[bruceb58]

Well...crimp connectors are not made for two wires so that is an issue.

 

[JASinIL2006]

Well...crimp connectors are not made for two wires so that is an issue.

Not made for butting together two wires, end to end? Isn’t that sort of their exact purpose?

 

[Grub54891]

End to end yes. Two wires in one end is wrong. That's what we thought two in one end.

 

[bruceb58]

End to end yes. Two wires in one end is wrong. That's what we thought two in one end.

Yep..thought that was what Jasin was saying as well.

To the OP, if you were just using butt connectors with one wire in each end, you likely didn't use the proper sized butt connector. They are sized for different sized wires.

BTW, ratcheting crimpers come in a wide variety of quality. Cheap ratcheting chinese crimpers work poorly. You also want crimpers that are designed for insulated shrink sleeve crimps.

 

[guy48065]

Yep..thought that was what Jasin was saying as well.

To the OP, if you were just using butt connectors with one wire in each end, you likely didn't use the proper sized butt connector. They are sized for different sized wires.

BTW, ratcheting crimpers come in a wide variety of quality. Cheap ratcheting chinese crimpers work poorly. You also want crimpers that are designed for insulated shrink sleeve crimps.

Did you click the link? "PRO-HST Heat Shrink Crimp Tool - Made in America
$146.95" is none of things you warn against.

 

[JASinIL2006]

End to end yes. Two wires in one end is wrong. That's what we thought two in one end.

Ah, I see. Confused the heck out of me... I couldn't imagine what you'd use crimp connectors for if not to connect two wires...

My problem was not with my crimper (I don't know if it's high-end and I don't really care where it was made); for the number of crimps I do, it's great.

I think the problem was the connectors themselves. They were appropriately sized (according to the packaging) for the gauge of the wire, but the metal sleeve (inside the plastic tube) was very short. As a result, there was not much space for the metal sleeve to bite into the wires when crimped. If the wires I was connecting were at the lower end of what the connector was rated for, I could overlap or interweave the abutting ends of the wires inside the crimping area. For heavier wires at the maximum gauge the connectors were supposed to hold, there wasn't enough space inside the metal sleeve to overlap the wire ends. When the stripped wire ends only butted together, the crimped connections weren't that strong. I'm pretty sure the problem was with the connectors, which after looking at others online, seems kind of cheap.

If I get into something like this again, I think I'll order some better connectors online. Where I live, we don't have a ton of options to buy stuff like this locally.

 

[Captain Caveman]

If the butt connector is sized correctly for the wire gauge, it should slide through the metal sleeve so that you can actually see the wire come out the other side. Sometimes there is a metal stopper on the other side of the sleeve. Either way, even if the wire merely makes to to the other end of the sleeve, that should be enough to crimp it tight.

 

[dingbat]

Everything I’ve read said not to drill in the top or bottom because it will weaken the frame more than a hole centered on the side.

That makes no sense. The beam carries the load on the axis vertical to the loading., IE side rail. Reason why they position the tall (stronger) side of the beam vertically.


Having said that, if drilling a 1/2" hole in the center of the wall of a tube causes a failure, I'd question the suitability/ size of the rail long before the hole position.

 

[bruceb58]

Did you click the link? "PRO-HST Heat Shrink Crimp Tool - Made in America
$146.95" is none of things you warn against.

Not only did I click the link...I own one bought from that link. Sometimes it's better to buy once cry once. At least that is my motto with tools, bicycles...

Or...you can buy a piece of junk like this one...https://www.harborfreight.com/electr...ool-63708.html and buy a good one later after you just wasted $15....your choice.