Hard work starting '82 Merc 50?

[pyro225]

Hi Guys,

Some of you have probably seen a load of my other posts, basically i have done a lot of work on the old outboard of late - impeller impeller housing oil, carb teardown new plugs etc.

Anyway i have a couple of issues i need help with,

Firstly its a pull start, and by god it is hard work, the last two time I've tried starting it it will not go - i prime it and must pull about 50 times on both occasions.. It still won't fire so i spray a little easy start in the carb and it fires and dies, then another 10 pulls and a little more easy start finally she starts.

When she's running she runs well no misfires or anything good water pressure etc? really stumped any advise would be great...

I have the throttle in neutral but at WOT at well while doing this...


Seconde problem may not actually be the outboards fault but i have done something twice now and its getting expensive... god know why but after i used the boat on the last two occasions i filled up the fuel tank with oil and petrol ready for the next trip... two weeks later... half the fuel has gone! WTF! its thirsty enough as it is i don't need it drinking fuel while not in use! Any ideas? i have a metal tank with the breather screw on the screw cap not sure if it should be open or closed if that makes a difference?

Thanks

 

[Barnacle_Bill]

What are your exact starting procedures? Vent should be open when using the motor.

 

[Alumarine]

I can't help with the starting problem but I think you might have a fuel leak somewhere. Or maybe someone is helping themselves to your fuel?
I leave my vent open all summer and don't lose any fuel.
My I/O fuel tank is always vented.

 

[pyro225]

Ok fuel fist, it will leave completely open and see how we do!

Now starting procedure from cold...

Prime fuel maybe 6-7 squeezes until rock hard (then maybe one for luck!)
Lift the choke
go to control and move throttle to wot in neutral
start pulling..
rest
pull more
50 pulls later
spray easy star in carbs
10 pulls later a little more easy start
she fires up for a couple of seconds
10 more pulls and a bit more easy start and then she runs like a dream.

Its so spraradic as well.. i did that yesterday morning and yesterday evening i had to do that exact procedure again (annoyingly)

However today (a tiny bit warmer day)

I primed, choked pulled and on the second pull she started??? wtf?

 

[pyro225]

right

kept a log of this
Day 1 - about 50 pulls and easy start needed
Day 2 - about 50 pulls and easy start needed
Day 3 - 2 pulls no easy start needed
Day 4 - 2 pulls no easy start needed
Day 5 - about 50 pulls and easy start needed

I thought it was ok but back to the beginning - any ideas?

 

[pyro225]

Also it does idle pretty rough but runs lovely i have filmed it - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YOHpVpYPug

 

[caliber]

Have you checked the carb bowls. You saying it fires on spray then dies leads me to believe it is having issues getting enough fuel to start. In 50 pulls the engine should be way past flooded. I think you have carb issues I would take them back apart and make sure you assembled them currectly . also re set your needle.

 

[merc850]

Try tilting the motor up and in that position squeeze the primer bulb, gas should come out of the carbs; if not then something is blocking the flow like a bad fuel line or jammed floats.

 

[pyro225]

ok i took them back apart look as good as new - can try again with the tilt up but started raining now - surely it would be an ignition problem if its struggling to start even on easy start? as mentioned it runs really well when going - also i took the carb adjustment screws out when cleaning and screwed them all the way in and it has a dirty idle now - problem i have is i can't get a screwdriver in to the top one to adjust it - any ideas? the adjustment of the bottom one seems to make it stall easier so guessing the top one needs doing

 

[racerone]

????---You have the low speed needles screwed all the way in?--------Those need to be about 1 turn or 1-1/2 turns out from gently seated.---Long screwdriver or a rod made into a screw driver will reach those.

 

[pyro225]

hi racerone - this is the flat head screw on the top of each carb? so start undoing them from one turn each?

 

[racerone]

Post picture as verbal description are not clear !!!!

 

[pyro225]

hi all this problem has got worse and I need it fixing as I put a deposit down on a new boat. I had provisionally sold this to a friend and he was aware it could be a bit hard to start but that once started was good.... small problem now is it wont start!

so, I had her started and running with the cover off at WOT a week or so back ran lovely all was good... it then started to bog down and die. I could run at about 1/4 throttle but that was about it.

It would rev fine in neutral but when I went above 1/4 throttle it bogged down and died.

I then checked the jets etc and when I 'overprime' the fuel leaks ok the carb (and from the screw with a hole in the middle). I then cleaned the jets, changed the plugs, new fuel and went to start it... I must have pulled it 2-300 times even with easy start there was no go it wont fire at all yet it still has compression... any help would be greatly appreciated...

Cheers

 

[racerone]

Not sure why anyone would pull on recoil for 200 times.--There is something wrong with the motor I would say !!!

 

[pyro225]

Like I say sometimes it could take 50 and be fine? Does it sound like stator issues potentially? Have ordered a spark tester

 

[pyro225]

Hi All,

The spark tester arrived today - but on my own trying to look at it while pulling is hard - it didn't appear to work but may try again when its darker...

SO on my lunch hour today as the sun was out I thought id also try a couple of other tests - first swap the cdi units form my working 80 to the 50 (they are the same I checked) no difference and the one from the 50 ran nice in the 80 - ruled that out. Also it wasn't misfiring or it wont start on a few cylinders so unless I'm really unlucky I should be able to rule out the coils. I then got online and thought I'd test the resistance on the stator, so,

First up I put my probes on the red and red/white wires : 67ohms dead with NO Fluctuation... great in the range provided I believe...
Second Blue to Blue/White: this was weird it fluctuated from 80 kohms to 512kohms - which seems waaay to high I tried it about 10 times and it was the same? does this sound like a possible stator issue?

As I have never done this test before I wasn't sure if I was meant to crank it while reading - I wasn't. I also had disconnected the wires from cdi while reading.

What do you think of the above? If you are going to say sounds like a stator would that possibly cause my hard work starting from a while back? also there are two part numbers one for a manual start with just the four wires and one for electric start with the 6 wired (2 go to rectifier for charging battery) could I get the electric start one and buy a rectifier so I could have it trickle charge my battery?

Thanks as usual!

 

[pyro225]

Sorry for multiple posts but...

Its dark here now so thought id do the spark test... it sparks on every cylinder!.. but the stator reading was off (I think) and it still wont start???

Now what :-(

Also tested the trigger shes ok also :-/

 

[emckelvy]

If you're not getting the specified resistance readings on the Low-Speed windings (the blue-blue/wht wires), the stator is shot and needs replacing. A CDI electronics unit is the most reliable replacement. It would certainly explain your problem in starting the motor.

Your flywheel has magnets to charge the ADI windings, it'll do as well with a stator that has the charging coils built-in. Add a rectifier and appropriate connections, and you should be able to charge your battery & run lights, electronics, etc.

 

[pyro225]

hi thanks for your help! just a question whist it looks like the stator is shot is it relevant that I have spark though? should it still fire if it has spark?

 

[pyro225]

Ok, I have just done a compression test which was no easy task on this! I pulled out the plugs, set throttle to fast idle and then I pulled the cord 10 times.

Results:

1:125
2:128
3:110
4:120

How do these look? could they cause any problems?

Also is there a way to check the flywheel key without removing the flywheel - I have read about people looking at castings on the started and the flywheel and checking they align?