Illegal Immigrants

[QC]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Anybody else read Clancy's the Teeth of the Tiger? treedancer's note is precisely what it is about.<br /><br />The guy also wrote about a 747 being flown into the US Capitol. Yes, before 9/11 . . .

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

QC, I do not disagree with dogsdad, but deportation and guarding the border as we are doing it does not work.<br /><br />QC, The fine for working an illegal was $10,000 per violation. It is part of IRS code.<br /><br />QC, You are right, Mexico has haves and have nots and if we do not do something soon that is where we are headed. We must maintain a labor class that has buying power. Labor includes supervisors, middle management, white collar jobs etc. If you are anti-union, what are your feelings on the American Medial Association, Soc. of CPA's, American Bar Association, Association of Insurance Commissioners, Independent Insurance Association, do I need to go on. These are all labor unions.

 

[deputydawg]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

In this part of the country the meat packing industry is the biggest employer of illegals. <br /><br />The INS does raids on all of the plants every few years and cleans them out, they do come down on the companies a little, but no big deal. The illegals will only be deported if they have violated more than 1 criminal law, otherwise they are documented and set free.<br /><br />One packing plant used to be Monfort Meats would hire almost exclusively illegals. Friend of mine that worked there at one time said they would go to Mexico and recruit workers. True or not I don't know.<br /><br />Fact is that they usually work harder for less money and don't complain about anything. Most here will rent a house with 3 or more families. They work opposite shifts, so one is always in bed, one up getting ready for work, one at work. The bed is never empty. <br /><br />Most ilegal workers love it here. They don't complain at all compared to U.S. citizens. In a lot of ways they are model Americans compared to most whining citizens with their hands out. They take the jobs away, but maybe if the American work force would lower their standards, work harder, and complain less they would re-claim their jobs? Maybe not, just an idea to throw out there to ponder.

 

[QC]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

txs,<br /><br />Thanks. BTW, I never said I was anti-union. For the record, I am anti stupid union, whatever that is.

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

QC, I would have to agree on the anti-stupid union, I also agree on anti-politically correct, hell we should say what we mean and clearly as possible.<br /><br />deputydawg, Do they pay taxes and benefits. If not company is hurting us. No benefits mean that medical bills will be paid by you and I. If they furnish workers comp., health benefits and pay taxes, they should be a program to become citizens, and I have no problem with that.<br /><br />You see when many argue that it is not a right to have medical they fail to see that all of us make up the difference. Charity care comes from us whether through cost of goods, charity or taxes.<br /><br />The only ones who gain when taxes are not paid (savings to company), benefits not provided (savings to company) are the company. You and I still pay the difference in charity or taxation.<br /><br />My remarks are not directed to you QC and Deputy but for us all to consider. We always here if a jury pays a verdict it just cost us, welfare cost us, etc. well the secret is if we will just investigate it usually means it lets corps. to get away without paying there share.<br /><br />QC, I apologize on the anti-union remark just had a minor brainfart.

 

[alden135]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

I say we start staffing the oil refineries with illegals. Gas will come back down to .25/gal. <br />I don't use as much lettuce as gasoline.

 

[dogsdad]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Txs, deportation and gaurding the border as we are doing it does not work because the way we are doing it is a joke. I want the Administration and Congress to get serious about this issue...but there are many interests who selfishly benefit from this influx. I'm not holding my breath.<br /><br />I am as conservative as anyone who posts here, but a lot of this "pro-business" crap going on is nothing but a sell-out. Maybe it's time to line up all the lobbyists and shoot them down like the dogs they are.<br /><br />Whoooaaaa...what have I said? I am DOGSDAD. I love dogs! I aplogize to all the canine species for likening lobbyists to them.

 

[bubbakat]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

alden said<br />

I say we start staffing the oil refineries with illegals. Gas will come back down to .25/gal. <br />I don't use as much lettuce as gasoline.<br />

A<br />Capitol idea for sure.

 

[heycods]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Just TWO is that the best you can do TX, Shucks I had more faith in you than that.

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

heycods, help me out here, heck you are the only one that ever reads all my remarks anyway. But those two I think are pretty good.<br /><br />Tax evasion is pretty serious and anyone who hires illegals is breaking a federal law. When is last time you saw a company prosecuted for it??

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

18R, Sanderson farms down this way is chicken people, they pay $7.00 an hour to only those who produce two forms of identification. Then they treat the workers like trash. However, they are never short handed of people trying to hire on.<br /><br />I do not buy Americans will not work for these wages, I just believe that you should be able to support your family on wages you are paid.

 

[heycods]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Originally posted by txswinner:<br /> heycods, help me out here, heck you are the only one that ever reads all my remarks anyway. But those two I think are pretty good.<br /><br />Tax evasion is pretty serious and anyone who hires illegals is breaking a federal law. When is last time you saw a company prosecuted for it??

Im in a good mood, I refuse to be drawn in today. However I will stand back and toss a little gasoline or the fire once and a while, You know just to keep it burning.

 

[18rabbit]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Txw - what I heard from a guy from F.A.I.R. was that illegal alien labor became avialble, they would work for less $$$ and no bennis, so the salary and bennis were pulled down for everyone. Now, US citizen need to compete at the lower wages with no bennis.

 

[deputydawg]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

I was in no way saying it was right to hire illegals, or right for the employers not to have to pay tax on these workers. My opinion is if the citizens of this country would adopt half of the views most of the illegal workers have, and I say illegal WORKERS not the sponges that come here to bleed our sympathy dry, then the illegal workers would not have the oppurtunity they do now.<br />As with all problems we are the product of our own making. I have seen citizens of this country refuse to do work for twice the pay that a migrant illegal worker will do without complaining. If the workers of this country would be more willing to shovel maneur for $15 an hour, then maybe that job would not go to the illegal. I use that job as an example because I used to do it for far less.<br />Check with a factory and see how their job pool looks as far as employement applicants. Most I know who are involved in the hiring process all have the same complaints. Nobody applies. If they do apply they turn down the job when it is offered.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

I'm confused there are some that thought we could secure a boarder around Iraq but those same people think it is impossible to secure our boarder. <br /><br />Unions have their place but they have abused and taken advantage not only of the American consumer but of their membership as well. $86 an hour for a GM worker and we are wondering why they are closing down facilities. <br /><br />American mfg's have used low cost labor and raw materials from china as well as mexican workers to fend off inflation for the past 15 years. The ones who are complaining the loudest are also the demographic that Walmart is targeting. They are their own worst enemy. And who is the government targeting without merit, yep walmart. But if it makes government bigger, so much the better. They don't hire illegals, but hey they got deep pockets and don't support a union so get them in the gunsights.<br /><br />Eventually the immigrants will get on the union bandwagon and cut their own throats. We spend more money on healthcare for illegals (healthcare most citizens can't get), education for illegal's (while programs for citizens are cut) and our prisons are pushing over 20% illegal which is just money wasted, unless you are a lawyer that the cost benefit has to be close to a break even proposition. Mexico not only turns a blind eye but helps assist in illegal immigration. Our liberal mentality prevents us from taking any measures that would have any positive effect cuz it might offend someone. We will never effectively dig out of this. <br /><br />The sad part is the politicans know what to do but are more interested in their own re-election than doing what is best for the country. Welcome to the commune.

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

First off I have seen the pay schedule from the GM plant in Arlington Texas and you are way way off on the $85 per hour. That is fact not something I heard.<br /><br />With that said, if you find high skilled labor rates offensive, how on earth can you support a corp. CEO or other getting $3 to $5 million bonuses when they are losing market share. <br /><br />This is happening and can be found in their income package. I would refuse my salary also if I got that type of money for managing a company into the ground. <br /><br />This not accepting a salary is an old deceptive practice but still works on those who wish to close their eyes to the real financial records.

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

Back to my initial proposition:<br /><br />What would happen if employers were steeply fined for hiring illegals. It is already against the law.<br /><br />Would this deter the illegals from coming.<br /><br />I would permit aliens with work permits and if company hires with no permit or pays no taxes, then a fine is in order. It needs to be large.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

$86 per worker goes for the healthcare plan, retirement plan, hourly wages, vacation, healthcare for the retired workers, 401K matching funds, dental care, prescription coverage, retirement for former workers, higher taxes, unemployment, disability, and on and on. Heck can you imagine how much it costs GM when the union mandates a free day off to vote? But what the heck, its not really extortion. $86 is the REAL cost to GM and the one that affects profitability and growth. You can see what happens to a free market when the government gets involved.<br /><br />3-5 million in compensation is chump change. If they ever want to attract someone to head their company in a direction you approve, then you have to offer this type of compensation. But they are privately held companies, they can pay whoever - whatever they want. How much did the union collect during the same timeframe? There is money wasted.<br /><br />As for your proposition to fine every employer who employs an illegal 10K, I would triple it. They all know what they are doing and they would stop if there was a penalty involved. That would be my second step.

 

[txswinner]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

heycods am I doing any better. Just trying to get rid of the illegals here.

 

[gatorboaterUF]

Re: Illegal Immigrants

My grandfather used to employ and recruit mexicans to work the farm for him. They worked 7 days a week 10 hour day for next to nothing and he gave them free room and bord. they never went out and got drunk or went out and made truble. they just wanted to make money and go back to mexico, then after two years and workin for him and savin they would head back to mexico and live like kings on the money they made. I think for every illigle they find they should ship a welfar tick to mexico.