lower unit

[corzy]

hey guys working on my new 1963 johnson 40 hp electramatic, good news first, i decided to pull the water pump today and see how she looks, had one fin busted off, so glad i pulled it, also the one rubber sleeve that holds one of the water tubes was pretty mangled and plugged off the one side, so really glad i pulled it...
1. the gasket one the cable support door had a tear in it, can i get it on here? part number?
2. also the rubber tube sleeve
3. when i look up waterpump kit, i cant find one for the 63? theres impellers, but i want to change the plate too, had a small bend in the middle where the shaft goes thru, can someone point me to one of those also please?
4. also there is a small round spring inside the waterpump that goes around the shaft, what is it for?

bad, news.
drained the gear oil, very clean, no water (but the last owner could have just changed it to sell it) after i pumped in the oil, i put an extra squeeze in it (not sure if your supposed to or not, i do it so when i put the plug in, the wasted oil isn't missed) after i tightened both screws, i noticed oil leaking from 2 spots, one is a round hole, the other is like a square tab type hole....im guessing this isn't good : ( ... also i noticed a big crack so that made me almost cry hahaha

heres a few pics, let me know what you think i should do....what is the caseing made out of? i can weld, but not a big fan of welding with oil/gas around.....

this is the gasket i need for the side access panel

this is the rubber sleeve for the water tube

what is this small spring for?

oil leaks on LU

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

Hi Corzy,

Marineengine.com has the part catalog for your motor.
On this page http://www.marineengine.com/parts/johnson-evinrude-parts.php?year=1963&hp=40 pick your model number and it will show the part numbers. They might have the parts as well.

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

great thanks peter, looks like that site has the parts im looking for...

now any advise on my lower unit?

and in the 3rd pick i couldn't find that part in the manual (small circle spring around the shaft) just wondering where its supposed to go when i re assemble.

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

ok, so i figure ill use the west system (2 part epoxy...VERY strong stuff) for the crack...now for where the leaks were, #4 pic...could they be caused by overfilling? they stopped leaking well before the level would have been under them...

now my next dummy question, since i didn't note which way the impeller was going, is there a way to tell, other then by the pic in the manual of which way it goes? since its electric clutch driven, its in neutral and if i turn the prop either way, the drive shaft doesn't turn????? oops : (

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

Hi Corzy,

The pics do not show the crack you are talking about.
The casing material is aluminum, and depending on the crack, welding might be better. The epoxy (BTW, I would rather use JB weld) would not give much structural strength. Depending where and how the welding was done, you might need machining work as well. So you might want to see if there is some parts motor (leg) available.
Looks like you need to take the gear case apart, you would have a better understanding of the reason for the leak once it is apart. Could be just bad (lack of) sealing material at the last assembly. The part catalog does not show any gasket there, so probably they use some paste type (Permatex) sealant.
The impeller rotates in the same direction as the motor, and that is easy to find out. Look how the notches on the flywheel for the emergency rope start are!
Also, hopefully you found that missing fin from the old impeller, you do not want that plugging up the coolant passages of the motor!

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

oh boy, well i dont know if i want to be opening up the gearbox just yet, there wasn't any water in the oil, and i did run it in a bucket for a while, so maybe ill try the west system (have you used it? its magic) first, put everything back together, then run it for a while and see if the water starts to seep in.
thats great about the impeller direction, i never even thought of that, thanks!!
as for the crack, you can see it in the 4th pic, its at the front above the front oil leak...(up to the left of it, about 5 inches going up and down)
just wondering if you could tell me what that small round spring is for in pick #3, dont want to put it in the wrong place on reassembly...oh and yes i found the busted blade, checked all the ports and cleaned them so shouldn't be any pluggage, for now anyways : )

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

Hi Corzy,

Now I see the crack! Looks like there was water in that vertical channel where one of the mounting bolts (stud) is, and it cracked the casting during a winter when it froze. That cavity should be sealed away from the rest of the gear case, so if water is in there, it does not get into the gear case. You could seal it up with epoxy, but do not gauge out too much material, that will weaken the casting. I wonder if there is still some water in there? I would want to check it before the next winter! The water could have gotten in there at the same parting line where you have your oil leak, so this is another reason to check if that was sealed correctly! There are "stud gaskets" around those studs to seal that cavity, those could be missing too. Another way water could get in there is from the top, just under the water pump, where the nuts are on those studs. That should be sealed too.

As for the little spring, it could be from a seal (again, it is hard to see from the picture). Seals have a spring around that rubber lip to keep the lip tight against the shaft. According to the parts list there is a seal just above the water pump, that spring is probably from there. If you do not replace that seal, just pop it back onto that rubber lip, there is a groove there for that. If you rebuild the water pump, the kit probably has a new seal.

Yes, you could just seal the crack with epoxy and see how does it do. I would also check the oil after using the motor on the boat, that puts quite a bit of load on the gear case and the leg, unlike running it in a barrel.

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

ok good to know about the crack, thanks...ill check out the shaft seal and see if theres a groove there (there isn't a spring on the parts list that i could find, weird)
ill let you know how i make out!

 

[the machinist]

Re: lower unit

In the 3rd photo asking what the spring is, that is a small coil spring that should be inside the rubber shaft seal putting pressure on the seal lips

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

oh ok thanks machinist, looks like if you look at pic #2 you can see it from the top of the pump housing, i take it it needs to be shuved back up inside the seal on the top of the pump, correct? should this spring be changed? i cant find it on any parts lists, and when i look up water pump kit, there isn't any for a 63 40hp, so i just ordered an impeller/plate.
i was also going to ask about my oil leaks again, the one on the right of the pic, looks like it comes from a screwdriver hole used to pry the gear case away from the upper lower unit. but the one on the right is just like a hole? or is that supposed to be a set screw or something? can the hole be plugged, or is it needed?
thanks again

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

ok good to know about the crack, thanks...ill check out the shaft seal and see if theres a groove there (there isn't a spring on the parts list that i could find, weird)
ill let you know how i make out!

The spring is an integral part of the seal, so it will not show up separately. It is also easy to knock it out, but can be put back without any trouble.

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

oh i see, that makes sense, so i can pull it out and put it back in no problem? or do you think the seal is shot, or at least the spring? wonder if i can change my order before it ships to add it...
thanks

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

the answer is no. so ill have to pay the $10 shipping for the extra $12 part. unless you think i can just re use the old one (but i would guess no, since the spring came out, it must be streached..no?)

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

oh i see, that makes sense, so i can pull it out and put it back in no problem? or do you think the seal is shot, or at least the spring?
...

Hi Corzy,

You can check if the seal is still good enough to use. Look at the rubber lip. how hardened is the material? Is it cracked? Test fit the shaft, how does it fit? Is it too loose?
Is the spring loose on the rubber lip? The spring does not stretch from use, only from mishandling (if it got caught on something).
If the seal is on the upper side of the water pump (that is how it looks from the picture), I would not worry about it too much, it only seals the raw water from the chamber where the exhaust and spent coolant is ejected.
If the seal is on the shaft below the water pump, then it separates the pump water from the gear case which is filled with oil. I would not want a bad seal there, water could get into the gear case.

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

ok ill check it out again tonight Peter, its the seal on top, so if you dont think its too bad maybe ill try and re use it...but im pretty sure the spring is no good (why else would it have come apart from the seal right?)
i can get one for 20 bucks at the local marine engine place, aftermarket...the ones online are 12 bucks but they wouldn't let me add to my order so have to pay 10 for shipping again, eventhough i called the morning after i ordered my other stuff...(since they wouldn't wave the shipping, i think ill just support the local place on this one)
lets hope after the 80 bucks in parts that the gear shifter switch works....im pretty nervous about that. real expensive part.
thanks again Peter

 

[orbanp]

Re: lower unit

Hi Corzy,

Measure the shaft diameter with a caliper where the seal is, measure the diameter of the hole where the seal sits in the water pump cover. Chances are that it is a standard seal (you can check that on the internet) and then you can get it at any bearing retail place probably for about a quarter of the price. If it is non-standard then you are stuck with the dealer.
If the electric switch for the gearshift is shot, you can probably jury-rig one up, you do not need the expensive factory switch. I recall seeing a thread about this.

Peter

 

[corzy]

Re: lower unit

OK, well i think ill just bite the bullet on the seal since i want to get everything together before the weekend and my impeller/ignition are in already, and there isn't any bearing places near us (canada eh!!) hahaha

as for the shifter, i was going to start a new thread, but maybe you know, i pulled it appart again last night just to look at it, the switch is there, (havent tried to see if it works yet or not) there is also a small shift leaver but the handle is busted, so im going to fab up a new one (cant find one online) when i was playing with the throttle cable, the plastic end was loose, and it seems that the smaller lever pushes the throttle cable back, without pushing the main lever into fwd or rev, so i take it this is how you start the ol girl in neutral, correct?
so when i get my ignition, for wiring purposes, i take the green and blue wires on the shifter and run them straight back to the motor and connect them to the green and blue that goe down to the gear case (forward/reverse) then the other line on the shifter i wire up to one of the ignition terminals (i guess start would go to starter solenoid, then maybe on would be to the shifter?) but how is the shifter grounded? and is there supposed to be a fuse inline with the power...i really dont want to blow the switch if it works and have to rig up something,
ive never worked with one of these fancy electramatic shifters before, hopefully i can figure it out, but havent gotten it to feel right when on the motor yet...perhaps pics to fallow this weekend
thanks again.