Newbie with gel coat ?

[Woodonglass]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

The product you are using should be fine. Not sure if it will be enough but as you say you can always get more.
ondarvr is telling you correctly ^^^. Pay close attention to his guidance.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

YD, pease explain to all of us why PVA will not work when used on a laminate to create a tack free surface, in detail, the chemistry of it, and any other reason you feel it may not work.

I might be a little Old school . .. but PVA Is only used for topping off some gel patches .. or even full gel sprays ..

But in lams I dont think its used ( or at least non that I can think of ).

You may have a better Idea of what the chemistry makeup for PVA .. but I Know that you dont use it on lams.

But what condition would you possibly think of to use PVA over a raw lam ?? I dunno .. I normally have to fair and apply a top coat of some kind ( like gel ). However .. if your doing a compartment inside a boat .. I guess one Could spray PVA ( its not typical to brush PVA ) .. but its not typical .. therefore the use of PVA should not be thrown around like a 'cure for tack free' thing.

PVA is applied for mold release or for a top agent in gel repairs .. I Dont think its a good idea for between lams.

Why is another story .. but you should know that.

YD.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

YD, you seem to mix and match situations and not answer the exact question, then add all sorts of unrelated stuff to muddy the subject. If you don't want to discuss these things in depth, then don’t nit pick my posts with comments that don't make sense. I have no problem with discussing every one of the nuanced aspects of using resin and gel coat in great detail, I do it for a living every day.

Please keep my responses in the context of the thread and question I'm answering, don't expand them to other situations where it may not make sense.

As I said before, wax is the primary product used to seal the surface of any polyester, gel coat or resin, you said wax and PVA were old school and listed other items. The problem is all but one of these other items contain wax, that one uses a resin that does the same thing, you said they wouldn't harm the bond of the next layer, they all can create a poor bond if the surface isn't cleaned and sanded properly.

Then you called me out and said PVA couldn't be used on the back side of a laminate to create a tack free surface when I said it would work. It will work fine, it may not be the best way to do it only because it's not that convenient, which is why PVA isn't used more often in any application where you want a tack free surface. I said this in my post, PVA is used, but wax is used more often.

Again, if you want to discuss this stuff, or disagree with me that’s fine, I’ll present my side and you can do the same with yours, but don’t start insulting people just because the facts they supply may not agree with your opinion.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Why not just suggest that wax or PVA is for final topcoat ONLY ? Its that simple.

There is NO reason to wax or anything else until the final coat.

But Im done. No more answers or questions ..

YD.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

You really don't have a clue do you.

Nobody ever said it was going to be used on anything except the final layer to create a tack free surface.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Sorry to the OP for taking this thread sideways, now back to our regularly scheduled program.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

You can use webbing solution to make a random pattern that will hide a great deal of ugly if you want. It does require spraying to get a good pattern though.

Webbing solution? Could you elaborate? what would th efinal texture, color, look be? any special equipment needed?
As I stated early in this thread, I am looking for that smooth, clean factory look. It may be difficult to get with what I'm working with, but that is my goal. Not sure why, but I just think the look of all gel coated floor and sides looks sleek and simple.

Sorry to the OP for taking this thread sideways, now back to our regularly scheduled program.

No problem, I actually learn more things by the banter and different opinions/ thoughts.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

I have another ? for the great minds.
If you remember I asked about the wood backrest/ seat cushion area at the rear bench seat. It is painted wood that was covered with carpet. My initial thought was to gel it. However, after sanding it and getting some input from DeepBlue, I think I will be replacing it next year. So now I am thinking of just painting it.
Along with this, there is an area up under the console, where your feet go, that i have concerns about. The glassing only goes up a few inches from the floor. This area was also covered in carpet.
My thought is painting these two areas with a white paint instead of gel coat. I want to make it good and look finished, but just not sure if gelling is the correct approach since it is not glassed over. Will gel coat work? Should I cover with paint? If paint, any thing in particular I should use?

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Gel coat won't hold up well when used by itself over wood, so paint is better. Paint isn't going to protect it all that well from water though, so don't expect it to last very long if it's cover by wet carpet. Epoxy works much better to protect wood from water.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Webbing solution is what was used by many boat builders to camouflage unsightly areas of raw glass ( the back side that is rough). It is mixed with a contrasting color of gel coat and then sprayed on the surface (the surface had already been sprayed with one solid color), depending on how you adjust the gun it comes out in long strings that randomly land on the surface and create an effect that doesn’t allow your eye to focus well on the surface to detect small (sometimes large) defects. It is not normally used in a mold surface application like you are trying to reproduce though.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Gel coat won't hold up well when used by itself over wood, so paint is better. Paint isn't going to protect it all that well from water though, so don't expect it to last very long if it's cover by wet carpet. Epoxy works much better to protect wood from water.

Thanks, I didn't think gel over wood would work.
As for the backrest area, I think paint will be ok. Like I said I will probably replace next year. It is a vertical surface so what water hits it should roll off. It is only approx. 2' X 1'. So not a big area.
For the under console area. It appears the wood is covered with resin( or something). I am thinking just painting it so it looks better.
What paint would be best for these applications?

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Webbing solution is what was used by many boat builders to camouflage unsightly areas of raw glass ( the back side that is rough). It is mixed with a contrasting color of gel coat and then sprayed on the surface (the surface had already been sprayed with one solid color), depending on how you adjust the gun it comes out in long strings that randomly land on the surface and create an effect that doesn’t allow your eye to focus well on the surface to detect small (sometimes large) defects. It is not normally used in a mold surface application like you are trying to reproduce though.

Can this process be done after gel? If I roll on the gel and decide I don't like the results, can I do webbing later? Is this something I can buy for one time use, or do I need to buy additional equipment to apply?

 

[jbcurt00]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Zolatone......

It's also a splatter effect that hides the texture of fiberglass and was (is??) a popular finish in boats. It can be replicated in paint via a paint brush & a stick, or a toothbrush & your thumb. A little paint on the brush & tap brush to stick or stick to paint brush (try both ways), and it flicks the paint in a splatter pattern. A little paint on the toothbrush, and flick the bristles with your thumb. Either way, change the height you are from the work, the angle of the brush relative to what your splattering, and change the force used to flick the paint and the pattern will change & look more random.

Using a couple different contrasting colors increases the 'hide' factor.....

If you wanted to apply a couple layers of resin & fiberglass to the plywood areas you want to use gel, you could then use gel.........

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Can this process be done after gel? If I roll on the gel and decide I don't like the results, can I do webbing later? Is this something I can buy for one time use, or do I need to buy additional equipment to apply?

Nope .. you have to do this basically with your gel apps.

Its just an additive that turns your gelcoat into Snot so when it comes out of the spray gun its quagulated . You just kinda spray every which direction in an uneven pattern. Think of it like 'silly spray' kinda stuff.

Good for lockers and such .. but if you want a shine finish then this is not something you want to use.

YD.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?


Long time since an update. Been busy with many other things. Finally had a chance to get some work done. It's starting to get warm here, and the desire to get out on the water is big. So I made some progress. Got the first coat of gel down. I know it's still early, but I am hoping it turns out ok. I like the look of all white floor, just hope my work is good enough.

 

[DeepBlue2010]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

Good to hear from you M8. Looks good, keep going.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

I have got a second coat on. It's starting to look better, but I have a question.
What is the best method to deal,with the orange peel? I am planning on doing at least one more coat, if not 2 or 3. The orange peel is noticeable. Do I sand it down now or apply more coats then sand the finished coat?
Thanks for the help.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

I have got a second coat on. It's starting to look better, but I have a question.
What is the best method to deal,with the orange peel? I am planning on doing at least one more coat, if not 2 or 3. The orange peel is noticeable. Do I sand it down now or apply more coats then sand the finished coat?
Thanks for the help.

Go back to post #60 it was explained there. If you sand it now the next rolled coat will leave the same orange peel surface.

 

[zool]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?

I agree with the skim coat method, save yourself a world of hurt, plus save gel and paper.....you wont want to reduce your film guage too much trying to block out heavy peel with 2-3 coats. Just take off much of what you spread on, to avoid high spots.

 

[Slayer315]

Re: Newbie with gel coat ?


Did a little more work today. 3 base coats down, then squeegee'd a waxed coat. Not sure how well it will turn out. As hard as I tried, I could not get the lines out caused by the edge of the squeegee.
Now a ?. I am planning to sand to even out then apply another coat. Then sand and even out again. Is this correct? Also after last sanding, I was going to buff. What do I buff with?