overheating

[Bondo]

Re: overheating

and just for you HARLEYMAN, if i had the correct parts, they would have been fitted, likewise if someone on this site had the knowledge to know exactly what was needed in a ford cooling system and stated that, then that is what would be fitted, but all i have received is a comment like "cobbled together" or "fit the original parts" well if i knew what the original parts were that would have been helpful, now i have Bondo telling me that the original parts won't work with center riser manifolds, so you want me to buy log manifolds at nearly $800.00 by the time i ship them and that doesn't include the risers or the end plates?

not to offend anyone, but it would seem that i didn't need a seaman, a supreme mariner, a master shipwright or any kind of petty officer, what i needed was an engineer, oh, i am one, that is why i have arrived at the solution without any constructive help from this site! pitty really, and i thought this site would have been the place for information and knowledge but all i got was people telling me how wrong it was and no information on how to put it right.

Ayuh,... Which is WHY, everybody since Ed in post #2 has been askin' for Pictures, to see what you've got to work with, 'n what ya need to replace,....

Nobody here, regardless of rankin' has a Crystal Ball,...

We can't help you, if you don't help Us,....

 

[john hennessy]

Re: overheating

if someone is by description an expert, then they should know what should be there to make the system work, without a picture of what should not be there.

how many parts are there to a marine cooling system, i told you guys in the begining that i had center rise manifolds, the only other parts are a thermostat housing and a circulating pump, the circulating pump is only one type, it just needed someone to step up and say you need one of these thermostat housings or an alternative due to the center riser manifolds and how to run the pipework.

all the pictures did was worsen the situation with comments like "cobbled together", well i told you it was rudimentry at the start, and to an expert, that should have raised a red flag.

i knew what i had was not right, why else would i be asking for help on this forum, but all i got was people telling me it was wrong, not how to put it right.

there are only two options for exhaust manifolds, log and center risers, there are only two choices for thermostat housings the barr fm 29-0083 and the two piece mercruiser manifold that will work because the hose routing is critical to the function of the system and the thermostat housing controls all the hose routing so must be the starting point, the next thing is the risers, or to be more presice, wether there is a block off separator plate or not, that will dictate the use of a barr housing or a mercruiser housing.

once the correct thermostat housing is established, the plumbing is self explanitory and nothing else will work.

 

[Bondo]

Re: overheating

if someone is by description an expert, then they should know what should be there to make the system work, without a picture of what should not be there.

how many parts are there to a marine cooling system, i told you guys in the begining that i had center rise manifolds, the only other parts are a thermostat housing and a circulating pump, the circulating pump is only one type, it just needed someone to step up and say you need one of these thermostat housings or an alternative due to the center riser manifolds and how to run the pipework.

all the pictures did was worsen the situation with comments like "cobbled together", well i told you it was rudimentry at the start, and to an expert, that should have raised a red flag.

i knew what i had was not right, why else would i be asking for help on this forum, but all i got was people telling me it was wrong, not how to put it right.

there are only two options for exhaust manifolds, log and center risers, there are only two choices for thermostat housings the barr fm 29-0083 and the two piece mercruiser manifold that will work because the hose routing is critical to the function of the system and the thermostat housing controls all the hose routing so must be the starting point, the next thing is the risers, or to be more presice, wether there is a block off separator plate or not, that will dictate the use of a barr housing or a mercruiser housing.

once the correct thermostat housing is established, the plumbing is self explanitory and nothing else will work.

Ayuh,.... Nobody here has ever claimed to be an Expert,....
We're just Boaters, 'n some of us are Mechanics as well,....

Merc never ran center riser manifolds on a Ford motor, so the Merc t-stat housin' is of No help,...
I have No clue what this Barr t-stat housin' looks like, muchless what it's designed to do,....
nor what it's supposed to fit,...

OMC, 'n Volvo once used the center riser manifolds, on Ford motors, so a OMC or Volvo t-stat housin', 'n plumbin' diagram might give you satisfactory results,...
But,....
From what little I can see, yer intake manifold, won't accept the t-stat housin' ya Need,...

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

...i knew what i had was not right, why else would i be asking for help on this forum, but all i got was people telling me it was wrong, not how to put it right.....

How can we help you to put it right if you don't give us the FULL picture (literally and metaphorically) of what you have.

If the advise you want is to pull the thermostat housing off and get a different one, then there, you have it!

In the opening post you stated you had little money. And since that you have offered us very little with which to help you with. You won't tell us who the OEM is of the engine, you won't give us pictures of the entire thing (and I'm wondering why)... And now you are abusing us for 'not helping you'.... Really????

So, in order to help you I will ask for the following information...
1. Pictures of the full engine. (Absolutely mandatory. This discussion will go no further until you have done that...)
2. Whose engine is that? Yes, we know it's a Ford 302, but who supplied it as a marine engine in the first place? Volvo, Mercruiser, other....
3. What brand is the thermostat housing on the engine currently, and also that of the manifolds.

Chris.......

 

[john hennessy]

Re: overheating

 

[john hennessy]

Re: overheating

 

[john hennessy]

Re: overheating

here are some pictures as requested, the origin of the motor is unknown, the exhaust manifolds are Osco, there are no markings on the thermostat housing at all but it is made of brass, the engine mounting are mercruiser as is the iron timing cover.

the control mounting is mercruiser as is the electrical plug on the top of the engine.

the picture of the thermostat housing i will be fitting is shown above.

the price of the mercruiser housing is prohibitive, as you can see, over $300.00 and it has to be used with the log manifolds and a separator plate with no coolant ports in it. the manifolds as needed with the mercruiser thermostat housing are shown here and are over $300.00 each plus end caps at $50.00 plus each and separator plates at $11.00 each plus the risers at $80.00 each.

that means that by the time i convert it to a mercruiser 888, i will have about $1000.00 in it and some of the shaped hoses are no longer available.

i do not consider this a viable option.

 

[alldodge]

Re: overheating

Hey have a look at this link, it has parts for a 302 Ford and a thermostat housing which makes room for the extra hoses and plumbing needed. Not 100 percent sure but sure appears to have possibilities.

http://www.mercruiserparts.com/Show...c=THERMOSTAT+HOUSING,+COVER+AND+EXHAUST+ELBOW

Stat housing part no 889333 (item 1)
Cover for Stat housing part number 59498A1 (item 7)

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

Hey have a look at this link, it has parts for a 302 Ford and a thermostat housing which makes room for the extra hoses and plumbing needed. Not 100 percent sure but sure appears to have possibilities.

http://www.mercruiserparts.com/Show...c=THERMOSTAT+HOUSING,+COVER+AND+EXHAUST+ELBOW

Stat housing part no 889333 (item 1)
Cover for Stat housing part number 59498A1 (item 7)

Unfortunately they won't work AD... He has centre rise manifolds with only the single connection at the bottom (front) of them (and I have no idea what/why there is a cross hose between the elbows. It does absolutely nothing). He/we are going to have to design a custom system for this engine, as it is so 'non-standard' nothing in the 'usual' range will work.

Give me a bit of time and I'll try and design something for you...

Chris.....

 

[Bondo]

Re: overheating

Unfortunately they won't work AD... He has centre rise manifolds with only the single connection at the bottom of them (and I have no idea what/why there is a cross hose between the elbows. It does absolutely nothing). He/we are going to have to design a custom system for this engine, as it is so 'non-standard' nothing in the 'usual' range will work.

Give me a bit of time and I'll try and design something for you...

Chris.....

Ayuh,... I'm still thinkin' a Volvo/ OMC T-stat Housin' is gonna be the basis for that Custom system,....

Have to find some parts listin's, 'n start checkin',...

The 1 in the link has too many exits,....

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

ok.. Here's the best I can do (unfortunately it is a little messy, but it will have the system working properly)... Currently I suspect that 'thermostat cover' on the engine is just a cover, no thermostat in it...

If you buy the Mercruiser thermostat, base and cover then just put a hose loop between the 'to manifold' (on the base) and 'from manifold' (on the cover) and run the 'to elbow' (on the cover) to the bottom of you manifolds, that should work. You will of course need to fit the correct 'thermostat base to water pump hose' and move the inlet from the drive up to the thermostat housing base.

And get rid of that cross-hose from elbow to elbow... Just plug the ports in the elbows...

Do you have a copy of the water flow diagram for that engine as standard Mercruiser?

Chris......

New/second hand parts you need.

Mercruiser t-housing base
Mercruiser t-housing cover
Thermostat
Water pump hose.
Gaskets
T-housing to manifold hoses.
T-housing 'loop' hoses.

 

[alldodge]

Re: overheating

View attachment 217486

Agree, jumped the gun on the Stat but the Housing in the pick will fit the 302 Ford. I'm thinking 4 ports are needed and the Barr one will fit and supply the needed spots. Run the hoses like the GM model here



Plug up the ports going from port to starboard then use thru water passages from manifold to riser. Only other item needed other then the hoses is to pipe to hose adapters to screw into the Barr Stat housing.

What do you think guys, or am I way off

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

Ayuh,... I'm still thinkin' a Volvo/ OMC T-stat Housin' is gonna be the basis for that Custom system,....

Have to find some parts listin's, 'n start checkin',...

The 1 in the link has too many exits,....

You're right, an OMC thermostat housing and base has only the one outlet for the manifold (one each side), but the parts are NLA ex OMC (no surprise there!)...

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

Agree, jumped the gun on the Stat but the Housing in the pick will fit the 302 Ford. I'm thinking 4 ports are needed and the Barr one will fit and supply the needed spots. Run the hoses like the GM model here

View attachment 217488

Plug up the ports going from port to starboard then use thru water passages from manifold to riser. Only other item needed other then the hoses is to pipe to hose adapters to screw into the Barr Stat housing.

What do you think guys, or am I way off

I tried looking up that part, but couldn't find anything about it other than 'Ford 302 thermostat housing'... No mention of it being used with centre rise manifolds or log, but if it works like the latest style Mercruiser unit for the GMs, then yes, a perfect solution.... The Mercruiser Ford t-housings are quite 'ouch' price-wise.

 

[84EdH]

Re: overheating

Check these links, maybe it will help?BARR MC-29-62898 THERMOSTAT HOUSING COVER, FORD

BARR MC-29-63588 LOWER THERMOSTAT HOUSING, FORD

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

Check these links, maybe it will help?BARR MC-29-62898 THERMOSTAT HOUSING COVER, FORD

BARR MC-29-63588 LOWER THERMOSTAT HOUSING, FORD

They would work perfectly as the Mercruiser replacements. And use the hose loops I suggested in post #31...

Nice find Ed....

 

[alldodge]

Re: overheating

Ed that looks like the ones I first posted and has to many ports.

Unable to find what the back side of the housing looks like but did find these links.
Housing | Thermostat | Ford 302 5.0L | 351 5.8L V8 | 0.75"

http://www.go2marine.com/docs/mfr/barr/barr_81.pdf

 

[84EdH]

Re: overheating

Dodge, the lower housing on the one on my link has three hose connections....the one in the old mercruiser part diagram shows 4 (set up for log style manifold)

 

[alldodge]

Re: overheating

Dodge, the lower housing on the one on my link has three hose connections....the one in the old mercruiser part diagram shows 4 (set up for log style manifold)

Your probably right but I have been unable to find a pic or drawing showing all sides. In short if the OP's original Barr Stat was used it has 4 ports and can close off the hose between the two manifolds. If the ones you listed are used there is at least 5 ports which would require a loop hose, right?

 

[achris]

Re: overheating

Your probably right but I have been unable to find a pic or drawing showing all sides. In short if the OP's original Barr Stat was used it has 4 ports and can close off the hose between the two manifolds. If the ones you listed are used there is at least 5 ports which would require a loop hose, right?

Manifolds? Do you mean the elbows?