please help a boat dummy

[work in progress]

I'll make this as brief as possible. A month ago I took my almost 4 yr old son fishing on a friends boat. He loved it, and now that's all he wants to do. I have never owned a boat and have very little time around them. With minimal research, and consideration of the fact I can't really afford a boat, I went and bought a new 14ft Carolina Skiff with a new 25hp two stroke Yamaha. Why new on a buget you ask--4 year old in the boat I answer. On to my problems. With my son in the boat it planes in 5 seconds, and although I have no way to check it I would say top speed is 20-25mph. I took a friend with us the other day (friend 175lbs, me 175,lbs, son 35 lbs) and the little boat will barely get on plane, although once on plane top speed seems to be about the same. Two problems, not enough room on the boat and short on power to get on plane. I found a j16 Carolina Skiff for $1000 ($500 less than the dealer wants) that is new except for a 6 month layer of dust. I like the setup of the j14 and think the j16 would work well. The boat dealer, and anyone else I talk to say the 25hp 2 stroke should be plenty of power for the j14 or j16. I want to buy the j16 hull and swap everything from the 14 to the 16, then sell the bare 14 hull, but I don't want to go through all that and still have a boat way short on power. There is the history, now on to my questions, and if I say something stupid please correct me as I am in over my head when it comes to boating.

What can I do to get more out of the motor. I don't know a lot of the necessary info (rpm @ WOT, prop specs, etc...) so I'm hoping to find someone with experience on a similar set-up. Before I start buying stuff, I have ordered an inexpensive portable tachometer so I can start compiling useful info. The cavitation plate is approximately 1/2" below the hull (mfg. specs say flush to 1". I have tried all 5 tilt pin positions, and currently have it in the third hole, which has the motor right in level with the hull.

I have run across some automatic trim tabs (nitrogen gas filled shocks-resistance operated) that claim to help for about $150. What about a hydrofoil?

My basic understanding of props is this. It's a tradeoff between torque (holeshot) and top end. I am really hesitant to give up much top end, although that is irrelevant if I can't get the boat up out of the water. How about a prop lesson from someone. I currently have on the stock aluminum prop. I have heard about stainless steel props, adjustable (modular I think) props, ventilated props, and so on, and frankly I don't know what does what.

If I can make what I have work with just a j16 hull, I will be satisfied. If I have to start buying bigger engines I may have to sell the whole rig to pay for my divorce attorney. Any input will be appreciated.

 

[RWilson2526]

Re: please help a boat dummy

I'm sure others will chime in about efffectiveness of trim tabs and such but it seems that if you are not happy with the power on a 14', putting the same engine on a 16' sounds like a recipe for unhapiness. Did you try moving your friend around a little bit from the front of the boat to the middle or vice versa. I had a 14' grumman with a 15 hp and moving my wife and son around a little really changed things.

 

[OhWellcraft]

Re: please help a boat dummy

I would agree with the above, while two more feet of boat doesn't sound like a lot it is. If the 14 is borderline on power the 16 will for sure be under powered. The trim tabs will help, I would go those over the foil. I have not heard good things about foils(more torque on transom and lower end of motor) are just a few. What is the max horsepower the 16' hull is rated for? The yellow plate will tell you I would go for the max horsepower that the hull is rated for. You can always back off a bit on the throttle if you are not comfortable with the speed, but you can't add more. Props can also make a big difference in performance. I would try to find some place that will demo props even if it cost you $25.00 or so for a few different ones at least your not buying something that you won't ever use. Also say the hull is rated for 40 horse would it be possible to find an older 40 to buy cheap as the main motor and use the 25 as a kicker(trolling motor) that way you would at least have the reliability of the newer motor. If the older one gave you troubles, I too have kids and like the fact that I have a backup if my main motor won't get me back. The 25 on a 16' hull just doesn't sound like it will do what you want it to but only you can say for sure. I have a 235 hp on a 19.6' wellcraft(max rated size) it goes pretty well but even at that I'm not setting any speed records. Good luck and I'm sure someone has a similar setup and can better inform you on what to do...

 

[Mark42]

Re: please help a boat dummy

Modifying outboards for more power doesn't work well unless you are into serious racing.

If the current setup does not fit your needs, the least expensive way to get what you want is to sell the existing boat and buy a larger boat with a larger motor.

Talk to the dealer about trading in what you have and what he can do for you.

I agree that the 16' boat will need upwards around 40hp to make it do what you want. Just for reference, the boat in my signature below is 14' and has a 40hp that pushes it to 28mph with top up and two or three people. Full load of people and gear will drag it down to 25 to 27. Empty with just me it does 30.

 

[Bigprairie1]

Re: please help a boat dummy

Modifying outboards for more power doesn't work well unless you are into serious racing.

If the current setup does not fit your needs, the least expensive way to get what you want is to sell the existing boat and buy a larger boat with a larger motor.

Talk to the dealer about trading in what you have and what he can do for you.

I agree that the 16' boat will need upwards around 40hp to make it do what you want. Just for reference, the boat in my signature below is 14' and has a 40hp that pushes it to 28mph with top up and two or three people. Full load of people and gear will drag it down to 25 to 27. Empty with just me it does 30.

I would agree with this. Simply sell the boat or trade up and resize. There are so many boats out there this should not be too difficult. Switching motors, yada, yada will hardly prove worth it or overly useful for what you are trying to achieve.
Target a larger boat with larger power. If you are astute in the way you approach and give yourself a reasonable (patient) time line you will probably come out just fine financially....perhaps with no difference.
Good Luck

 

[beerfilter]

Re: please help a boat dummy

All good advice .
A repower to 35 hp (check your boat rating first !) might help with the power problem .
Unfortunately , you still have that space problem .

If you plan on fishing comfortably , with 3 or more people , you should be looking for a 16' - 18' rig , and a 50 - 75hp motor .
Since you allready have a nice new rig , you might consider talking to your dealer and trading up for a larger rig .
You might get lucky and find a newer used rig taken in trade , for not much more than you paid for your current rig .

Or sell it outright , find a project hull that suits your needs , a trailer to match , and , outfit it the EXACT way you want it .
You can get serviceable old hulls for a song , sometimes less .
Spend the big bills on the power plant and the acessories .
I promise you will not regret it .

My current rig is a 12' tinny vee with a 9.9 Merc .
A little too small for 2 people , but almost perfect for 1 person .
Goes ~ 30 mph with just me at the tiller , but , slows down quick when more weight is added .
I really want a larger rig , but , I can wait for the perfect deal to come along .

I got the boat for free , the trailer for cheap .
I stripped the trailer and completely refurbished it .
The boat is 90% complete , just needs some new wood for the transom ( not bad , just looking that way..) .

Good luck , whatever way you decide to go .

 

[Dakota47]

Re: please help a boat dummy

You want at least a 60hp motor, I would go bigger.. nothing wrong with a 16-17 footer with a 75-115hp motor..

 

[roscoe]

Re: please help a boat dummy

j16 will need 35-40 hp to perform as expected.

Although the capacity is for more people, none of these boats are going to be set up right to fish with more than 2 people.

Perhaps it is time to seriously consider upsizing, into a used boat that is more suitable for 3 people fishing.

A nice older 16.5-17.5 aluminum hull, with a newer outboard of suitable size.