Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Hello fellow boaters! I would like some input and some pro's and cons and maybe even a real life experience to help me decide how to solve my problem.<br /><br />My wife and I have been happy boaters for about 10 years. During that time we always had the same boat - an older 19' Four Winns with a 305 engine & Merc Cruiser outdrive. Boat had a Stingray hydrofoil and always ran great - no problems. <br /><br />We recently upscaled to a 21' Mariah with the 350 (5.7)engine and volvo penta dual prop outdrive. This boat had a smaller stingray hydrofoil on it when we got it. We boated for a while - just me and her - and it was great. Boat rode great - came out of the water quick - ran about 55mph (by the speedo!) and was always a great ride even in rough water. We did notice that sometimes it had a slight tendency to "lean" one way ot the other slightly when catching a wake from a boat in front of us - but it was just a little lean and nothing I couldn't live with.<br /><br />Last weekend we had our first outing with more people in the boat - 4 teenagers + my wife and I and it was a whole new experience. For starters as soon as we left the no wake zone the boat came up and was leaning off to the side - and people were jumping from side to side to try and level it out didn't seem to make a lot of difference. And the leaning would vary from side to side as the day went on - you never knew which way till it came up out of the water and then sometimes it would change.<br /><br />I did find that if I trimed the motor back up it would plane back out straight - but when I did - all my steering went away and it was like steering on ice. The boat also had a real nasty habit of trying to "dive" into turns basically leaning so far over I thought it was going to flip someone out in the water. This boat is bigger than my olde one - and I used to carry a lot more load in the old all the time so I don't think it was overloaded by any means at all.<br /><br />I have been researching your forum and decided the hydrofoil has to go - it worked fine on my other boat - but doesn't like this one at all for whatever reason. <br /><br />Which is better - Smart Tabs or something like the Bennett Trim Tabs? I like the idea of Smart Tabs hands free operation - when my kids are skiing I have my hands full just trying to steer and work the throttle. I also like the idea of being able to trim out one side or the other manually with the Bennett Tabs. <br /><br />Pros? Cons? Experiences with either? <br /><br />Any help would be appreciated.
 

nrladeere

Seaman
Joined
Jul 28, 2002
Messages
60
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

I just installed the Smart Tabs on my 21' Chris Craft. In short the improvement in hole shot, ride quality and handling is remarkable. I would highly recommend them on a similar boat.
 

navigator336

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
Messages
270
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

I'd try running it without the hydrofoil. It may be just fine with nothing extra.
 

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Did you have a couple of people sitting up on the bow area. And by doing so bring the bow lower than you usually do?
 

Peter1959628

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Oct 28, 2003
Messages
91
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

I bought smart trim tabs for my 20ft Mariah with a 4.3l. The foil i took off.<br />I wrote a report on this forum and would highly recommend them.<br />You could do a search of posts by myself as i cannot remember the title of the post.<br />Fitting was an absolute breeze.
 

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Yes I had two people in the bow - probably a combined wight of around 250lbs for both.<br /><br />Should be nothing for a 21' boat though.
 

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Hey Peter - how does your boat back now? I have heard that the Smart tabs can make the backing a little nutsy since they are always deployed at slow speeds - acting like big brakes.<br /><br />Good /bad - no difference?
 

Boatist

Rear Admiral
Joined
Apr 22, 2002
Messages
4,552
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill<br />I am a fisherman not a skier and have the bennett trim tabs. I love then and will alway have adjustable trim tabs. It give you total control of the boat in any condition, waves, wind, load. In your case the down side may be that you will need to adjust. My boat a 21 Foot Aluminum runabout with a strong cross wind will always lean into the wind. If you correct it to run flat with the wind from port and turn with wind to starboard you will need to readjust to be flat again. You could just adjust your bow height and not adjust side to side and it would be just like the smart tabs except your can adjust the bow height for difference speeds. If you pulling a tube or a board instead of skies and running at much lower speeds you can still control your bow height. Smart tabs you would need to trim your motor but not have as much control. Still you will never have to adjust your smart tabs. Howerever you set it up is the way it will be.<br />Like I said I am mostly a fisherman and with the adjustable tabs can adjust for the best safe ride in any condition.
 

LadyFish

Admiral
Joined
Mar 18, 2003
Messages
6,894
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

We installed Smart Tabs about 3 months ago and coudn't be happier. We have a 21' Wellcraft CC with a 150 Johnson.<br /><br />The boat planes off in 3 seconds, no chine walking, handles better in rough water. All in all I don't know how we lived so long without them.<br /><br />We highly recommend them.
 

Jdeagro

iboats.com Partner
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
1,682
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill<br /><br />We have printed up a Tech booklet "Boat Balance & Performance) which addresses your handling issues as well as others. We would be pleased to send is to you (or anyone else that would like a copy) at no charge if you will provide your mailing address. It is to large to e-mail. <br /><br />As for backing up, I am sure you have not heard this from anyone who has used the product as backing up has never been an issue. The tabs are not deployed enough at to affect reverse, and you can not back up fast enough to create a problem.<br />The one possible application which we advise against is a twin engine jet (Seadoo)since the reverse gate will blow the water onto the plates. Jet do not back up well in any case.<br /><br />If you have further questions feel free to contact us at 800-233-0194.
 

quantumleap

Master Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Feb 16, 2004
Messages
813
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

I agree wit navigator in trying to run it with no foil first and see how it handles. It sounds like the foil could be causing most of your problem.
 

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Well the big test will be this weekend. I am taking the fin off before we go, so I will just round up 4 or 5 of my fellow boaters and go for a ride and see what happens and go from there.
 

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill,<br /><br />Was the boat slow to react and when it did, did it take a serious turn of the wheel to make a difference other than an ever increasing heal?<br /><br />What this is, is called bow steer. Quite the pant load isn't it. The additional weight in the boat lowered it into the water a bit further and the additional weight up front brought the bow down. The ray fin creates lift aft and therefor exacerbates the problem. Removing the fin will help immediately but you lose the advantages of the the fin in terms of planning out and the like. I have Bennetts on my boat and I can create the same situation, but have the ability to adjust out of it by decreasing the amount of trim on the trim tabs. I have no experience with the smart tabs but others here do and they have a very positive opinion of them. <br /><br />This is a dangerous condition you should be wary of.
 

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Pointer94<br /><br />Yes it was quite the white knuckle event. We like the boat but by are no means attached to it. After our last outing my wife and I went looking for a week straight for another boat - I was ready to send this one down the road after our second weekend out with it. My reaction was "no way - ever again" The first time it did it's leaning trick I could have washed my face in the lake without even leaving my seat.<br /><br />I figured it out real quick and realized the problem was the bow was down to far , because when I trimmed up the motor and the bow rose, it went away - but of course then I couldn't steer. Just never thought about the fin causing it. Must be the newer hull design - my old boat loved the fin and was great to drive.<br /><br />I did call a couple of marinas in the area but they had zero experience with installing trim tabs on a boat my size. I stumbled across this forum by accident and since I hadn't found another boat we wanted to trade for - we decided to take a gamble and spend a little money trying to fix this boat.
 

Bill_Hein

Cadet
Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
20
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Pointer94, is your boat a ski boat? <br /><br />I really like the idea of being able to adjust the tabs and the price doesn't scare me too terribly bad - but I was just afraid that with driving the boat, working the throttle and watching the person on ski's I would be too busy to be trying to adjust trim tabs at the same time. <br /><br />Just curious how much do you have to adjust them in a ski situation - or if thats a "set it and leave it alone" type of thing.<br /><br />Bill
 

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill,<br /><br />Keep the boat! My guess is that it has a slightly exaggerated bow (deeper "v" in the bow area), that runs fairly deep in the water. Great for taking on waves, I am not a speed demon, so I like those design's.<br /><br />The fins come in different sizes and designs and each boat is affected differently, I have a high degree of confidence that removal of this fin will resolve your problem. Another thing you can do short of complete removal, is trim it down from the outside in - with a saw. Reducing the surface area reduces the negative affect. Maybe you can create a balance and get the best of both worlds. I don't have a lot of strong opinions but I personally don't like these bolt on fins.<br /><br />The trim tabs are expensive so I would look to Nauti-john for the smart tab option. They have installed them on bass boats I am sure you can size them up for you.<br /><br />Just two guys talkin' :) <br /><br /><br />My boat is a 25ft cabin cruiser, more like a pocket cruiser. I use the tabs to plane off and then disengage, I may use them on long trips to tailor the boat attitude but too much of a hassel on short jumps. But for skiing you could just leave them engaged in the down position but you will be back into the bow steer condition.<br /><br />The Bennett tabs I have are great! I wouldn't enjoy my boat near as much without them. They also have excellent customer service and have a presense here on the forums. Don't misunderstand me, for what I do the Bennett are better than delivered pizza and sex, but for you, I am not sure.
 

Jdeagro

iboats.com Partner
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
1,682
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Bill;<br /><br />I would agree with Pointer99, it apears that you are bow steering the boat. I do not think you should look for another boat as this problem is correctable. The fin not only lifts the boat more in the stern but it does so from the center of the boat. The added lift at this point creates a teeter totter effect as you are attempting to balance the boat on the keel. Any amount of force on either side will cayse the boat to rotate. A list to port is more likely because of the prop torque.<br /><br />Removing the fiin will help reduce if not eliminate the problem. The added lift for assisting the boat to plane will be noticable, but trim tabs will be much more effective. <br /><br />We define our market as sport boat in the 10' to 22' + range. Your activities and use seems to match. Bennett is a fine coompany with a good product, and I would classify their customers as having destination boats. This is not to indicate that they are not effective on smaller boats as well, but the added controls may be something that you find to be a bit more than you would like to deal with.
 

BillP

Captain
Joined
Aug 10, 2002
Messages
3,290
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

I'm with Boatist on this one. No fixed tab beats fingertip controlled tabs. Nothing against Smarttabs either. Both have their place but only one will give you "right now" adjustability for changing conditions (very real). I'd say most fixed tab (smart or not) users will eventually grow into cockpit controlled tabs.
 

Peter1959628

Petty Officer 3rd Class
Joined
Oct 28, 2003
Messages
91
Re: Smart Tabs vs Trim Tabs

Reversing i cannot say that i notice a difference.<br />If you pull a skier or tube like i do regular then it will make your ride safer,no question.<br />Wished i had them before.
 
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