Surge Disc Brake Bleeding - 2006 244 Funship

[rapa123]

Hi, I don't believe my surge brakes are working properly (or at all). My 2006 FourWinns dual axle trailer came with the Tie Down Engineering surge brake actuator model 125. I don't have any apparent leaks, but I'm going to start by removing all four wheels for inspection and then follow up by bleeding the system. The actuator clunks quite easily upon taking off and stopping. I'd like to add, the brake fluid reservoir is full. I do have the manual for this actuator, but would like to know if anyone has had experience bleeding their disc brakes with this particular actuator/trailer? In addition, if you know of any type of tests I could perform to see if the brakes are indeed working along with any other procedures and/or tips I would sincerely appreciate it. Thanks, Ray

 

[kjsAZ]

The bleeding process is the same for all these set-ups. Best is if you have a power bleeder but it can be done without, just a bit more work. Make sure the reservoir remains filled all the time or you start from scratch. What I recommend/do is to attach a clear hose the the bleed valve of the brake which is "first in line" to the actuator. Open the valve, push the actuator in (a 2x4 comes handy), close valve, pull actuator out. repeat until no more bubbles come out. If you put the end of teh clear hose into a jar you don't have to empty it all the time. Once the first brake assy is done move the clear hose to the next in line brake and do the same there. Not rocket science but time consuming. If you click onto the library link in my signature and look at the trailer upgrades write-up I made I have some pics there on how I did it the first time.

To test the brakes jack up one wheel, push in the actuator with a good lever and check whether the wheel gets held. Much simpler: disconnect the reverse solenoid and try to back up the trailer at a slight incline (trailer upwards). If they work you will feel it........ Just don't connect the trailer plug.....

Are you sure that the real clunk comes from the actuator? Mine came from the HUGE tolerances between the receiver part of the hitch and the ball mount. The actuator is pretty quiet (but I don't have the Tie-down). It is actually not that easy to move it in or out by hand.

 

[bruceb58]

I just bled the brakes on my pontoon trailer that had a tie down coupler with a power bleeder. I actually still had to pump the master cylinder slightly.

I had bad clunking as well. No clunking after bleeding.

 

[tpenfield]

A surge brake system with disc brakes is fairly easy to test. Disconnect the electrical hook-up and try backing up the trailer with the tow vehicle. If the brakes are working, the backing motion of the vehicle should cause the brakes to come on.

It is helpful to do this on a slight down grade, but it can be done effectively on a level area.

 

[rapa123]

Hi, Thanks for your replies...... I will try the back up test and look into a power bleeder. Thanks again, Ray

 

[kjsAZ]

good luck! A power bleeder makes life a lot easier. Make sure that the actuator is pulled fully out when you start.

These database errors I constantly get after the forum software "upgrade" drive me nuts......

 

[rapa123]

Thanks..... I won't push the actuator in...... Any other tips, I never used a power bleeder? Thanks again, ray

 

[four winns 214]

I find it useful to have a second person to open and close bleed valve at the wheel if you're going the "pump the actuator route."

 

[kjsAZ]

Absolutely true! Helps A LOT... But he's going the better way with the power bleeder. Still add the hoses from the bleed valve into a jar as you don't want to spill brake fluid. Don't re-use the brake fluid which comes out there..... Don't put lots of pressure in the system, take it slow (or your time...). It's not complicated and after you did it once you can do it much faster next time. A second person watching for air bubbles in the clear hose is helpful here too....
Make sure to use the same type of brake fluid which is in the system already! It is most likely DOT3 but with disc brakes they could have used DOT4 as it can handle higher temperatures (I always do). Stay away from DOT5 for this application.

And just because it is so important I repeat it: make darn sure that the reservoir doesn't go empty EVER! Otherwise you pump air into the brake lines which you then have to squeeze all the way through to the brakes and out again.

My power bleeder is the same manual pump I use for the tube(s) with an adapter I made to fit the reservoir hole..... It started with what's commonly known as the duct-tape wrap.....

 

[bruceb58]

I use the Motive bleeder. Adapter mp-1102 will fit your trailer's master cylinder.

 

[Starcraft5834]

Hi, Thanks for your replies...... I will try the back up test and look into a power bleeder. Thanks again, Ray

When I tested and bled mine after winter sleep.. used a screw driver in actuator to pump it.. opened the purge bleeder nuts, got the air out,, tightened that down, jacked up the tires, spun em and pumped actuator to make sure they worked, that's what directions said.. dont have to back up on the set up I have

 

[oldjeep]

I use the Motive bleeder. Adapter mp-1102 will fit your trailer's master cylinder.

Me too, although 1130 is the adapter that fits my trailers.

 

[bruceb58]

Me too, although 1130 is the adapter that fits my trailers.

Yeah, mine fits my particular model of Tie Down. Other models may be different and should be verified before ordering.

 

[rapa123]

Great info..... Never bled brake lines.... can't wait to dig in. Thanks again for the help! Ray

 

[rapa123]

Hi, First, Thanks for all the help! I am mechanically inclined, but I never bled brakes before. I do have a pretty good understanding of the basics (I believe).
1) Open bleeder valve 1/2 to a full turn.
2) Press actuator all the way in to push air out.
3) Tighten bleeder valve "before" releasing/moving out actuator.
4) Repeat above until all air/bubbles are gone.
If this is the proper procedure for manually bleeding each brake, would it be the same using the power bleeders you mentioned? Or do I just leave the actuator pulled out during the entire process? Also, do you know the proper part number for the Motive bleeder for my particular actuator?
http://www.tiedown.com/pdf/b771.pdf
Any other tips would be very much appreciated as well. Thanks again!! You folks are great! Ray

 

[oldjeep]

With the power bleeder you just
1) Attach the power bleeder to the master cylinder
2) Pressurize it
3) Open the bleeder farthest from the MC and let the fluid come out until it is a good stream
4) Repeat 3 for each bleeder in your system - working from furthest to closest to the master cylinder.

 

[agallant80]

Here is what I did and it worked pretty well.

Get an extra cap and drill a hole in it
Put the cap on
open a bleader valve
put compressed air in through hole in cap
close bleeder valve
move on to next wheel.


Took me all of about 5 min to do my breaks.

 

[oldjeep]

Here is what I did and it worked pretty well.

Get an extra cap and drill a hole in it
Put the cap on
open a bleader valve
put compressed air in through hole in cap
close bleeder valve
move on to next wheel.


Took me all of about 5 min to do my breaks.

Problem with that method is that you are not keeping the fluid level up. The power bleeder is shooting pressurized brake fluid into the reservoir, not air.

 

[kjsAZ]

But if you carefully watch the level it works just fine. Most of the hobby power bleeders sold are also just air pumps. The ones used for car ABS brakes (or should be used....) are the ones operating with pressurized brake fluid. I do it this way all the time with the difference that I use a manual air pump.

One difference of opinion to the procedure: The bleeding valve closest to the MC should be bled first (also found in my actuators manual), then the next one in line. Starting with the last one could introduce air bubbles into the line again. The chances are very low if you use a power bleeder but for the manual method it is a risk.

 

[rapa123]

Thanks for the great tips.... My manual (http://www.tiedown.com/pdf/b771.pdf) page 1 - #4) states to start with the closest axle and brake first then the other three in line. It does make sense to me due to pushing air away from the master cylinder. I still have a question;
1) Do I just leave the actuator pulled out during the entire process? It appears that I would . I just want to be sure. I totally agree with keeping the line of the bleeder from the brake submerged not to introduce air back into the line.