What to try next?

[heyiou]

Ok 72 Johnson 65 HP model 65ESLR72. Having problems with forward. Disconnected the two wires going to the lower unit and still getting the same thing, it does seem to engage forward but not enough I guess. The prop will spin but there is no difference between low RPM's and higher RPM's, the engine just revs. I beginning to have a gloom feeling about this. What would be the next logical step? Would the lower unit fluid have anything to do with this? Or am I gonna have to check the clutch dog and forward spring? Which does it most sound like?

 

[ezeke]

Re: What to try next?

New prop, try here: web page

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: What to try next?

what size prop are you running.. i had similar prob with my 1972 50horse electric shift... my pitch was waaayy to big, i switched back to a 13 and away i went... i was running a 19 before and that is tooo much hp for those lil motors....<br /><br />just a thought....

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

I've tried another prop, but even with just the earmuffs on I can watch the prop and it never goes really fast. Reverse and neutral work great.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

In a test tank, I can't even tell if its moving at all, if it is it's not kicking up water much more than just the exhaust.

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: What to try next?

take off the prop and THEN try it in the test tank and watch the rpm's.. these are ideas im pulling outa my a$$, but hey, theyre ideas...<br /><br />if you are haveing probs with forward.. with the engine OFF it should be in forward.....automaticaly no matter what <br /><br />could it be a case of the throttle not opening all they way... check your butterflies...

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: What to try next?

check the OHMS on each selenoid... each one should be 6 to 8 ohms.. disconect each wire at the engine and put 1 test lead on a good ground and the other on the wire from the L/U each one , if good, should read 6 - 8 ohms... where is your manual.... these questions are manual questions....

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

yeah well I've been trying to find a manual....someone told me that the seloc manual that goes to 72 doesnt cover the 65HP, but then the next seloc is from 73-to 90 something. I havent seen any other manuals yet.<br /><br />I have a diagram of my lower unit but what do I need to do to get it off the rest of the motor. I've taken four bolts that look like they hold it on. I'm assuming you have to unhook the drive shaft somehow? where is this done?

 

[alcan]

Re: What to try next?

Hi heyiou<br />Did you drain and refill the gear oil in the L/U. Are you using the type C gear oil specified for Electric and electro hydralic shifts? To remove the l/u, you will need to remove six bolts. The four on the sides an two under the cavition plate, one of the two bolts is hidden under the trim tab, So you will have to remove that first. Remember the string on the wires I told you about. Then carefully pull the l/u off. Have someone help feed the wires through the seal in the housing, so they don't snag and break. Removing the l/u is a good idea for inspection and servicing the water pump. But lets do some tests before you open the gear case and dive in.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

Ok, well here's where I'm at. It shifts into reverse and neutral fine which would lead me to think that the solinoids and doing their thing. There is no difference between shifting into forward and disconnecting the blue and green wires -- it is in forward but doesnt seem to be ALL the way in forward, never goes above idle speed on the prop even when engine revs up. I've tried another prop so a slipping hub wouldn't be the problem. What exactly makes this thing go forward? From what I can gather the forward spring pushes the clutch dog forward whenever there is no power to the hydro pump. So my reasoning would be that the clutch dog is worn and is slipping or the spring isn't pushing it into gear enough. Is there something else I should try before thinking this?<br /><br />Thanks for all the replies, sorry for the multi-topics.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

I have not changed the l/u fluid. Does this have anything to do with forward on a hydro-elec?

 

[alcan]

Re: What to try next?

Yes There are a few things to test. The first thing is to answer my questions. Did you drain the gear oil? And did you replace it with the correct type? If so what did the old oil look like?

 

[alcan]

Re: What to try next?

Yes the fluid in these models has a lot to do with how they opperate. They are and electric controled hydrolic deal. Drain the gear the gear oil and lets see what you have. If the oil is milky or sludgey, preform a presure and vacuume test.

 

[alcan]

Re: What to try next?

The next thing to do is E-mail me alcan.fixit2@verizon.net

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

I will change the fluid tomorrow and see what it looks like.

 

[ddaigle]

Re: What to try next?

heyiou, even though my manual didn't cover the powerhead, the hydro e lower units are basicly the same. The only difference is the 72 seems to have the v4 style driveshaft. As I stated before I have taken mine apart numerous times. If the fluid change doesn't help, it really sounds like the piston is sticking as in my lower unit. I believe the 72 is covered in the 73 up manuals because the ignition changed from points to a sensor.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

Yeah I found a diagram of a hydro-e l/u and hopefully it's something simple like the fluid or a sticking piston, thanks for the info about the manual. I'm not really wanting to sink $25+ in a manual that doesn't even cover my engine.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

Ok, I changed the l/u oil. The old oil was dark carmel colored, didn't see any water or metal pieces. Refilled the unit and still same thing with forward. I dont have a way to test vacume or pressure at the moment, so just assuming that it's ok, what's next?

 

[alcan]

Re: What to try next?

Disconnect the battery. Remove the spark plugs. Place a block of wood between the propeller blade and the cavition plate (so the prop will not turn). Wrap a starter rope around the flywheel and gentley try and roll the motor over. You may also use a socket wrench on the flywheel nut instead of the rope. Use common sence here do not apply so much presure as to break something or hurt yourself. Tell us what happens.

 

[heyiou]

Re: What to try next?

I will try that when I get home. One other thing to mention, when the engine is off and I try to turn the prop there is a little play in it when switching directions, ex. moving the prop clock wise and then moving the prop counter-clockwise. I'd say a good 1/4 turn or so. I would assume that this is probably normal but just thought I would throw it out there just in case.