what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

[ziggy]

boat listed below, 72 IL6, 250 cid chevrolt. mercrusier modle 1 drive. the questions???<br /><br />just took it out of winterization today. not to much to it. put the charged batt. back in it. made sure drains were closed. tighted up alt. belt that was loose for winter. turn on stablilized fuel. blower, all gages work, trim works, start up. must a turned at least 5 rev,s and started and died. pumped it bouts 5 5imes prior to 1st start. died once, pumped 3 times. started right upand went to idle at 1k. after warmed up it idled at 600. <br />now the bad news or at least to me questionable news. impeller is 2-3 hours old from last year. new impeller and houseing, new speedy sleeve on lower drive shaft, had wear at lower oil seal in upper. do i need to R&R it for the new season(the impeller that is)? at start up, no overheat. temp gauge is oem merc. green and red. came to normal resting place and stayed there. no tune up done. done late last fall when impeller was replaced. no parts in ign. replace. timeing and dwell checked though. <br />more bad news. aint checked, yet. this year. last fall, #1 was 60psi. #2 maybe a 100psi. rest in spec. best 140 in #6. new riser and manifold last midseason. no carb. rebuild. speculation is to do a air leak down test. motor has overheated at least 2 times previously that are known of. maybe 3 times. possibaly major the time that it didn't happen to me and the story i heard about it. <br /><br />drive. only holds 6-8 or so psi at last check, last fall. vacum test maybe held i can't remember. but bet it was low. 2-4 psi at max. i have no water contamination at this point in the drive. have checked it twice last fall within ten hours. no metal in oil. replace oil in drive last fall, it's new...<br />now, what would you do if ya were in my shoes. i want to go boatin asap. of corse. but i'd rather do the maint. if i need to first if that's the consenses here. <br /><br /><br />and lastly, my guess. i need to do that leak down test. guessin i will find at least a head gasket leak between 1 & 2. maybe fix the low compression with a head gasket if i'm lucky. any other opions as to what to do? drive it, repair it before it breaks real noticably(catastrophicly). the drive. i''m darn near thinkin a sei. don't want to, but reckon i can get up to 1200 fast at the dealer.<br /><br />lastly. i aint pulled the drive yet. been procrastinatein bouts gettin a alignment bar. it's the next thing on my list of things to waste money on toys for and will be done asap checkin for gimble brg roughness and bellows leaks, drive shaft and shift cable. and coupler alinement when i break down and spend the bread. sucks being a poor boater...<br /><br /><br />so, whew, any opionions on which way to turn....fix now or fix later.....guess the marine mech in me says now or be hosed on the river headin for a dike made out of boulders.....<br />ps. any questionalble writing in the question is due to miller brewin comapany......if i need to clarify let me know..... i just want a hip, old reliablabe boat......<br /><br />last note. had the jetski on the ramp today. got rained out prior to putin in....what a bummer.... i'm ready to go boatin anyways. i got a convertable top on it...

 

[Don S]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

Mechanical things do not heal, nor do they get better and have a sudden cure. They only get worse and more expensive.

 

[ziggy]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

i know yer right don s.....

 

[Bondo]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

Hi Ziggy,..........<br /><br />While I Agree with Don,.......<br /><br />Here's Another way to look at Your Problems,..???...<br /><br />For the Drive,...... A Mod.1 is a $300./$600. drive,.... I've bought a few on ebay for $300. or Less,+ then drop a Gasket/Seal kit into it,... That's another $100/$200. for parts,+ Labor.....<br />Your's will run Considerably Higher.....Just with it's Known Issues.... The aftermarket Drives are Cheap,...... <br /><br />I'd think about Running Yours,... Checking the oil, Every Single Time Out,....<br />If you start saving your pennies Now,.... The old drive Just Might live long enough to get you thru the year........And, You'd have the funds to buy a New 1 later.....<br />'Cause I Agree,... Your drive Probaly Isn't Worth Rebuilding,.... A Shaft or 2 for the old drive would pay for a Brand New 1........<br /><br />Your Engine,...... Is No Doubt Tired,...And it Ain't a Headgasket,... <br />If it was Blown between #1,+ #2,... the Compression would be 0psi on Both of those cylinders.....<br />I'd Guess it's Cooked Rings,.... Or Worse....<br />Those old 250cid Chevy motors are a Dime a Dozen,....'ell,... I was recently Given a Complete Driveline Exactly like your's,.. Condition Unknown at this point, but was told it was Running Last Year....All I gotta do is chainsaw it out of the old hull....<br /> <br />Find a Rebuildable Core motor,+ Start Rebuilding it.......<br />I can see where the present motor could be Nursed,+ Milked to get you by for awhile,..... Hopefully,.. Long enough to get another block Rebuilt......<br /><br />With That scenario,........<br /><br />You'd be Boating This Year,.........<br />And,.... Be boating Next Year with a Brand New Boat............<br /><br />Btw,.... Reguardless of Which Way you Go,......<br />An Alignment Bar is a Must Have Tool.................

 

[ziggy]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

thanks bondo. <br />i guess heres the way i will approch it. to start with i aint rich so i will need to go the most reasonalble route. i like the idea of finding a spare engine and doin it up and have it ready to drop in. but. i neglected to say a few things about the motor. don't know if it will make any difference in anyones opinion of what i got though. my best knowledge of this motor is that it was rebuilt, replaced, unknown, in 1998. at least the bill of sale has many internal parts as being replaced. what confuses me is that the engine appears to be out of a truck. non mercrusier, at least no oem serial #tag above the starter anyways. i know Dad(rip) overheated it good when the feed hose to the t-stat fell off and he thought he could make it back the cabin anyways, the steam, smoke i don't know, finally overwhelmed him enough to look. and put the hose back on. my guess is it got pretty hot. i wasn't there. i personally overheated it once, last year at spring startup. got to the red on the oem gauge. don't know how hot it got. i got the overheat problem under control now. now this engine runs just fine, i don't know why. if i wouldnt have put a compression gage ontoit i'd never have known that its not a happy camper. did a compression check again yesterday. cold engine, got <br />1-90<br />2-90<br />3-135<br />4-135<br />5-135<br />6-150<br />then warmed it up to normal operatin temp. and got<br />1-90<br />2-100<br />3-140<br />4-140<br />5-140<br />6-145<br />from the over heat and reading i'm geussin heat softend rings but want to confirm as i suppose it could be a headgasket too. i want to find out before i take it apart.<br />did a half way air leak down test too. not sure i did it right and am gonna try again with the valve cover off so i am sure i'm on tdc. as for what i got from what i did. brought #1 to tdc. injected 30psi into cyl. and listened. with a hearing hose, the only sound, was out the dipstick tube. not carb, not exhust, not oil fill on valve cover. got dark so didnt do #2 cyl. pluse i decided i was gonna have a drag finding #2 tdc. think i'll remove the valve cover so i can see both valves close and try again soon. #1 and #2. am also thinking that i need to rotate the crank 480* from tdc at #1 to get tdc #2. i guess i've read 2 different values for injecting air. around 30 psi, and around 100 psi. anybody know which way to go. so far i've only done 30psi but don't know if that's enough air. oh, i also didn't here air at #2, . i guess this is the only way i will be able to tell if i'm leaking into #2 since i don't have a heat exchanger to take the cap off of and see if i get any air bubbles......as for the drive. i guess it kinda depends on how the engine goes as to how much bread i got left. i am running the drive as you state right now bondo. checking the oil and replaceing often, but that gets to be a drag. only good thing i can see happening is that if i have to pull an engine at least i can go perhaps fix my leaky reverse lock valve.....am i goin the right direction? any comments on air leak down tests... i guess at this point i don't think i need a leak down tester, as i think that if i find where the air leaks out of i should be led in the direction of the repair nessasry.....thanks for the comments....<br /><br /><br />"If it was Blown between #1,+ #2,... the Compression would be 0psi on Both of those cylinders...." is this always the case when the headgasket is blown?

 

[ziggy]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

ok, did my air leak down test again. this time with the valve cover off. i know i was at tdc #1. both pushrods loose. no air at carb, no air at exhust, mild air at the holes in the head. air was noted at #2 sparkplug hole. enough air to feel with yer ear out of a hearing hose. rotated crank bouts 480*, bringing #2 to tdcc. both push rods loose. same story, no air at carb, no air at exhust. possible air thru head holes. major air comeing out of #1 sparkplug hole. <br />have it got it under control. other than bondos statement about if the headgasket is blown, i'd have 0 psi on a compression test. i'd say i got a headgasket in need of replacement. <br />what else can i say about it. oil sqirts on the compression test did not raise compression values, much. a little, perhaps, 5-10psi. also under compression test, compression bilt up pretty fast. started at bouts 60 the first rev. then almost to 90 then stopped building at 90. for cyl.s 1 & 2 that is....is it time to stop diagnoising and start in on some repair. like a headgasket, i hope?

 

[Bondo]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

It appears You're Right.......<br /><br />There must be enough over lap between the cylinders that allows Some compression to build........<br /><br />Pull the Head,+ Have a Look.........

 

[ziggy]

Re: what would you do? il6, merc model1 (too long)

thanks for the vote of confidence bondo. <br />i agree, time to go have a look see....